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Author Topic: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix  (Read 6813 times)

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Offline Town Crier

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Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2017, 12:02:17 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marlelar on October 18, 2017, 11:31:16 AM
    I'm at OLS myself.  If there are enough Spanish speakers to need a sermon in Spanish then there should be a separate Latin/Spanish Mass.  Bi-lingual Mass short-changes both groups because we get sermonettes.

    I plan to mention this to Fr. Stafki, I hope others will also.  But he'll probably just say that it is only once a month so the sacrifice is worth it to draw in Spanish speakers.
    Of course he will . The primary goal is growth forsaking all other. dress and comportment were relaxed all the while saying "they will acclimate" , well they haven't .Take a drive one Sunday past St. Catherine of Siena Catholic church after Mass that is our Future . 
    What angers me the most though is instead of adding a Spanish/Latin Mass they took the only High Mass of the week just like they took from us the window funds ,statuary and other things 
    They told us the windows were coming that they were sorry they misappropriated the funds but SOON they would be here as they replaced the window fund and just as soon as the subject died down they spent 6.000 dollars on choir books for the pews that is the modus operandi on all things .Mark-my-words that Mass is here to stay 
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    Offline MaterDominici

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #16 on: October 18, 2017, 04:14:14 PM »
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    • Quote from: Cato on October 17, 2017, 09:23:58 PM
    To clarify, when I wrote Mexican, I didn't mean Mexican Americans - I meant Mexicans who are new to the USA.  
    As was I. First or maybe second generation.
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    Offline Marlelar

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #17 on: October 18, 2017, 04:57:24 PM »
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    • Quote from: Town Crier on October 18, 2017, 12:02:17 PM
    Of course he will . The primary goal is growth forsaking all other. dress and comportment were relaxed all the while saying "they will acclimate" , well they haven't .Take a drive one Sunday past St. Catherine of Siena Catholic church after Mass that is our Future .
    What angers me the most though is instead of adding a Spanish/Latin Mass they took the only High Mass of the week just like they took from us the window funds ,statuary and other things
    They told us the windows were coming that they were sorry they misappropriated the funds but SOON they would be here as they replaced the window fund and just as soon as the subject died down they spent 6.000 dollars on choir books for the pews that is the modus operandi on all things .Mark-my-words that Mass is here to stay
    Please let Father Stafki know of your concerns, it may not make a difference in the short term but I think the rank and file priests need to know how their congregation views changes that are made.  And when attendance drops at least they will know why.  And perhaps they will bring these concerns to management during a priests meeting.
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    Offline Maria Regina

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #18 on: October 18, 2017, 05:07:45 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marlelar on October 18, 2017, 04:57:24 PM
    Please let Father Stafki know of your concerns, it may not make a difference in the short term but I think the rank and file priests need to know how their congregation views changes that are made.  And when attendance drops at least they will know why.  And perhaps they will bring these concerns to management during a priests meeting.
    If the church demographics change drastically, then maybe, just maybe, the SSPX will sell the church and pocket the money to buy more ancient cathedrals in Europe.  After all, real estate prices in Arizona are on the upswing.
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    Offline Marlelar

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #19 on: October 18, 2017, 05:27:59 PM »
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    • Or turn it over to the local bishop if the Society makes a deal with Rome.

    I think we must pray very much and very often for the SSPX to make a course correction which will steer it away from running aground in Rome.
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    Offline Maria Regina

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #20 on: October 18, 2017, 05:38:54 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marlelar on October 18, 2017, 05:27:59 PM
    Or turn it over to the local bishop if the Society makes a deal with Rome.

    I think we must pray very much and very often for the SSPX to make a course correction which will steer it away from running aground in Rome.
    Rome must be salivating at all the riches they can inherit from SSPX. It would be a virtual gold mine at the expense of the laity.
    Oh, yes, the local bishop would love this new parish. It could be sold for well over a million and be used to settle some of the sex crime settlements.

