Replace the word "heretic" with what a heretic is: "Sinner." Hopefully that will clear it up for you.

No, because we are not talking about any sin whatsoever. A fornicator, for instance, is not separated from the Church due to that sin. There is no censure that needs to be lifted prior to absolution of sins. A fornicator can walk into a confessional, confess his sin, and immediately receive absolution. A heretic cannot do that. 

Otherwise, a Catholic guilty of the sin of heresy could not receive the Last Rites, which they can even when unconscious and dying without any abjuration, and can even receive them from a priest who is also an excommunicant for heresy, schism or apostacy. Clear now?

Where do you get this? 

Canon 731 


§ 1. As all the Sacraments of the New Law, instituted by Christ our Lord, are the principal means
of sanctification and salvation, the greatest diligence and reverence is to be observed in
opportunely and correctly administering them and receiving them.
§ 2. It is forbidden that the Sacraments of the Church be ministered to heretics and schismatics,
even if they ask for them and are in good faith, unless beforehand, rejecting their errors, they are
reconciled with the Church.

On The Subject Of Extreme Unction

Canon 942
This sacrament is not to be conferred on those who are impenitent, persevering contumaciously
in manifest mortal sin; if there is doubt about this, it should be conferred under condition.

Canon 943 
Nevertheless, [the sacrament] should be absolutely conferred on those infirm who, when they
were in possession of their faculties, had at least implicitly asked [for it] or who seemed to ask [for
it], even if later they lost their senses or the use of reason.

Heretics: No. Heretics profess things contrary to the true faith.

Okay, so you do agree that heretics are not members of the Church?

Yes, like the heretic, the fornicator is separated from the Church because being in Mortal Sin he has separated himself from God. Remember, Christ and the Church are one.

Separation from God, hence the Church, is one of the effects of mortal sin. The distinction you're not making is that the Church attaches a censure of excommunication to certain mortal sins, heresy is one of them. As I posted previous, in the traditional formula for absolution, the priest first lifts the censure then forgives the sin. The formula includes the lifting of censures for a reason, it's not in there by mistake.

A fornicator is not outside the Church due to that sin. Pope Pius XII teaches that not every sin, however grave it may be, severs a man from the Body of the Church. Fornication, for instance, is a sin of the flesh. It is not a rejection of Church Dogma , a rejection of the unity of the Church, or an act of apostasy

Pope Pius XII teaches that heresy, schism, and apostasy OF THEIR OWN NATURE sever a man from Body of the  Church. And if we look at the four criteria that Pope Pius XII gives for Church membership, we see that those three sins make up criteria #2 and #3. 

2) Actually only those are to be included as members of the Church who [...] profess the true faith...

3) Actually only those are to be included as members of the Church who [...] have not been so unfortunate as to separate themselves from the unity of the Body.

Heretics and apostates, and in practice basically all schismatics do not profess the true Faith. A fornicator can.
Heretics, apostates, and schismatics have separated themselves from the unity of the Body by the very nature of their sin. A fornicator doesn't

Pope Pius XII even uses the same wording for crying out loud! 

"not every sin, however grave it may be, is such as of its own nature to sever a man from the Body of the Church, as does schism or heresy or apostasy"

3) "Actually only those are to be included as members of the Church who [...] have not been so unfortunate as to separate themselves from the unity of the Body"

A fornicator, again, is not denying a Church dogma, renouncing the faith, or rejecting the unity of the Church. Any one of the four criteria Pius XII laid out for Church membership is not lacking in him. He may have lost "charity and divine grace through sin, thus becoming incapable of supernatural merit, and yet not be deprived of all life if they hold fast to faith and Christian hope"


that is why the the Church attaches a censure to those sins..because it makes it clear that lost membership is a result of the sin. And of course the lifting of the censure is there for a reason, it is what formally declares a former member of the Church to be a member once again

