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Author Topic: Rebels and Troublemakers!  (Read 2425 times)

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Offline John Grace

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Rebels and Troublemakers!
« on: December 09, 2013, 11:07:54 AM »
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    • It would be good to return to this. Why are those who seek truth branded 'rebels' and 'troublemakers'? We had this several years ago on the now defunct Ignis Ardens forum.
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    Offline ihsv

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #1 on: December 09, 2013, 11:14:06 AM »
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    • A common tactic of the revolution is to brand their enemies.  They never deal with the issue at hand.  Instead, they choose carefully crafted labels and apply them to the opposition.  The labels are designed to elicit an emotional reaction.  That, combined with the fact that most of us have been "trained" NOT to think critically, but based on emotion and feelings, is a very effective tool.
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    Confiteor unum baptisma in remissionem peccatorum. - Nicene Creed

    Offline John Grace

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #2 on: December 09, 2013, 11:16:41 AM »
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    • Quote from: ihsv
    A common tactic of the revolution is to brand their enemies.  They never deal with the issue at hand.  Instead, they choose carefully crafted labels and apply them to the opposition.  The labels are designed to elicit an emotional reaction.  That, combined with the fact that most of us have been "trained" NOT to think critically, but based on emotion and feelings, is a very effective tool.


    Even on this forum a woman stated she was placed under "holy obedience" by an SSPX priest. Why did she allow herself to be manipulated in this manner.

    Critical thinking or thinking for oneself is frowned upon by the SSPX. What did not want their laity to know?

    As I stated earlier even at the funeral of Deirdre Manifold, some SSPX laity present called people 'rebels' instead of facing the issues at hand.

    I have never agreed with the analysis of telesphorus but very alarming so many SSPX disregarded truth and facts just to save face.
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    Offline ihsv

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #3 on: December 09, 2013, 11:41:27 AM »
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    • "For the heart of this people is grown gross, and with their ears they have been dull of hearing, and their eyes they have shut: lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them." (Mt. 13:15)
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    Confiteor unum baptisma in remissionem peccatorum. - Nicene Creed

    Offline Charlotte NC Bill

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #4 on: December 09, 2013, 09:29:11 PM »
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    • They do tend to get a little personal instead of ever addressing the real issues/errors at hand...and they do it on a personal level...In our parish a family..we'll call them "family D"..picked up Joe M's daughter and smothered her w/kisses and attention...My 3 yo daughter was standing right next to her...They totally ignored her bc she's my daughter...So they made a lovely 3 yr old cry bc they have a problem with me...Lovely right? Or when my family tried to get into a pew and the lovely old cow who doesn't like me sd ( "Let me get out so YOU can get in " ) She could have slid her rotund rear 3' down...but know, she's unable to show basic courtesy to me and my family...And I'm sure it will get better..But who cares? It's actually liberating to know that someone doesn't like you-deeply...Now you can almost do whatever you want..It doesn't matter bc they don't like you anyway.. :drillsergeant:
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    Offline Unbrandable

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #5 on: December 09, 2013, 11:19:16 PM »
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    • “If Catholics and good priests, some of whom have served in parishes for thirty years to the great satisfaction of their parishioners, have been able to beat the insult of being treated as disobedient rebels and dissidents, it could have only have been so as to maintain the Catholic Faith. They do it knowingly, following the spirit of the martyrs.
     
    Whether one is persecuted by one’s own brethren or by the enemies of the Church, it is still to suffer martyrdom, provided it be for the maintaining of the Faith. These priests and faithful are witnesses of the Catholic Faith. They prefer to be considered rebels and dissidents rather than lose their Faith.”

    Archbishop Lefebvre (The Infiltration of Modernism in the Church)


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    Offline Centroamerica

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #6 on: December 10, 2013, 06:31:06 AM »
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    • Quote from: John Grace
    Critical thinking or thinking for oneself is frowned upon by the SSPX. What did not want their laity to know?




