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Author Topic: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME  (Read 1497 times)

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Offline cosmas

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N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
« on: January 23, 2019, 10:07:05 AM »
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  • Huonder at age 76 is retiring as Novus Ordo bishop of Chur, Switzerland. He has indicated to Francis-Bergoglio that he wants to live out his retirement at a Neo-SSPX boarding school for boys in Switzerland. (Oh, brother!) And it seems that Francis-Bergoglio has signed off on the deal to inject the New Order mole into the Neo-SSPX. The Swiss Newchurchers are quite leftist, and Huonder is somewhat conservative, though hardly traditional. It was from Northern Europe (Switzerland, Germany, The Netherlands, etc.) that the radicals at the Vatican II Anti-council in 1964 engineered the replacement of the Catholic Church as the "institutional" Church with the heretical Newchurch of the New Order. [Some information for this Commentary was contributed by Monde & Vie.]
    True Catholics, it didn't take but a few days after Francis-Bergoglio's suppression of the Ecclesia Dei Commission, which was supposed to promote the Half Novus Ordo Vatican II New Latin Mess, for the New Order to be injected into Fellay-Pagliarani's Newchurch-bent Neo-SSPX, which is most certainly not the original traditional Society of St. Pius X (SSPX) founded by traditional Catholic archbishop Marcel Lefebvre. Now, semi-officially, Fellay-Pagliarani are to have an invalid Novus Ordo bishop residing with them. This is certainly just the first of many bastardizations of the Neo-SSPX that is planned to end in the Neo-SSPX's complete acceptance of the heretical Newchurch.


    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #1 on: January 23, 2019, 11:00:37 AM »
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  • Uhm, major red flag that he wants to stay at a boarding school for boys.  Aren't there other neo-SSPX religious houses he could go to instead?


    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #2 on: January 23, 2019, 12:38:04 PM »
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  • Uhm, major red flag that he wants to stay at a boarding school for boys.  Aren't there other neo-SSPX religious houses he could go to instead?

    OK, well, maybe not so much.
    https://www.patheos.com/blogs/progressivesecularhumanist/2015/08/catholic-bishop-cites-leviticus-claims-gαys-deserve-death/

    Offline nottambula

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #3 on: January 23, 2019, 05:28:17 PM »
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  • https://www.gloria.tv/article/XFiLRpv7Brqt2dgyorNNtocNT

    "Conservative" Diocesan Bishop Retires With SSPX



    After his retirement in April, Chur Bishop Vitus Huonder, 76, Switzerland, will reside in the boarding-school Institut Sancta Maria in Wangs, a village 30 km north of Chur, in Saint Gallen diocese.

    The school belongs to the Priestly Society of Saint Pius X (SSPX). Pope Francis supports the move which Hounder announced months ago in a letter to a selected group of priests.

    Huonder ran Chur diocese for almost twelve years. He has been a typical "Conservative" who occasionally made "Conservative" statements but otherwise ran a radical-liberal diocese, promoting anti-Catholic priests to leading positions while relegating good priests to fringe parishes.

    During his time, about 15 young and younger priests, all belonging to the Catholic wing, left his diocese.

    When a liberal parish-priest blessed in 2015 a gαy pseudo-marriage, Huonder did not touch him. A retired priest who had publicly declared that he was living in concubinage with a woman, was allowed to celebrate his priestly jubilee without Huonder intervening.

    The professors in the seminary in Chur are liberal extremists. Almost all of them were appointed by Huonder. Not surprisingly, when Huonder handed in his retirement in 2017, Francis extended his term for another two years.

    [Disclosure: Bishop Huonder is an enemy of gloria.tv which supported him in the beginning of his term.]
    "I think that he [Pope Benedict] was pushed... he semi-resigned... he didn't completely resign, he semi-resigned... he made way for another pope to take his place... but he kept, nevertheless, the white habit, he kept various things of the Papacy." - Bishop Williamson

    Offline Meg

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #4 on: January 24, 2019, 11:27:50 AM »
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  • I'm not so sure that Bp. Huonder is actually planning on being a bishop for the SSPX. It seems to me that he's just wanting a place to retire. Though it does seem rather odd that he would want to retire with the SSPX. 