    Spare us O Lord.
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    Offline Town Crier

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #21 on: October 20, 2017, 02:18:31 PM »
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    • I think everyone who attends Our lady of Sorrows should expect this matter addressed from the pulpit.Without a doubt it will be
    not about how they again took from us as though we are insignificant . Oh no we will be vilified as
    unappreciative racists We will be told we are disobedient & uncatholic backbiters. They will justify their actions the way they
    always do By putting back on us
    To wit: "If the pledges promised were payed we could have finished the church and replaced the stolen window fund it is
    all your fault" or " we dont have qualified licensed teachers or religious sisters at the school because you demand
    lower tuition costs every year it is all your fault"
    Even though they ask for it 
    .the fact is the only opinion they value or want for that matter are the ones that concur with their own
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    Offline Marlelar

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #22 on: October 20, 2017, 06:40:36 PM »
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    • You may be right.   They certainly do not have a history of responding to concerns of parishioners.

    p.s.  I think tuition is ridiculously high, how do families afford it?
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    Offline poche

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #23 on: October 21, 2017, 02:21:32 AM »
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    • Quote from: Moorslayer on October 17, 2017, 10:34:17 AM
    This is a huge concern.

    The Catechism of the Catholic Church states that immigrants must respect the material heritage of the country.
    If they're legal they need to learn English,
    if they're illegal(the vast majority of exclusively Spanish speakers in the US) then they're committing a mortal sin by breaking a secular law.

    Enabling and pandering to criminals who are in mortal sin, is wrong.
    Multiculturalism is liberalism and condemned by the SSPX themselves:
    http://archives.sspx.org/against_sound_bites/multiculturalism.htm

    Having a bilingual mass is the definition of multiculturalism.
    There is a Spanish Latin Mass right down the street at St. Catherine of Sienna... Send them there...
    This will usher in a demographic shift that will completely replace and displace our current congregation.
    The Spanish mass will bring in tons of illegals who will then bring their bilingual anchor babies who will start attending the English mass.
    White parishioners will gradually feel uncomfortable and unwelcome in their own parish as the (generally-speaking) Air-Jordan wearing immodest impious ghetto South Phoenix Hispanic crowd moseys their way in because "yo the Latin mass be badass essay!"

    Few are willing to voice these concerns, but the vast majority of parishioners will feel this way whether they admit it to themselves or not.
    White Flight is a phenomenon for a reason, because people don't want to live around trashy crime-ridden neigborhoods.
    This would be essentially equivalent to starting a homeless ministry passing out free food and goodies to homeless who come attend Latin mass.
    It's unjust and unfair to significantly permanently impact the demographics of the parish.

    Daily reminder: Yes we're required to love everyone, not hate anyone, and have a bond with all Catholics, but that doesn't meant we have to roll out the red carpet to invite the 3rd world into our homes and Churches.
    We have a right according to natural law to an identity as a people, and to exclude immigrants who do not conform to our national interests.
    It is the conservative right-wing position to limit immigration and SSPX beginning to pander to liberal progressive multiculturalism is deeply troubling.
    An important part of the patrimony of the southwestern part of the United States is Spanish speaking. The Catholic Faith was brought to that region by Spanish speaking priests long before the United States ever existed.    
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    Offline Marlelar

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #24 on: October 21, 2017, 03:53:04 AM »
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    • True, but those priests had the TRUE faith.  Today the descendants of Spanish settlers are 99.9999% a-swinging and a-swaying in NO buildings.  Just like those of northern european descent.

    We have very few parishioners of Spanish descent although we have been getting more lookey-loos of late.  Visually surveying the demographics I would hazard there are less than a handful of non-English speakers, but that is only a guess on my part as I have not seen any statistics published by the church on our demographics.

    I would hate to think that OLS is being racially biased by targeting the Spanish speaking community for conversion and ignoring those of northern european descent who also need to know the true faith, but if they are then it will take more than a 5 minute sermonette once a month to accomplish their goal.

