Author Topic: Novus Ordo Watch: in the SSPX (Read 5294 times)

Machabees · « **on:** June 18, 2013, 05:38:03 PM »

There has been surfacing a theme of the SSPX promoting and abetting to the Novus Ordo Mass and to the Novus Ordo itself.

Here are a few of those disclosures:

•   Bishop Fellay’s 2012 Doctrinal Declaration itself. Officially providing the acceptance and the implicit encouragement within its Declaration that: The Novus Ordo Mass is “legitimate” and therefore is a fruitful source of salvation. Along with the acceptance of Vatican II itself as can be interpreted in the “light of Tradition”, and emanating from Vatican II, the acceptance of the new Ecuмenical Code of Canon Law that issues from it. As well as, the acceptance of the ecuмenical Profession of Faith promulgated by Cardinal Ratzinger prior to being Pope.
http://www.therecusant.com/doctrinalpreamble-15apr2012
http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/SSPX-doctrinal-declaration

•   Bishop Fellay has endorsed a Novus Ordo Mass he had attended:
“On one occasion, Bishop (Bernard) Fellay, who is the leader of the Society of St. Pius X, came to see me and said, “We just came from an abbey that is near Florence. If Archbishop (Marcel) Lefebvre had seen how they celebrated there, he would not have taken the step that he did”… The missal used at that celebration was the Paul VI Missal in its strictest form.” (Cardinal Antonio Canizares) Source: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-If-Lefebvre-Had-Seen-Proper-Novus-Ordo-Mass

•   Invitation to participate in Novus Ordo functions: "In Miami the SSPX faithful have been encouraged both verbally and with a formal invitation to go to the local nordo mass and attend some consecration to the Sacred Heart the local bishop is performing. The invitation read May 30th 2013.

Pretty sure some of the sspx priests from Florida must have been there. Can't imagine they would encourage the faithful to go and then not go themselves."
A scan of the invitation is included in link:
http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Local-Ordinary-TRUMPS-Corpus-Christi
http://cathinfo-warning-pornography!/Ignis_Ardens/index.php?showtopic=12522&st=50

•   Working with the Novus Ordo: “He [Fr. John Jenkins] also revealed that they were working amongst the Novus Ordo in Poland to bring the groups closer!-- The same initiative, it seems, that Bp. Fellay had going on in France and Belgium, and Father Pflugger was pushing heavily in the Asian district, with Fr. Couture, Fr Chazal and Fr. Pfeiffer.”
http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php?a=topic&t=25291&min=5&num=5

•   SSPX in Poland promoting Ecclesia Dei ordinations.
http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/All-one-happy-family-on-SSPX-Polish-website
http://www.therecusant.com/apps/blog/show/28369676-sspx-in-poland-caught-promoting-ecclesia-dei

Please include here any other “Novus Ordo Watch: in the SSPX” news tips; along with its verified source.

s2srea · « **Reply #1 on:** June 18, 2013, 05:58:31 PM »

How about the St. Mary's article in the Angelus:
http://angeluspress.org/blog/virtues-are-inconvenient/

"Last week, according to the calendar for the 1962 Missal was the Second Sunday after Pentecost. There is an option, according to the same calendar, for parishes to use the Mass of Corpus Christi on Sunday – in the event that a large number of the faithful were unable to attend the Mass on Thursday itself (though the Mass of Corpus Christi is still always celebrated on that Thursday). So, which Mass was offered in Saint Mary’s on June 2? The answer: Neither. Why? Because it is the Anniversary of the Dedication of the Cathedral of St. Peter, the diocesan cathedral of the archdiocese of Kansas City, Kansas, in which St. Mary’s resides. Thus, we had the Mass for the Anniversary of the Dedication of a Cathedral. This is a tangible proof of our unity with the local ordinary, a tangible proof that we are not separatists, or schismatics, or, as Dr. Mirus so tastelessly puts it, members of a sect."

And as Sean pointed out, the next paragraph being even more revealing:
"Now, what of the sermon on this Sunday? A younger priest offered the Mass I attended – the High Mass at 9am. During the homily he preached on the fact that the local ordinary is our necessary connection with the Holy Father, the Vicar of Christ. And that while the Holy Father is the highest authority in the Church, Bishop Naumann is our father in this diocese, and we must pray and sacrifice for him. And no one was shocked. There was no gasping or pulling of hair. It wasn’t something new to any of the parishioners. For someone who attends a Society parish, it is simply inconceivable to take the young lady’s statement at face value."

