Author Topic: New SSPX- Novus Ordos Indulters Welcome - Resisters NOT (Read 5053 times)

bowler · « **on:** January 21, 2013, 11:13:45 AM »

Since like maybe the last 5 years, it appears that the vast majority of the new parishioners coming to my chapel, are Novus Ordo & Indult mass attendees, who out of convenience are coming to this SSPX chapel. These are people who maybe are attending the Novus Ordo during the week, or would just as well attend a Fraternity of St. Peter chapel if it was closer by.

Now it is also obvious that the new SSPX hierarchy does not want the "old hardline Lefebvre-ists", and actually prefers the Novus Ordo/ Indult friendly parishioners. The only enemies today, the only whipping boys, are the "hardline Lefebvre-ist", and the sedevacantes. The people who say that they see no changes in the SSPX, should ask themselves, when was the last time that they heard a sermon against the Novus Ordo or the Indult mass communities? Every day we receive a letter or article or sermon from the SSPX against the SSPXers who are against the accord, but not a one against anyone else?

I try to talk to everyone that regularly comes to the SSPX chapel that I attend, to learn about them and why they are coming to the SSPX. Before I use to attend a old humble building, and now it is a new attractive church that has all of the "architectural marble, and smells&bells high masses with chorus and vestments and such. Maybe it is because the new church is visually attractive, or perhaps it is because the SSPX is changing, but it is clear to me that since like the last maybe 5 years, more and more Novus Ordo & Indult mass attendees are coming to my chapel, and not a sermon against the Novus Ordo & Indult mass.

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #1 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:30:15 AM »

I think you meant non-accordistas, not accordistas. Accordistas are the ones that agree with making of a deal with Rome. Non-accordistas are the resistance.

Quo Vadis Petre · « **Reply #2 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:31:26 AM »

Probably it would have been better to use the term GOOs (Grumpy Old Oysters).

Telesphorus · « **Reply #3 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:37:05 AM »

Bowler, that's quite true.

When gauging intentions words are usually deceptive. The the partial retracement that is going on now to calm down the unrest doesn't change how the neo-SSPX lines up in practice. They have made their attitude towards resistance very clear. They have made their conciliatory tone unmistakable.

Politicians tell people what they want to hear, but they don't cooperate with people who actually act against what they want to do.

Quo Vadis Petre · « **Reply #4 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:40:56 AM »

Well, GS was the originator of the term. I don't see why it would be wrong to use it, given it was from an anti-accordista.

bowler · « **Reply #5 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:41:02 AM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

Let's not let IA terminology be used to determine the discourse.

There are the Fellayists and those who resist the Fellayists, the neo-SSPX and the resistance.

Give example of what you want to teach us.

Telesphorus · « **Reply #6 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:48:30 AM »

Quote from: bowler

Give example of what you want to teach us.

GOO, accordista, etc these are unhelpful terms that trivialize the issue and make it sound like a childish disagreement.

Traditionalism has been invaded by neo-conservatives, and the results are disastrous.

All our terms should be descriptive and generally they should be serious, unless we are mocking the other side.

We should not mock ourselves by using silly terms.

ServusSpiritusSancti · « **Reply #7 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:52:01 AM »

I don't like GOO either.

I have no problem with accordista but "Fellayite" probably describes them better.

John Grace · « **Reply #8 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:52:43 AM »

Once some folk are getting the Latin Mass it matters little where they go. In Ireland folk dip in and out of both and even Novus Ordo Catholics attend the 'Pius X' from time to time.

The neo SSPX are in no position to take folk to task for attending the FSSP or Institute Christ the King.

Bowler is on to something in the post but again we must ask what exactly are SSPX laity?

With a Zionist controlling the SSPX and the expulsion of Bishop Williamson, the SSPX can't be any clearer on which direction they are going.

TheRecusant · « **Reply #9 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:53:42 AM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

Bowler, that's quite true.

When gauging intentions words are usually deceptive. The the partial retracement that is going on now to calm down the unrest doesn't change how the neo-SSPX lines up in practice. They have made their attitude towards resistance very clear. They have made their conciliatory tone unmistakable.

Politicians tell people what they want to hear, but they don't cooperate with people who actually act against what they want to do.

Exactly. Spot on.

The Revolution goes through it's bloody, brutal beginning. Then once it has broken through, siezed power and established itself, it has to cement its grip and consolidate its power: so it becomes more 'conservative' and less revolutionary for a while, while it gathers up all the recalcitrants and recusants. Then when it has got more people on board, it can move forward again. After the violence and brutality of the French Revolution came the seeming patriotic flag-waving of Napoleon Bonaparte.

Two steps forward, one step back.

The 'two steps forward' was last May/June. We're now in the 'one step back' phase. Don't anyone be fooled. Their goals haven't changed.