23. Nor must one imagine that the Body of the Church, just because it bears the name of Christ, is made up during the days of its earthly pilgrimage only of members conspicuous for their holiness, or that it consists only of those whom God has predestined to eternal happiness. it is owing to the Savior’s infinite mercy that place is allowed in His Mystical Body here below for those whom, of old, He did not exclude from the banquet.20 For not every sin, however grave it may be, is such as of its own nature to sever a man from the Body of the Church, as does schism or heresy or apostasy. Men may lose charity and divine grace through sin, thus becoming incapable of supernatural merit, and yet not be deprived of all life if they hold fast to faith and Christian hope, and if, illumined from above, they are spurred on by the interior promptings of the Holy Spirit to salutary fear and are moved to prayer and penance for their sins.
24. Let every one then abhor sin, which defiles the mystical members of our Redeemer; but if anyone unhappily falls and his obstinacy has not made him unworthy of communion with the faithful, let him be received with great love, and let eager charity see in him a weak member of Jesus Christ. For, as the Bishop of Hippo remarks, it is better “to be cured within the Church’s community than to be cut off from its body as incurable members.” 21 “As long as a member still forms part of the body there is no reason to despair of its cure; once it has been cut off, it can be neither cured nor healed.” 22

Pope Pius XII, Mystici Corporis

From Trent, Session 14, Chapter 7:
"...But it is consonant to the divine authority, that this reservation of cases have effect, not merely in external polity, but also in God's sight. Nevertheless, for fear lest any may perish on this account, it has always been very piously observed in the said Church of God, that there be no reservation at the point of death, and that therefore all priests may absolve all penitents whatsoever from every kind of sins and censures whatever: and as, save at that point of death, priests have no power in reserved cases, let this alone be their endeavour, to persuade penitents to repair to superior and lawful judges for the benefit of absolution."

Penitents, Stubborn. Penitents. An unconscious heretic who never gave indication of penitence is NOT a penitent. Are you serious?

Personally, I think anyone who preaches heresy makes it blatantly obvious that they are not members of the Church, most of the time they even boast that they want nothing whatsoever to do with the Catholic Church, that it is evil etc., but if the heretic was ever a Catholic and if he dies in that state, that guy will face God as a Catholic with, God forbid, the sin of losing the faith and the sin of heresy on his soul.

Okay, thank you. Heretics are not members of the Church. Yes, they will be judged with the indelible mark of Baptism on their soul

What do you make of those validly baptised as infants in heretical sects? They were made Catholic by their baptism, but adhere to their false sect when they reach the age of reason. Are they still Catholic?

A fornicator is not outside the Church due to that sin. Pope Pius XII teaches that not every sin, however grave it may be, severs a man from the Body of the Church. Fornication, for instance, is a sin of the flesh. It is not a rejection of Church Dogma , a rejection of the unity of the Church, or an act of apostasy

Pope Pius XII teaches that heresy, schism, and apostasy OF THEIR OWN NATURE sever a man from Body of the  Church. And if we look at the four criteria that Pope Pius XII gives for Church membership, we see that those three sins make up criteria #2 and #3.

I did not say a fornicator is outside the Church, I said "Yes, like the heretic, the fornicator is separated from the Church."  And I told you why, seems you reject the reason I gave you, which is what the Church teaches. 

Do you understand that heresy is a sin, and do you deny that all mortal sin separates us from God, therefore the Church?

that is why the the Church attaches a censure to those sins..because it makes it clear that lost membership is a result of the sin. And of course the lifting of the censure is there for a reason, it is what formally declares a former member of the Church to be a member once again

The Church does not censure non-members.

Penitents, Stubborn. Penitents. An unconscious heretic who never gave indication of penitence is NOT a penitent. Are you serious?

The exception is in reserved cases, read what Trent said again. Who said he never gave indication of penitence?

Okay, thank you. Heretics are not members of the Church. Yes, they will be judged with the indelible mark of Baptism on their soul

What do you make of those validly baptised as infants in heretical sects? They were made Catholic by their baptism, but adhere to their false sect when they reach the age of reason. Are they still Catholic?

As St. Thomas said: "Baptism without faith is of no value." They are not members after the age of reason if they remain adhering to their false sect.

  

I did not say a fornicator is outside the Church, I said "Yes, like the heretic, the fornicator is separated from the Church."  And I told you why, seems you reject the reason I gave you, which is what the Church teaches.

You now have a conundrum Stubborn

Pius XII teaches that those who separate themselves from the unity of the Body are not members of the Church at all

If you are going to say that a fornicator is separated from the Church..or in other words, "separated from the unity of the Body"...you must also admit that he loses membership in the Church, and is therefore outside the Church.