Coastal GA Trad · « **Reply #2 on:** June 18, 2013, 06:05:17 PM »

Quote

• Bishop Fellay has endorsed a Novus Ordo Mass he had attended:
“On one occasion, Bishop (Bernard) Fellay, who is the leader of the Society of St. Pius X, came to see me and said, “We just came from an abbey that is near Florence. If Archbishop (Marcel) Lefebvre had seen how they celebrated there, he would not have taken the step that he did”… The missal used at that celebration was the Paul VI Missal in its strictest form.” (Cardinal Antonio Canizares) Source: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-If-Lefebvre-Had-Seen-Proper-Novus-Ordo-Mass

if this is true, it is very incriminating for Menzingen. Archbishop Lefebvre forbade his seminarians from attending the NO Mass in the 70's. Now Bishop Fellay, the highest person in the SSPX, admits publicly to attending a New Mass. One thing is for certain, I am glad I attend a resistance chapel.

wallflower · « **Reply #3 on:** June 18, 2013, 07:13:31 PM »

People really need to start taking screen shots of this stuff.

Incredulous · « **Reply #4 on:** June 18, 2013, 07:29:33 PM »

Novus Ordo Watch is an award winning website that docuмents and archives Conciliar church liturgical atrocities, among other things.

Their radar picked-up on Msgr. Fellay, but why are we not surprised?
We sensed that the SG was hiding his true feather colors all along.

Birds like that... are good for nothing but gator feed.

magdalena · « **Reply #5 on:** June 18, 2013, 08:32:19 PM »

Quote from: Incredulous

Quote from: Coastal GA Trad
Quote
• Bishop Fellay has endorsed a Novus Ordo Mass he had attended:
“On one occasion, Bishop (Bernard) Fellay, who is the leader of the Society of St. Pius X, came to see me and said, “We just came from an abbey that is near Florence. If Archbishop (Marcel) Lefebvre had seen how they celebrated there, he would not have taken the step that he did”… The missal used at that celebration was the Paul VI Missal in its strictest form.” (Cardinal Antonio Canizares) Source: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-If-Lefebvre-Had-Seen-Proper-Novus-Ordo-Mass

if this is true, it is very incriminating for Menzingen. Archbishop Lefebvre forbade his seminarians from attending the NO Mass in the 70's. Now Bishop Fellay, the highest person in the SSPX, admits publicly to attending a New Mass. One thing is for certain, I am glad I attend a resistance chapel.

How does that jibe with the book "The Problem of the Liturgical Reform: A Theological and Liturgical Study", put out by the SSPX in 2001? BTW, the page can no longer be found on their web-site, SSPX.org.

:confused1:

Incredulous · « **Reply #6 on:** June 18, 2013, 08:52:31 PM »

Quote from: magdalena

Quote from: Incredulous
Quote from: Coastal GA Trad
Quote
• Bishop Fellay has endorsed a Novus Ordo Mass he had attended:
“On one occasion, Bishop (Bernard) Fellay, who is the leader of the Society of St. Pius X, came to see me and said, “We just came from an abbey that is near Florence. If Archbishop (Marcel) Lefebvre had seen how they celebrated there, he would not have taken the step that he did”… The missal used at that celebration was the Paul VI Missal in its strictest form.” (Cardinal Antonio Canizares) Source: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-If-Lefebvre-Had-Seen-Proper-Novus-Ordo-Mass

if this is true, it is very incriminating for Menzingen. Archbishop Lefebvre forbade his seminarians from attending the NO Mass in the 70's. Now Bishop Fellay, the highest person in the SSPX, admits publicly to attending a New Mass. One thing is for certain, I am glad I attend a resistance chapel.

How does that jibe with the book "The Problem of the Liturgical Reform: A Theological and Liturgical Study", put out by the SSPX in 2001? BTW, the page can no longer be found on their web-site, SSPX.org.

:confused1:

Some crazy technical error :wink:

magdalena · « **Reply #7 on:** June 18, 2013, 11:32:49 PM »

For those interested, the book can be gotten here. As they say, "Know your Faith". I highly recommend it.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1892331098/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=1892331098&linkCode=as2&tag=httpwwwchanco-20

:reading:

MiserereMeiDeus · « **Reply #8 on:** June 19, 2013, 02:20:29 PM »

Quote from: magdalena

For those interested, the book can be gotten here. As they say, "Know your Faith". I highly recommend it.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1892331098/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=1892331098&linkCode=as2&tag=httpwwwchanco-20

:reading:

Be sure to order it through the cathinfo link!

Incredulous · « **Reply #9 on:** June 19, 2013, 02:42:07 PM »

Consider those priests remaining in the ExSPX .

What are the risks to their priesthoods?

Because of their cowardice to resist Msgr. Fellay, it would appear that they will soon lose their authority to give a sermon on the topic of holy martyrdom.

magdalena · « **Reply #10 on:** June 19, 2013, 04:49:29 PM »

Another great book on the Novus Ordo Mass is The Great Sacrilege by Father James Wathen. It can be ordered through the Father Wathen Heritage Foundation here:

http://www.fatherwathen.com/home.html

The reason I mentioned the other was because it shows an apparent relax in attitude in the leaders of the SSPX between then and now.

