Author Topic: SSPX announcement? (Read 4759 times)

Marlelar · « **on:** December 08, 2015, 09:01:49 AM »

It is currently 4 pm in Menzingen. Where is the much anticipated announcement?

TKGS · « **Reply #1 on:** December 08, 2015, 10:18:31 AM »

Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

Matthew · « **Reply #2 on:** December 08, 2015, 10:20:51 AM »

Patricius?

Maria Auxiliadora · « **Reply #3 on:** December 08, 2015, 11:16:51 AM »

Quote from: TKGS

Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.

covet truth · « **Reply #4 on:** December 08, 2015, 11:17:16 AM »

I expect when it happens any announcement will come from the Vatican.

Marlelar · « **Reply #5 on:** December 08, 2015, 11:26:48 AM »

Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora

Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.

I too think they are looking for a deal with Rome, I just get extremely irritated by rumor mongers. I will not be surprised if/when a deal is made, just very,very, disappointed.

TKGS · « **Reply #6 on:** December 08, 2015, 11:55:11 AM »

Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora

Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.

So, are you saying that you believe that there was every intention on the part of the SSPX to make the reconciliation announcement on December 8th, but the rumor appearing on CathInfo (which is the only place I saw it) made them reconsider making the announcement today?

Pilar · « **Reply #7 on:** December 08, 2015, 12:26:05 PM »

Quote from: TKGS

Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.

So, are you saying that you believe that there was every intention on the part of the SSPX to make the reconciliation announcement on December 8th, but the rumor appearing on CathInfo (which is the only place I saw it) made them reconsider making the announcement today?

Good point. Does anyone here consider the real possibility that if reconciliation is not God's will it is Our Lady that is preventing this mistake? Are we all not praying for the Society...with confidence?

CWA · « **Reply #8 on:** December 08, 2015, 01:04:42 PM »

Quote from: TKGS

Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

Quote from: Pilar

Good point. Does anyone here consider the real possibility that if reconciliation is not God's will it is Our Lady that is preventing this mistake? Are we all not praying for the Society...with confidence?

Yes, good point Pilar.

If people will notice, what Patricius vouched for in his "not a rumor" thread was that both priests (the N.O. priest who heard it from Bp. S, and the Resistance priest to whom he relayed it) are trustworthy and serious. But he also allowed for the possibility (see bold below:)

Quote from: Patricius

But, as I said before, I know these two priests very well, and I can assure you that what I presented last Thursday are true facts. Bishop Schneider said these things as being true facts. But I cannot, of course, guarantee that what he said will happen. Maybe bishop Schneider has been misled, or has been trying to mislead us (he had to know a leak was bound to happen...). I cannot say. Or something happened between July and now which the bishop is not aware of. Once again, I cannot say.

I just thought I would reveal this to the cathInfo people, and ask for prayers for the Society. That is all there is to it.

And lastly, as with any "rumor" of this type, the fact that it doesn't materialize doesn't mean the facts relayed weren't true, but could mean that prayers were answered. And if anyone took note, in his OP, Patricius asked for prayers, essentially asking that it not come to fruition:

Quote from: Patricius

Now, it is possible that a last minute glitch (our prayers?) will scrap the July agreement before it is publicized on Dec. 8th. But Bishop Schneider really said these things at a diocesan priests meeting, and he was not making a supposition or spreading a rumor. He was speaking from first hand knowledge....
Let us pray for a glitch to come, like in June 2012. We do not want the death of the Society.

I can just imagine if some people today were living in Nineve, and Jonas cried: "Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed." And the Ninevites put on sackcloth and ashes, and the city is not destroyed, and some Ninevites get on the internet and say, "ah, this was just another rumor!"

Not saying they are exact parallels, but just pointing out that no "agreement" today is in no way proof that anything Patricius said was untrue; it may just be that plans changed, or Bp. S was wrong, or many possibilities.

HiddenServant · « **Reply #9 on:** December 08, 2015, 01:05:09 PM »

We need to be steadfast and strong in our faith,
Pray that those in need and weakened convert ,
pray that we do not fall in to temptation and keep
the true faith daily with our Holy Roaary and Brown
Scapular. The light is dimming we have to hold out,
or many will perish in a horrible way.

clarkaim · « **Reply #10 on:** December 08, 2015, 01:54:31 PM »

I can just imagine if some people today were living in Nineve, and Jonas cried: "Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed." And the Ninevites put on sackcloth and ashes, and the city is not destroyed, and some Ninevites get on the internet and say, "ah, this was just another rumor!"

I saw that thread onj another board, what is up in Nineveh I wonder?

I'm joking, in case any goofs think I'm serious.

Maria Auxiliadora · « **Reply #11 on:** December 08, 2015, 02:48:02 PM »

Quote from: TKGS

Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.

