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Offline SeanJohnson

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Prometheus
« on: July 15, 2021, 03:28:37 PM »
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  • https://tradcatresist.blogspot.com/2021/07/prometheus.html

    Prometheus

    tradcatresist:

    The Angelus Press has been justifiably criticised on this site when necessary. Therefore, when they get it really right, it's no harm to acknowledge it.

    [font={defaultattr}]
    The book Prometheus by Fr Gaudron does not 'examine' Vatican II. It tears it to shreds and puts it in the dustbin of history for the road to hell that it is.

    Some were concerned that the fact that the Angelus Press took so long in getting the book into the English language, was that the SSPX were afraid that it went 'too far' compared with the wet offerings like Bishop Fellay's latest book. Those who eye roll at another 'Resistance' exaggeration, may like to compare the outstanding previous book by Fr Mathias Gaudron 'Catechism of the Crisis' and the ahem, edited version that was serialised in the pages of The Angelus magazine. Indeed, Bishop Williamson decided to promote the book himself a couple of years ago through a series of lectures, still available here.[/font]

    [font={defaultattr}]
    We strongly recommened the book. To purchase it please find it at the Angelus store here.[/font]



    [font={defaultattr}]From the Angelus website (linked to by Tradcatresist, above):[/font]


    VATICAN II IS PROMETHEUS IN HIS ACT OF LARCENY.

    "The Second Vatican Council is Prometheus in his act of larceny. It was a maneuver of all too human prudence carried out by a divinely constituted hierarchy, which burned for men the incense that belongs to God alone. As in the parable of the unfaithful steward, the Council cancelled man’s debts to God, promising salvation to all; and in the worship of its New Mass gave man the better part. "

    While the fruits of Vatican II have been evident for decades many Catholics still lack the ability to articulate why the humanist principles that underlie Vatican II are so egregious. This book summarizes the main tenets of Vatican II, explains the correct theological and philosophical principles and exposes the fallacious thinking of the Council.

    THIS BOOK WILL BE KNOWN AS THE DEFINITIVE EXPLANATION OF VATICAN II.  

    Topics defined, explained, and refuted by this book:
    Inversion of the Common Good, Anthropocentrism, Catholic Humanism
    Reinvention of Authority, Conciliar False Optimism
    Humanistic Naturalism, Conciliar Naturalism
    The Church and the Kingdom of God according to Lumen Gentium
    The New Church, Humanism, Inclusivity, and Innovation in the Council
    How Humanism Eventually Becomes Liberalism  
    Humanism needs Subjectivism and Autonomy of Conscience
    Church and World Religions the Opening of the Ecuмenical Pathways
    And Many More Topics . . .

    While this book is not an easy read, it is certainly a must read for any serious Catholic looking to understand the difference between what the Church has always taught and the philosophical mutation that has eroded the hearts and minds of Catholic prelates, priests, and faithful since the Renaissance till our modern day.

    "Pandora’s box has poured its evils on the whole Church, while the Catholic hierarchy has been chained, with its own incoherence. And who will be the Hercules capable of liberating her? We believe it can only be the return of Thomism to Rome."
                                       -Fr. Alvaro Calderon, SSPX

    "Pandora’s box has poured its evils on the whole Church, while the Catholic hierarchy has been chained, with its own incoherence. And who will be the Hercules capable of liberating her? We believe it can only be the return of Thomism to Rome."
                                       -Fr. Alvaro Calderon, SSPX
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #1 on: July 15, 2021, 03:44:30 PM »
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  • Note the little question at the bottom of the book cover:

    "Can you interpret Vatican II correctly?"

    Is this just a clumsy way of asking "Can Vatican II be reconciled with Tradition"

    Or, does it mean that interpreting Vatican II correctly means to understand it in a completely modernist way, as was intended?

    I guess we'll see, as I just ordered it.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #2 on: July 15, 2021, 04:05:32 PM »
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  • Notice the link to the Bp. Williamson conferences -- leading to one of those conferences, posted by the CathInfo account on Youtube.

    I was at that conference. October 2019. Good memories. Just a couple months after my last plane trip (to LifeSiteNews company meeting in Virginia), and just a few months before the COVID scamdemic. But it was the last time I got to travel outside my state by plane -- closing in on two years now. But given the fact I no longer work for LifeSite, the price of airline tickets, the "post COVID" world we live in, and the likelihood of "vaccine passports", it's likely to get a lot longer before I get to travel anywhere by plane again.

    That Oct 2019 conference might be my last plane trip. Ever. Even if I live another 40 years.

    That was a providential trip too. I was studying electronics at the time, but the man I stayed with, a supporter of Bp. Zendejas, gave me a slight nudge and I decided to become a Ham Radio operator. So when I got back, I immediately began cramming for all 3 tests (Technician, General, Amateur Extra) and passed them about 1 month later. In my spare time, that is. I was still working full-time.
    Want to say "thank you"? 
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    Offline Kazimierz

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #3 on: July 15, 2021, 07:52:13 PM »
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  • Thank you for posting the links to +Williamson's conferences on the Prometheus book. I just finished downloading them. I will be enlightened to hear anything I have not studied yet thus far. The book would be a must read. It depends on shipping, as it is often prohibitive purchasing such things from the US, with rare exceptions.