John Grace · « **Reply #10 on:** January 21, 2013, 11:55:33 AM »

Quote

Traditionalism has been invaded by neo-conservatives, and the results are disastrous.

I noted Lila Rose, a neo con promoting the Latin Mass in recent times for the March for Life.

It's very easy for Trads to get neo conned. The tragedy for them is often they don't realise this.

Jerome · « **Reply #11 on:** January 21, 2013, 12:03:50 PM »

Quote from: bowler

Since like maybe the last 5 years, it appears that the vast majority of the new parishioners coming to my chapel, are Novus Ordo & Indult mass attendees, who out of convenience are coming to this SSPX chapel. These are people who maybe are attending the Novus Ordo during the week, or would just as well attend a Fraternity of St. Peter chapel if it was closer by.

I try to talk to everyone that regularly comes to the SSPX chapel that I attend, to learn about them and why they are coming to the SSPX.

If there are SSPXers whom are still on the fence, the best way to get the "Resistance" message to them is by taking a direct stand for Christ and not attend this SSPX chapel.

The senior members that continue to attend this neo-SSPX chapel, will most likely be giving the message that "everything is OK within the SSPX" as we're still here.

When a senior member of the chapel makes a bold move by leaving (after explaining the correct reasons for leaving), the one's on the fence will certainly think a lot more on this and hopefully God will Bless them with the light to see the Truth while giving them the strength/courage to do the right thing to preserve the Faith.

drivocek · « **Reply #12 on:** January 21, 2013, 12:30:26 PM »

Quote from: Jerome

Quote from: bowler
Since like maybe the last 5 years, it appears that the vast majority of the new parishioners coming to my chapel, are Novus Ordo & Indult mass attendees, who out of convenience are coming to this SSPX chapel. These are people who maybe are attending the Novus Ordo during the week, or would just as well attend a Fraternity of St. Peter chapel if it was closer by.

I try to talk to everyone that regularly comes to the SSPX chapel that I attend, to learn about them and why they are coming to the SSPX.

If there are SSPXers whom are still on the fence, the best way to get the "Resistance" message to them is by taking a direct stand for Christ and not attend this SSPX chapel.

The senior members that continue to attend this neo-SSPX chapel, will most likely be giving the message that "everything is OK within the SSPX" as we're still here.

When a senior member of the chapel makes a bold move by leaving (after explaining the correct reasons for leaving), the one's on the fence will certainly think a lot more on this and hopefully God will Bless them with the light to see the Truth while giving them the strength/courage to do the right thing to preserve the Faith.

Attendance of a Traditional Latin Mass by NO's may be to their eventual good
So I see no harm there.
The "walk-out" may be a good resistance tactic BUT where would the "walk-out" attend Mass and receive the sacraments. There are good and holy SSPX priests. Our resistance should be against Fellay et al . . . but not against a fellow Catholic who is seeking sanctity.
I am disabled and thank God for Fr. Horvath who drives a long distance to bring me the Sacraments. The resistance priests live 30 minutes away from me but . . .
Christ pointedly saved the lost sheep as a Good Shepherd. I will probably get some thumbs down and I dont understand my other thumbs down.
Take care to use the intellect and not the emotive action "or lack thereof".

Quantum Potes, Tantum Aude.

John Grace · « **Reply #13 on:** January 21, 2013, 12:32:16 PM »

Quote from: Jerome

Quote from: bowler
Since like maybe the last 5 years, it appears that the vast majority of the new parishioners coming to my chapel, are Novus Ordo & Indult mass attendees, who out of convenience are coming to this SSPX chapel. These are people who maybe are attending the Novus Ordo during the week, or would just as well attend a Fraternity of St. Peter chapel if it was closer by.

I try to talk to everyone that regularly comes to the SSPX chapel that I attend, to learn about them and why they are coming to the SSPX.

If there are SSPXers whom are still on the fence, the best way to get the "Resistance" message to them is by taking a direct stand for Christ and not attend this SSPX chapel.

The senior members that continue to attend this neo-SSPX chapel, will most likely be giving the message that "everything is OK within the SSPX" as we're still here.

When a senior member of the chapel makes a bold move by leaving (after explaining the correct reasons for leaving), the one's on the fence will certainly think a lot more on this and hopefully God will Bless them with the light to see the Truth while giving them the strength/courage to do the right thing to preserve the Faith.

The way I see things is one is either for a deal or against the deal.I am against the agreement with Rome. I accept there are people who will blow what ever way Bishop Fellay wants them to. I envisage the SSPX being like the FSSP etc etc.

An organic resistance will be smaller but in time will spread. The only way to fight is guerrilla warfare. Pockets of resistance will emerge where least expected.

The way forward is a loose network of resistance.

John Grace · « **Reply #14 on:** January 21, 2013, 12:37:53 PM »

Quote

Attendance of a Traditional Latin Mass by NO's may be to their eventual good
So I see no harm there.

I agree.