On one occasion, Bishop (Bernard) Fellay, who is the leader of the Society of St. Pius X, came to see me and said, “We just came from an abbey that is near Florence. If Archbishop (Marcel) Lefebvre had seen how they celebrated there, he would not have taken the step that he did”… The missal used at that celebration was the Paul VI Missal in its strictest form.” (Cardinal Antonio Canizares) Source: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-If-Lefebvre-Had-Seen-Proper-Novus-Ordo-Mass

Neil Obstat · « **Reply #11 on:** June 20, 2013, 04:40:10 AM »

.

This is what happened:

Quote from: Incredulous

Quote from: magdalena
Quote from: Coastal GA Trad

Quote from: Machabees
• Bishop Fellay has endorsed a Novus Ordo Mass he had attended:
“On one occasion, Bishop (Bernard) Fellay, who is the leader of the Society of St. Pius X, came to see me and said, “We just came from an abbey that is near Florence. If Archbishop (Marcel) Lefebvre had seen how they celebrated there, he would not have taken the step that he did”… The missal used at that celebration was the Paul VI Missal in its strictest form.” (Cardinal Antonio Canizares) Source: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-If-Lefebvre-Had-Seen-Proper-Novus-Ordo-Mass

if this is true, it is very incriminating for Menzingen. Archbishop Lefebvre forbade his seminarians from attending the NO Mass in the 70's. Now Bishop Fellay, the highest person in the SSPX, admits publicly to attending a New Mass. One thing is for certain, I am glad I attend a resistance chapel.

How does that jibe with the book "The Problem of the Liturgical Reform: A Theological and Liturgical Study", put out by the SSPX in 2001? BTW, the page can no longer be found on their web-site, SSPX.org.

:confused1:

Some crazy technical error :wink:

The theological study now missing is more than a mere technical error, though!

Quote

Consider those priests remaining in the ExSPX.

What are the risks to their priesthoods?

Because of their cowardice to resist Msgr. Fellay, it would appear that they will soon lose their authority to give a sermon on the topic of holy martyrdom.

That's for sure. They won't have much credibility for other things,
too, like courage, or fortitude, or prudence, or zeal, or orthodoxy,
missionary spirit, evangelization, grace, justification, penance,
contrition, fear of the Lord, piety, charity, hope, faith or religion.

It's all or nothing, as +W says.

But I think they'll still have the authority to give a sermon on
Gregorian Chant. :wink:

Neil Obstat · « **Reply #12 on:** June 20, 2013, 10:00:15 AM »

.

HERE is a 24-minute video that attempts to summarize
the story of the SSPX with a focus on what has been going on
in the post-ABL age.

The dramatic contrast between the Founder's principles and
those of the longstanding usurper-SG are highlighted rather well
with video images corresponding to what is being said. This
would be a good video to show to any discussion group,
especially one that has a contingent of Accordistas.

But you might have to offer them some kind of bonus for
paying attention because they're not going to have any desire
to remember what is being said in this video, since their outlook
is fundamentally inimical to this factual account.

Incredulous · « **Reply #13 on:** June 20, 2013, 01:40:21 PM »

Quote from: magdalena

Another great book on the Novus Ordo Mass is The Great Sacrilege by Father James Wathen. It can be ordered through the Father Wathen Heritage Foundation here:

http://www.fatherwathen.com/home.html

The reason I mentioned the other was because it shows an apparent relax in attitude in the leaders of the SSPX between then and now.

On one occasion, Bishop (Bernard) Fellay, who is the leader of the Society of St. Pius X, came to see me and said, “We just came from an abbey that is near Florence. If Archbishop (Marcel) Lefebvre had seen how they celebrated there, he would not have taken the step that he did”… The missal used at that celebration was the Paul VI Missal in its strictest form.” (Cardinal Antonio Canizares) Source: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-If-Lefebvre-Had-Seen-Proper-Novus-Ordo-Mass

I have this book but haven't read it.
Someone warned me Father Wathen, "...went too far".
In hindsight, perhaps I should read it now?

Domitilla · « **Reply #14 on:** June 20, 2013, 02:32:10 PM »

Incredulous,

Yes, do read "The Great Sacrilege", by Fr. Wathen. You'll really enjoy his straight-forward, "pull no punches" style of writing. As an extra bonus, Fr. Wathen, (RIP), had a real Southern wit. (Many a time I have had to stop reading in order to laugh.) Currently, I am reading his book, "I Know Mine and Mine Know Me, Vol 1".

He wrote "The Great Sacrilege" in 1971. Clearly, 42 years later, this book really hit the mark.