    My days of travel to the US, barring nothing short of a miracle, are done. No regrets. I could not even get health insurance. I will win the lottery up here and bring all CI folk up here to the Alberta Rockies for a mega conference Traditional Catholic style!!!!!! :cowboy:
    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #4 on: July 15, 2021, 08:53:59 PM »
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  • Thank you for posting the links to +Williamson's conferences on the Prometheus book. I just finished downloading them. I will be enlightened to hear anything I have not studied yet thus far. The book would be a must read. It depends on shipping, as it is often prohibitive purchasing such things from the US, with rare exceptions.

    My days of travel to the US, barring nothing short of a miracle, are done. No regrets. I could not even get health insurance. I will win the lottery up here and bring all CI folk up here to the Alberta Rockies for a mega conference Traditional Catholic style!!!!!! :cowboy:

    Old buddy, maybe we can meet in Winnipeg sometime, and solve all the world’s problems over a bottle of this:

    https://www.blackwellswines.com/products/clix-vodka?variant=32496991567938&currency=USD&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=google+shopping&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&adpos=&scid=scplpshopify_US_4702309875778_32496991567938&sc_intid=shopify_US_4702309875778_32496991567938&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI2ojenL3m8QIVm2pvBB112gfaEAQYAyABEgLWZPD_BwE
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Kazimierz

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #5 on: July 16, 2021, 08:59:02 AM »
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  • Old buddy, maybe we can meet in Winnipeg sometime, and solve all the world’s problems over a bottle of this:

    https://www.blackwellswines.com/products/clix-vodka?variant=32496991567938&currency=USD&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=google+shopping&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&adpos=&scid=scplpshopify_US_4702309875778_32496991567938&sc_intid=shopify_US_4702309875778_32496991567938&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI2ojenL3m8QIVm2pvBB112gfaEAQYAyABEgLWZPD_BwE
    Even if we cant solve all the world's problems, at least we can say we had good libations.  :cowboy: ;)
    I spent a year in Winnipeg as a lay apostle (2007) with the pre 2012 SSPX. I met Fr Girouard there. I discovered lectures from His Excellency at that time too.
    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster

    Offline JJkul

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #6 on: July 16, 2021, 03:33:30 PM »
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  • Is this new, or was I just out of the loop?

    I had no idea there was an English version available.
    ____
    Joseph L.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #7 on: July 16, 2021, 03:42:24 PM »
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  • Is this new, or was I just out of the loop?

    I had no idea there was an English version available.
    Yes, it's new. And published by Angelus Press of all places. Apparently even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    Paypal donations: matthew@chantcd.com


    Offline Kazimierz

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #8 on: July 17, 2021, 01:40:45 PM »
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  • Does the content of the book fall under public domain as of yet? Shipping to Canada is more expensive than the text itself, so indeed I have to give it a pass. 

    Scanning the text and posting it discretely is likely not a proposition that can be entertained? Not advocating illegality. Just looking for options.

    Thanks  :pray:
    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #9 on: July 20, 2021, 02:30:05 PM »
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  • First impressions and observations:

    1) I did not know Fr. Calderon was as old as he is (born in 1937, he is 83-84 years-old today);

    2) The whole book is a frontal attack upon the orthodoxy of the Second Vatican Council itself;

    3) It is written in a style reminiscent of Romano Amerio (entertaining despite the heavy content; the reader does not feel he is slogging his way through, and is somewhat surprsed and motivated to continue by that realization, which also brings a certain joy that he is up to the task);

    4) Another similarity to Iota Unum: You don't want to put it down.  It tastes good, and you have the impression of excitement to see what gets covered/destroyed next.

    5) The timing: Coming out just as the MP Traditionis Custodes is released.  Did the SSPX have a premonition or inside info. regarding what was in Francis's MP, and realize, "What the hell, if its all over, we might as well start blasting again?"

    6) A sample of the tenor of the book: After recalling Prometheus was punished by Zeus for stealing fire and giving it to man, but also for sacrificing a bull, and giving the better part of it to men, he writes, "The Council is Prometheus in the act of his larceny.  It was a maneuver of human prudence carried out by a divinely constituted hierarchy, which burned for men the incence that belongs to God.  As in the parable of the unfaithful steward, the COuncil cancelled man's debt to God, promising salvation to all; and in the worship of its new Mass, it has given man the better part."" (Foreword, p.7).

    7) If releasing Fr. Paul Robinson's book was a signal to Rome, indicating that the SSPX was prepared to jump on board with modernity, then what message does the release of this book convey?  Will we know more after the SSPX's forthcoming commentary on the Motu Proprio?  Probably.