But that is not what Pope Pius XII teaches. If that were the case, a fornicator could not receive absolution of his sins..as Pope Eugene IV teaches at the Council of Florence that

the unity of the ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only for those who abide in it do the church’s sacraments contribute to salvation

Do you understand that heresy is a sin, and do you deny that all mortal sin separates us from God, therefore the Church?

Of course all mortal sin separates us from God...but as Pius XII teaches, not all mortal sin separates us from the Church..as separation from the Unity of the Body means one is not a member of the Church.

The Church does not censure non-members.

But it does, to those who by the very nature of their sin have lost membership (e.g. all heretics must have censure lifted)

A heretic loses membership when they commit the sin of heresy, there may or may not be a formal decree against him after the fact. That would mean the Church declaring a censure against someone who is a non-member

The exception is in reserved cases, read what Trent said again. Who said he never gave indication of penitence?

The word "penitent" is what gives indication. A heretic, schismatic, etc. who gives no indication of penitence is not a penitent.. obviously. Again, if there was doubt about whether or not he was penitent, the sacrament would be administered conditionally..meaning if he was not penitent, there would be no censure lifted, he would not be a member of the Church, and no sacrament would be effected

As St. Thomas said: "Baptism without faith is of no value." They are not members after the age of reason if they remain adhering to their false sect.

Not members, okay. But I asked if they are Catholic. Are they?

Fornicators lose membership in the Church....Stubborn, come on.  This is nonsense.

You now have a conundrum Stubborn

Pius XII teaches that those who separate themselves from the unity of the Body are not members of the Church at all

If you are going to say that a fornicator is separated from the Church..or in other words, "separated from the unity of the Body"...you must also admit that he loses membership in the Church, and is therefore outside the Church.

But that is not what Pope Pius XII teaches. If that were the case, a fornicator could not receive absolution of his sins..as Pope Eugene IV teaches at the Council of Florence that
Quote

Quote

the unity of the ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only for those who abide in it do the church’s sacraments contribute to salvation

This is pretty incredible. Yes, "a fornicator is separated from the Church..or in other words, "separated from the unity of the Body." Because of their sin, they separate themselves from Christ, which is the Church, which means they have separated themselves from the unity of the Body, whats more they make themselves an enemy of Christ and they cannot partake of the sacraments (except Penance).

But no, "you must also admit that he [fornicator] loses membership in the Church, and is therefore outside the Church." Again,as I said above.

"If that were the case, a fornicator could not receive absolution of his sins..as Pope Eugene IV teaches at the Council of Florence that...the unity of the ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only for those who abide in it do the church’s sacraments contribute to salvation"
Then neither could a Catholic with the sin of heresy on his soul.

Of course all mortal sin separates us from God...but as Pius XII teaches, not all mortal sin separates us from the Church..as separation from the Unity of the Body means one is not a member of the Church.

One cannot be separated from God, and at the same time united with the Church because the two are one. Such a thing is impossible, because the two are one.
" ...the Mystical Body of Christ and the Roman Catholic Church are one and the same thing". - Pope Pius XII Humani Generis

The word "penitent" is what gives indication. A heretic, schismatic, etc. who gives no indication of penitence is not a penitent.. obviously. Again, if there was doubt about whether or not he was penitent, the sacrament would be administered conditionally..meaning if he was not penitent, there would be no censure lifted, he would not be a member of the Church, and no sacrament would be effected

The problem you have, is the priest who is absolving the penitent is a heretic. 

Not members, okay. But I asked if they are Catholic. Are they?

No, because they never were, as St. Thomas said: "Baptism without faith is of no value."
  

You have a reading comprehension problem, I never said any such thing.

Here's what you said:
Do you understand that heresy is a sin, and do you deny that all mortal sin separates us from God, therefore the Church?


My response:
1.  Yes, heresy is a sin.
2.  Yes, all mortal sin separates us from God.
3.  No, not all moral sin separates us from the Church.  Only certain mortal sins.

The pope can bind and loose.  The Church is made up of divine and human parts.  The Church is the bride of Christ.  They are one, in a spiritual sense, but still distinct.