So, are you saying that you believe that there was every intention on the part of the SSPX to make the reconciliation announcement on December 8th, but the rumor appearing on CathInfo (which is the only place I saw it) made them reconsider making the announcement today?

Maybe(?) Could also have been postponed by the plane interview and the latest insult to “fundamentalist” Catholics who believe in “absolute Truth” by Francis. That should have been a clear warning to the SSPX. Unfortunately, I don’t think that would stop the SSPX plans, only delay them. It’s unbelievable that with all the scandalous interviews and statements by Francis they are still eager to go to Rome and put themselves under their authority. We know they want that from their own mouth (Fr. Wegner, Pflugger, etc.) So, it's a matter of time.

Stubborn · « **Reply #12 on:** December 08, 2015, 03:17:30 PM »

So it didn't or it won't happen today for whatever reason - the SSPX is still on the same path it's been on so it's just a matter of when. There is still hope they will wake up - that's the way I look at it.

StonewallCatho · « **Reply #13 on:** December 08, 2015, 05:54:50 PM »

Quote from: CWA

And lastly, as with any "rumor" of this type, the fact that it doesn't materialize doesn't mean the facts relayed weren't true, but could mean that prayers were answered. And if anyone took note, in his OP, Patricius asked for prayers, essentially asking that it not come to fruition:

Quote from: Patricius
Now, it is possible that a last minute glitch (our prayers?) will scrap the July agreement before it is publicized on Dec. 8th. But Bishop Schneider really said these things at a diocesan priests meeting, and he was not making a supposition or spreading a rumor. He was speaking from first hand knowledge....
Let us pray for a glitch to come, like in June 2012. We do not want the death of the Society.

I can just imagine if some people today were living in Nineve, and Jonas cried: "Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed." And the Ninevites put on sackcloth and ashes, and the city is not destroyed, and some Ninevites get on the internet and say, "ah, this was just another rumor!"

Not saying they are exact parallels, but just pointing out that no "agreement" today is in no way proof that anything Patricius said was untrue; it may just be that plans changed, or Bp. S was wrong, or many possibilities.

I agree with you, CWA. Thank you for clarifying things.

I can see you have carefully read what I wrote. This becomes rarer and rarer by the day, because of the avalanche of news in all forms. People nowadays tend to read only the headlines.

So there was no announcement today. It doesn't mean that the July 2015 deal was not signed. It might just mean the powers that be decided to wait longer before to make it public, and they didn't tell Bishop Schneider. Maybe our prayers were successful and the deal was scrapped or is back to the drawing board. Maybe Bishop Schneider's revelation to the priests was meant to be a "feeler", to see what would be the reactions. Only God knows...

By the way, this bishop also told the priests that all the bishops and cardinals who visited the SSPX seminaries have been favorably impressed, and have given laudatory reports to the Pope. And remember that the bishop said that the Pope and Bishop Fellay accepted to sign in July, on the basis that both recognized that not all VII docuмents have the same doctrinal value, and that there was therefore room to discuss "problems" after an official recognition. Now, for those who follow what happens out there, you will recognize that this assertion corresponds perfectly to what Menzingen has said many times and also to Francis' "pragmatic" attitude, as opposed to BVI's more doctrinal bend.

God bless.

Matthew · « **Reply #14 on:** December 08, 2015, 07:27:06 PM »

Someone wrote in, with some good thoughts on this matter:

Quote

Imagine if Jonas were alive today, or the internet existed back then. And he posted on CI, ""Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed." And then people did penance, and it wasn't destroyed. Not only would some cry "another unfounded rumor!", but one could ask, was it a good idea to post the prediction online? Well, yes, if it was the vehicle of communication to spur people on to pray. Or, to show the powers that be in the Vatican & Menzingen that people are still paying attention and it matters to many.

So why do we have this rumors-of-a-deal-but-then-no-deal cycle for many years now?

- Something changed in the plans after Bp. S told his priests this info
- There was poor communication between parties (Novus Ordo, SSPX etc) which led to Bp. S's info being inaccurate
- "Rumors" of this type are put out deliberately by the factions trying to make the deal happen, to float as a way to 'test the waters' - they look at the reaction among the Faithful and priests, to gauge whether to go ahead with the deal
(not saying Patricius did this, but in this case Bp. S puts it out, knowing it will leak, etc.)
- This is all part of a psy-ops plan by the Vatican and Menzingen for many years now, to get people fixated on "deal" vs. "no deal", and while we all have our eyes on the "deal/no deal" ball, we don't notice the SSPX going liberal all the while, making the formal deal less important (because the SSPX has already been neutralized - the chief downside of such a "deal")

I would like to add -- by releasing a "rumor" like this and making sure it doesn't come true, it takes away from the credibility of various sources (patricius, Bishop Schneider, CathInfo, etc.) and it becomes "the boy who cried wolf".