    The moment we decide that our leaders should be exempt from any criticism we develop a cult-like attitude, granted the criticisms are fair and just and not some sort of animosity towards these people. Right now Bishop Fellay and Fr. Bouchart among others should be receiving a ton of criticisms from the faithful. The priests who were defending Bishop Fellay after the CNS interview are getting tired of defending Bishop Fellay. They are seeing the big picture now. The faithful are hypnotized into believing he is saintly and heroic and could never do no wrong. The latter is a grave error in judgement. The very same principle should be applied to the priests of the resistance. If they open their mouth too soon or say something which is incorrect the faithful should let them know. Failure to do this will result in a cult-like attitude and the resistance will quickly become a microcosm of the SSPX, to some degree or another, if not worse. No one should be exempt from criticism and the faithful who are promoting this attitude are contributing to the cult of attitude. "well I like Fr. Fulano" "well I like Bishop such and such". I choose to follow truth; Christ the King and the Ever Virgin Mary. I will not follow unconditionally anyone except Them.
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    We conclude logically that religion can give an efficacious and truly realistic answer to the great modern problems only if it is a religion that is profoundly lived, not simply a superficial and cheap religion made up of some vocal prayers and some ceremonies...

    Offline ggreg

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #7 on: December 10, 2013, 07:07:20 AM »
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    • You have pooled together lots of people who will be vocal with their objections.  I would not worry about the resistance becoming cult like and full of slavishly obedient people.  Quite the reverse.

    It's going to be more like running a pirate ship. :roll-laugh2:
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    Offline John Grace

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #8 on: December 10, 2013, 07:59:09 AM »
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    • Centroamerica,

    Quote
    I choose to follow truth; Christ the King and the Ever Virgin Mary. I will not follow unconditionally anyone except Them


    I agree with you.


    Quote
    The priests who were defending Bishop Fellay after the CNS interview are getting tired of defending Bishop Fellay. They are seeing the big picture now. The faithful are hypnotized into believing he is saintly and heroic and could never do no wrong. The latter is a grave error in judgement



    The pro-agreement priests didn't need to be vocal. The anti stayed silent when they should/could have spoken.

    I don't believe the faithful are "hypnotized". They agree with Bishop Fellay and his worldview. Instead of a revolt against the modern world the supporters of Bishop Fellay want comfort. They are liberals. They believe in Christian Democracy. They are not "hypnotized" but are willing participants. Many already attend the Indult. Many SSPX laity are liberals.

    A  mistake people make is stating laity didn't know. I offer a mere opinion but my view is the majority of SSPX laity in Ireland and elsewhere believe "There is no agreement, what is the problem"? "We have a Mass".

    Then keep in mind the analysis of Sean Johnson.

    Also I believe Bishop Fellay will see out his term as Superior General. There was never any disputing this.
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    Offline John Grace

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #9 on: December 10, 2013, 08:10:03 AM »
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    • Take an Irish example. For many years the pro-life group Youth Defence and its members were associated with the SSPX. Yet in 2013, Fr Mac Donald SSPX states the group never understood the battle. He made it clear the group were never ideal but could be supported yet they never seemed to have understood the fight.

    Same for many who attend the SSPX now. Many have an Indult and NewChurch mindset.
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    Offline Frances

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #10 on: December 10, 2013, 08:11:50 AM »
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    •  :sad:
    NC Bill, no wonder she doesn't like you!  I'd not be very fond of a man who refers to me and my posterior as having bovine characteristics!
     :dancing-banana:
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     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  

    Offline bowler

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #11 on: December 10, 2013, 08:18:59 AM »
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    • Quote from: John Grace
    Why are those who seek truth branded 'rebels' and 'troublemakers'?


    It's called conviction. The couch potatoes don't like the work it causes.
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    Online Kazimierz

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #12 on: December 10, 2013, 02:12:50 PM »
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    • I'm a good ole rebel,
    that is what I am.
    And for +Fellay's temple,
    I care not a beaver dam.
    I will fight againner,
    til all is said and done.
    For the battle is not over,
    and from it I wont run.
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    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster

    Offline Charlotte NC Bill

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #13 on: December 10, 2013, 08:02:20 PM »
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    • Maybe so Frances...but if I could what she thought of me....I'd be banned.
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    Offline Charlotte NC Bill

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    Rebels and Troublemakers!
    « Reply #14 on: December 10, 2013, 08:05:24 PM »
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    • Correction: if I could print what she thinks of me...I'd be banned..
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