    8) I now know where +Vigano received the idea of questioning the "officialness" of V2: It is right here in Ch. 1.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Kazimierz

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #10 on: July 20, 2021, 03:12:37 PM »
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  • https://www.dropbox.com/s/4jza3r82x2vewq8/Vatican%20II%20Calderon%20Summary.docx?dl=0

    This is a link to my Dropbox, being the file of the summary of Prometheus composed by His Excellency.

    I forgot I had this. Now is a good time to post it methinks.  :cowboy:
    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster


    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #11 on: July 20, 2021, 04:18:06 PM »
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  • So, what happened to Father Caldron?   Did he get the boot from the SSPX?


      Fr. Calderon refutes Mons. Fellay
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #12 on: August 07, 2021, 08:46:39 PM »
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  • I received the following email from a Spanish-speaking priest (ie., English is not his native language).  So far as I am aware, he has only read the Foreword of the English-language Angelus edition:


    “FYI  - The original Foreword has been edited. The English version prints about 50 % from the Spanish one.

    The additional editing presents Father's book as an effort to interpret the Second Vatican Council in the light of Tradition. Actually said they, Benedict XVI's continuity has tried to do so but Francis's is just a rupture.

    Indeed, there is a significant twist in the English FOREWORD. The introduction and part of the middle section do not come from Father Calderon at all. And if the book was written in 2010,  how  at the beginning
    of the English Foreword speaks about Pope Francia who was elected in 2013?

    At the end of it, there is no name neither date nor signature claiming the author of the English Foreword but letting people to believe that it is the same Father Alvaro Calderon.  

    Ironically, the last paragraph was also
    edited, it is better to say - deleted! It runs as follows:

    "Just it is left for me to express my acknolegments to Bishop Richard Williamson, who not only encouraged and commanded
    me to engage this task - that's why from this reason the last section of my program went through -, but also he gave me the key-idea
    to come a cross with all what lastly came together, so to him it belongs the essential sketch/theme which it comes together with-the-
    one-to-one conclusion of each chapter. I dare to say that I didn't want to decide to begin this essay, thinking that it might imply
    a hard and long process with no much avail, but in placing the Humanism as principle of the Council (Vatican II) with its antropocentric
    twist, each one of the issues was kept properly in their own place with not problem or without inconvenience. I never thought than this
    project very much complicated, rather it would be resolved in a very short time. I believe that it has been the merit to obedience and
    the docility to resign one's own idea in order to take some one's else. And I believe also that it is a consequence of keeping the truth.

    La Reja, January 17th  2010."
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Hermes

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #13 on: August 07, 2021, 09:35:48 PM »
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  • I received the following email from a Spanish-speaking priest (ie., English is not his native language).  So far as I am aware, he has only read the Foreword of the English-language Angelus edition:


    “FYI  - The original Foreword has been edited. The English version prints about 50 % from the Spanish one.

    The additional editing presents Father's book as an effort to interpret the Second Vatican Council in the light of Tradition. Actually said they, Benedict XVI's continuity has tried to do so but Francis's is just a rupture.

    Indeed, there is a significant twist in the English FOREWORD. The introduction and part of the middle section do not come from Father Calderon at all. And if the book was written in 2010,  how  at the beginning
    of the English Foreword speaks about Pope Francia who was elected in 2013?

    At the end of it, there is no name neither date nor signature claiming the author of the English Foreword but letting people to believe that it is the same Father Alvaro Calderon.  

    Ironically, the last paragraph was also
    edited, it is better to say - deleted! It runs as follows:

    "Just it is left for me to express my acknolegments to Bishop Richard Williamson, who not only encouraged and commanded
    me to engage this task - that's why from this reason the last section of my program went through -, but also he gave me the key-idea
    to come a cross with all what lastly came together, so to him it belongs the essential sketch/theme which it comes together with-the-
    one-to-one conclusion of each chapter. I dare to say that I didn't want to decide to begin this essay, thinking that it might imply
    a hard and long process with no much avail, but in placing the Humanism as principle of the Council (Vatican II) with its antropocentric
    twist, each one of the issues was kept properly in their own place with not problem or without inconvenience. I never thought than this
    project very much complicated, rather it would be resolved in a very short time. I believe that it has been the merit to obedience and
    the docility to resign one's own idea in order to take some one's else. And I believe also that it is a consequence of keeping the truth.

    La Reja, January 17th  2010."

    Strange indeed. I purchased the book in English, but I don’t have a Spanish copy to compare it to.

    I spoke with a Priest friend of Fr. Calderon who is heavily involved in the operations of Angelus Press about the book a few weeks ago. He didn’t say any alterations were made but then again would he have even mentioned it if there were?

    Things like this are unfortunate if true.

    O Fortuna
    Velut luna

    Offline Kazimierz

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    Re: Prometheus
    « Reply #14 on: August 08, 2021, 11:32:33 AM »
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  • Subterfuge methinks on the part of Angelus Press. The neoSSPX controlled Angelus Press perceived the need to reconstruct the text as to make it fall in line with neoSSPXThink. 
    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster