Why so many controversies? Pablo? Father Pfeiffer fight.  Pablo vs Matthew. This is making me seriously think to stay in the SSPX. Its not helping my spiritual life. I've been seriously considering resistance for so long . well I'm staying in the sspx. I need to get to heaven. I intend to remain on this site but I will stay away from resistance.

First, I wrote a post that practically has your name all over it!
http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/It-Takes-Two-to-Tango-NOT


There's quite a bit of controversy in the Conciliar Church as well. And the SSPX is heading back there. Isn't that a problem?

All you mention is Boston, KY. See my thread which mentions all the Resistance priests that have nothing to do with Boston, KY. We're talking about (2) priests here, out of the whole group.

http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Resistance-in-the-USA-reality-check

You are over-simplifying by saying "Pablo vs. Matthew". Matthew is only representing the true position in this case, that's why I'm being "opposed" by Pablo. I'm not in-fighting, causing strife, divisions, controversy, or anything like that. It also has nothing at all to do with personalities. I'm just a representative of the traditional Catholic position.

Remember, just by keeping the faith you are automatically controversial -- to all those who embrace the new Conciliar religion, those who follow pleasure, the maxims of the world, etc. It is in this sense ONLY that I am "involved" in the controversy. We should all be thus involved!

So you have to distinguish SECTARIANISM (needless squabbling, strife and divisions) and FORTITUDE (standing against all opposition for God and the truth)

If a drunk driver plows into you at a red light, do you think it's just to say, "Oh, you should be more careful. I have never been in an accident. I think if you're careful, you'll never be involved in an accident, like all these people who speed and play around on their cell phones..."

Wouldn't you be upset in that case? I just threw you in with all the people who were careless and got into accidents by their own fault. But how can a person, however good and careful, avoid "getting involved in" accidents that were completely not his fault?

Think about it.

Iman:

I've been seriously considering resistance for so long . well I'm staying in the sspx. I need to get to heaven. I intend to remain on this site but I will stay away from resistance.

One can reasonably assume that you were "seriously considering resistance," because you were troubled by what is going on in sspx.  But now, for the sake of needing to "get to heaven," you will stay with sspx.  Interesting!  I don't know quite what to make of your comments.

You are worried that

Pablo is a bad influence and no one is doing anything about it. In fact two Priests are silent.

These Priests asked SSPX to be Catholic but how can Fr Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko be Catholic if they are working with people that is unstable? Why this person is more important than True Catholic Doctrine?

Why is difficult to follow this simple rule:

--IF you are a Priest and your friend is doing bad things, stay away from him until he seeks you to convert.
Why?
-- Because people that receive the Body Of Christ from your hands believes that your hands are not dirty. They trust that you follow the Catholic teaching.

How hard is that? Is that too much to ask?

In any case I may be wrong about Pablo but people are telling that at least he did very bad things WHILE IN THE SEMINARY. Which is absurd!!! If a priest allow such a person to be in contact with seminarians, why would you trust this priest?

IF they have some common sense they should think about closing the Seminary for some period because the Ambrose case. They showed they are incapable of running a good and healthy community.

Believe me, we have all been asking these same questions over a long period of time.  It [The Boston, KY operation] has been a futile endeavor.  The only answer to the problem is to walk away from them [Fr. Pfeiffer's operation] and never look back.

MOD EDIT: Covet Truth is referring to the Boston, KY operation only. I know that this person supports other priests of the resistance, and in a major way.

Quote from: welffn

You are worried that

Pablo is a bad influence and no one is doing anything about it. In fact two Priests are silent.

These Priests asked SSPX to be Catholic but how can Fr Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko be Catholic if they are working with people that is unstable? Why this person is more important than True Catholic Doctrine?

Why is difficult to follow this simple rule:

--IF you are a Priest and your friend is doing bad things, stay away from him until he seeks you to convert.
Why?
-- Because people that receive the Body Of Christ from your hands believes that your hands are not dirty. They trust that you follow the Catholic teaching.

How hard is that? Is that too much to ask?