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    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #25 on: October 21, 2017, 04:18:30 AM »
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    • There is nothing wrong with having the sermon in both English and Spanish.  The Latin Mass makes it one.  Having separate Latin Mass for only Spanish would be novus ordo and not Catholic.  
    The 4 Marks of the Church is one , Holy Catholic and apostolic.  These people should be taught the Catholic faith.   
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    Offline Town Crier

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #26 on: October 21, 2017, 09:08:34 AM »
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    • Quote from: Viva Cristo Rey on October 21, 2017, 04:18:30 AM
     Having separate Latin Mass for only Spanish would be novus ordo and not Catholic.  
      
    Is that so ? So the Spanish/Latin Mass said in Mexico is N.O and not Catholic ? Oh! maybe you mean when they have 2 separate Masses for 2 separate languages/cultures LIKE IN QUEBEC it invalidates one ?
    What I think you are saying and I hope i am wrong is a Latin Mass in Spanish would be "not Catholic" because of the language and that I hope you are aware is racist
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #27 on: October 21, 2017, 09:39:52 AM »
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    • Quote from: Town Crier on October 21, 2017, 09:08:34 AM
    Is that so ? So the Spanish/Latin Mass said in Mexico is N.O and not Catholic ? Oh! maybe you mean when they have 2 separate Masses for 2 separate languages/cultures LIKE IN QUEBEC it invalidates one ?
    What I think you are saying and I hope i am wrong is a Latin Mass in Spanish would be "not Catholic" because of the language and that I hope you are aware is racist

    I read a book on Bp. Alemany, the first Bishop of Monterey, CA, (1850).
    He was originally from Catalonia, Spain a Domnican, US Missionary, elevated, by Pope Pius IX.
    Mexico had just seded California to the US and the gold rush had turned San Francisco into an international, "little Babylon".

    I noticed that on Sunday's in San Francisco, at St. Francis Church, they would have (3) Masses, English, Spanish and French.  So, the Diocese was catering to the respective languages, just for the sermons.

    But this is not the case for the SSPX in Phoenix.
    There's a cold war going on and this appears one way to show the unappreciative regulars... "who's boss?".
    It may also be part of a long range marketing plan to change the chapel's demographics?  
    I wouldn't put it past the German PR genius, Fr. Wegner.

    Phoenix may be the best SSPX priory example, where the Society is running a Novus ordo-style parish battle for the hearts & minds of the faithful.  Thanks to those remnant faithful who are keeping us abreast of the fight.
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    Offline Town Crier

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #28 on: October 26, 2017, 05:08:16 PM »
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    • Without this forum I am AFRAID of what our church would be like today 
    certainly it is not perfect ,not even close. 
    They still refuse to do anything about the barren & stark N.O interior until we pay off the dept.

    Oh well at least we have the Mass  :facepalm:

    Rumor has it there was a wedding 10/21/17 .It was extremely liberal in all aspects. 
    The ceremony ,the adherence and deportment of the guests and their conduct on church grounds
    It is only a hunch but could the fact that the vast majority of the guests where N.O Hispanic have anything to do with our not hearing a word on this ? Fear of being labeled ? 

    Regardless of who or what a person is problems should be brought to light    
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    Offline Maria Regina

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    Re: Spanish sermons at SSPX Phoenix
    « Reply #29 on: October 26, 2017, 07:30:01 PM »
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    • Quote from: Town Crier on October 26, 2017, 05:08:16 PM
    Without this forum I am AFRAID of what our church would be like today
    certainly it is not perfect ,not even close.
    They still refuse to do anything about the barren & stark N.O interior until we pay off the dept.

    Oh well at least we have the Mass  :facepalm:

    Rumor has it there was a wedding 10/21/17 .It was extremely liberal in all aspects.
    The ceremony ,the adherence and deportment of the guests and their conduct on church grounds
    It is only a hunch but could the fact that the vast majority of the guests where N.O Hispanic have anything to do with our not hearing a word on this ? Fear of being labeled ?

    Regardless of who or what a person is problems should be brought to light    
    Lord have mercy. No doubt, when the debt is paid off, the church will be sold.

    It is really sad that bishops must continue to hold title to church properties, especially in these latter days of deception.
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    Lord have mercy.
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