In any case I may be wrong about Pablo but people are telling that at least he did very bad things WHILE IN THE SEMINARY. Which is absurd!!! If a priest allow such a person to be in contact with seminarians, why would you trust this priest?

IF they have some common sense they should think about closing the Seminary for some period because the Ambrose case. They showed they are incapable of running a good and healthy community.

Believe me, we have all been asking these same questions over a long period of time.  It has been a futile endeavor.  The only answer to the problem is to walk away from them and never look back.

Before walk away from them, there's couple of things

1) Them including Fr Chazal? or only Fr. Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko
2) Other Priests in USA in the Resistence have good Bishops to look for them?
3) Have you guys tried to contact Fr. Hewko directly saying:
-- I believe Pablo is involved with bad things and he's been in contact with the Chapel and in the Seminary. Do you agree that he shouldn't be there?
If Fr. Hewko says yes one should ask:
-- Then from now on if you don't cut relations with him and Fr. Pfeiffer we shall never contact with you again and denounce your behaviour

It's not that hard to get a simple answer from Fr. Hewko and Fr. Pfeiffer.  I'd question myself if I had their emails.

P.S: The Priests may disagree that Pablo is a bad influence. In such case they should prove that Pablo is doing nothing wrong and is a good Catholic volunteer. THEY MUST tell the truth, they have to or they are no Priest at all.

I think the Resistance is turning cultish with all this infighting its not helping my spiritual life.

Quote from: jman123

I think the Resistance is turning cultish with all this infighting its not helping my spiritual life.

You do no service to the truth or to your own spiritual life by broadly painting with a 1 foot-wide paintbrush, throwing the baby out with the bathwater, and mixing up the innocent with the guilty.

Group punishment and "guilt by association" are not Catholic concepts. Neither is frustration and losing your head in a crisis. God gave us brains so we could determine WHO is at fault in a given situation, and to what degree.

So you're saying that everyone's equally guilty, huh. They all just decided to do some good-ol' infightin'. Best avoid that whole group?

That sounds too much like the modern world to me -- everyone's the same, everyone has to be equal, truth can't be determined anyhow, everything is relative, etc. Which is all -- need I point out -- inimical to God and the truth.

The truth is that most priests in the Resistance are being perfectly Catholic, and ONE SMALL group is being a cult and attacking those it shouldn't.

You can't just throw around the word "cult" or it won't mean anything. Can you be more specific? Honestly now, how is Fr. Girouard being a cult? How about Fr. Zendejas and Fr. Garcia? How about any Resistance priest (there are 8 of them in the US who don't work with the Boston, KY group) I work with Fr. Zendejas and Fr. Garcia every week; I assure you there is nothing at all that could be pointed to as cult-like behavior from them. Much less a string of data points with a valid conclusion "they're a cult".

I am much more involved than you in the Resistance, and I assure you that everyone is NOT equally "dishing out and receiving", however it appears to you on the outside. "Receiving" attacks better not be a crime, as it certainly can't be helped (as I mentioned in my analogy above. PLEASE read those posts if you're honestly interested in finding and possessing the truth.)

Did you read my posts (above)? The one about "It takes Two to Tango -- Not"? It was written for your benefit.

You seem to have absorbed precisely zero since this morning. I'm trying to help you here.

TL;DR - It doesn't matter what it "seems" like. You need to look into it more deeply than a quick scan of the headlines. It all depends on your own love and zeal for the truth. If you want to reject the truth or fail to look for the truth (out of frustration, laziness, etc.), nobody can stop you. We all have free will.

   I have longtime friends tell me that the Resistance  is irrelevant in the age of Pope  Francis since he is a liberal modernist and the SSPX will never ever give in to modernism. Some have even told me that the Resistance may have been legitimate under Benedict but since we have a Pope hostile to Tradition its irrelevant since SSPX opposes his modernism.

   Bottom line is I'm torn. I want to go to heaven .  will the Resistance help me get to heaven easier than the SSPX? The ultimate goal is the salus animarum.

   Please help me out.

We are creatures and need God's grace, which is given to us through Mass and the Sacraments. If you've read any of my posts, you should know how I feel about home-alone-ism (I'm a fierce opponent of that).

I have not assimilated Fr. Pfeiffer's very sectarian "red light" (avoid every SSPX chapel, even if you have no other options) position, and I'm hardly the only one. That is the sane Catholic position.

One has to look at the fundamentals of an organization or position -- not just one or two bad specimens.

On the other hand, it would be a mistake to ignore the very real problems altogether. It doesn't matter who the pope is, or what that pope thinks of Tradition. Today, there is a sizeable faction within the SSPX (NOT just Bishop Fellay, unfortunately) that think the time is right to do a deal with Rome as they are today: totally unconverted. They think that if they could just get "inside", they could convert Rome (nevermind that several other organizations have tried this and utterly failed.)

This optimism is based on the belief that the SSPX is special not because it stands for the truth without compromise, but because it's the SSPX. It's a hubris born of pride.

The idea that the SSPX should make a "practical deal with Modernist Rome" is fraught with errors and misconceptions. Just for starters, most who hold this position no longer believe in the centuries-long conspiracy of the Jєωs/Freemasons/Illuminati against the Church, including its infiltration with Modernism. Instead, they think that the Romans are just "misguided", like the typical Indult supporter.

This is wrong, and must be opposed. That basically = "Resistance". That is to say: the old SSPX position, not changing any doctrine, not going Sedevacantist, simply rejecting this siren song of Modernist Rome and continuing the mission of Archbishop Lefebvre. And especially, they are heeding the Archbishop's warnings in the last few years of his life about a practical accord with Rome!

How the Resistance has taken shape, who is involved, its numbers, its human prospects, etc. are all beside the point! Either the Resistance, or a new group just like it, will have to succeed. Didn't Our Lord say that the Church would last until the end of the world? The Conciliar Church might have the buildings, but they have a completely different faith, infused with Freemasonic ideas, Feminism, Modernism, Communism, and other errors. So they certainly aren't carrying the torch. The SSPX is steering straight for the rocks in trying to court them. Long term, they will totally lose it.

You personally might be able to attend Mass there a while longer, but they have no future now. Eventually all their assets (money, buildings, etc.) will be in the hands of the Conciliar Church, or an organization which resembles today's FSSP. I don't oppose the individual priests (again, this is not a feud; it's a matter of principles and keeping the Faith) but I do oppose the organization, which no longer represents Tradition. They are becoming all "smells and bells". They don't talk about the Freemasonic infiltration of the Church, etc. You can read on CathInfo all the fine details of the SSPX Crisis. However, the existence of such a Crisis should be apparent to anyone with his eyes open.

So unless you plan on being dead by then (2-5 years from now), I'd suggest planning what you will do at that point. It would be smart to have a chapel (and group of Catholics to support it) already going which is independent of the SSPX. Hence why we support the "Resistance" as much as possible today. They are worthy of support.

There are dozens of good Catholics at my local SSPX chapel. Right now, most of them totally ignore the independent chapel that has been set up 40 minutes away with weekly Mass. They can more or less get away with doing that today -- but like I said, in a number of years, the SSPX will transform into the FSSP and/or be totally shut down at the whim of the latest Modernist pope. And then what? Assuming they haven't been brainwashed over the months and years (see: boiling frog in a pot analogy), they can all come here, and I'll welcome them in. Lucky for them, I managed through great effort to find other supporters. But not every locale will be that lucky!

You certainly don't want to casually dismiss the decisive actions of many different priests around the world. The priest supporters of the Resistance are extremely varied, from "a few blemishes on the ol' reputation" all the way up to "cream of the crop". It's hard to dismiss all of them as being mistaken. They're not ALL cholerics, hot tempered, etc. The entire Dominicans of Avrille went with the Resistance. They're no dummies. They alone should cause us to stop, pause, and consider what's going on.

I should probably get back to my duties of state now. I hope this helps --

God bless,

Matthew