    Louie Verrechio has good recent article that addresses this issue. I don't often agree with Louie Verrechio these days on much of anything, but I have to agree that maybe this story is overblown. There doesn't seem to be a lot of evidence that Huonder is wanting to actually be a bishop for the SSPX, or that Francis has engaged him in this endeavor. 


    https://akacatholic.com/cancel-the-parade-new-sspx-bishop-story-overblown/
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #5 on: January 24, 2019, 11:54:25 AM »
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  • Really, the big problem here is that inevitably the SSPX will begin to use his "episcopal powers" (to paraphrase Father Pfeiffer) or at least "priestly powers" (ordained in 1971).  I doubt he would be at the school and not occasionally offer Mass for the students there.

    Offline Maria Regina

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #6 on: January 24, 2019, 12:39:13 PM »
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  • https://www.gloria.tv/article/XFiLRpv7Brqt2dgyorNNtocNT

    "Conservative" Diocesan Bishop Retires With SSPX



    After his retirement in April, Chur Bishop Vitus Huonder, 76, Switzerland, will reside in the boarding-school Institut Sancta Maria in Wangs, a village 30 km north of Chur, in Saint Gallen diocese.

    The school belongs to the Priestly Society of Saint Pius X (SSPX). Pope Francis supports the move which Hounder announced months ago in a letter to a selected group of priests.

    Huonder ran Chur diocese for almost twelve years. He has been a typical "Conservative" who occasionally made "Conservative" statements but otherwise ran a radical-liberal diocese, promoting anti-Catholic priests to leading positions while relegating good priests to fringe parishes.

    During his time, about 15 young and younger priests, all belonging to the Catholic wing, left his diocese.


    When a liberal parish-priest blessed in 2015 a gαy pseudo-marriage, Huonder did not touch him. A retired priest who had publicly declared that he was living in concubinage with a woman, was allowed to celebrate his priestly jubilee without Huonder intervening.

    The professors in the seminary in Chur are liberal extremists. Almost all of them were appointed by Huonder. Not surprisingly, when Huonder handed in his retirement in 2017, Francis extended his term for another two years.

    [Disclosure: Bishop Huonder is an enemy of gloria.tv which supported him in the beginning of his term.]


    I smell danger. Was he forced upon the SSPX? Or have they willingly accepted this Trojan Horse. Something is very wrong here.
    Lord have mercy.

    Offline Mr G

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #7 on: January 24, 2019, 02:24:47 PM »
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  • I smell danger. Was he forced upon the SSPX? Or have they willingly accepted this Trojan Horse. Something is very wrong here.
    The move is mandated by the C.D.F.

    KATH.NET 

    After his period in Chur, Msgr. Vitus Huonder will retire to a school of the Fraternity of St. Pius X and, in coordination with Rome, will maintain contact with the Fraternity of St. Pius X. 

    The bishop of Chur, Vitus Huonder, will retire after his time as bishop of Chur to Wangs in the canton of St. Gallen and will live there in the Sancta Maria Institute, a school of the Fraternity of St. Pius X. The bishop's spokesman, Giuseppe Gracia, confirmed it to kath.net on Monday. " This step is related to the mandate of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in Rome to Mons. Vitus to maintain contact with the Fraternity of St. Pius X, " said Gracia. The acceptance of the resignation of the Bishop of Chur is expected to take place around Easter.


    Offline nottambula

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #8 on: January 24, 2019, 02:29:41 PM »
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  • Louie Verrechio has good recent article that addresses this issue. I don't often agree with Louie Verrechio these days on much of anything, but I have to agree that maybe this story is overblown. There doesn't seem to be a lot of evidence that Huonder is wanting to actually be a bishop for the SSPX, or that Francis has engaged him in this endeavor.


    https://akacatholic.com/cancel-the-parade-new-sspx-bishop-story-overblown/

    Louie Verrecchio attends the FSSP in Baltimore. Of course he can write in a 'ho-hum, move along, nothing to see here' manner. Why does he even try to be a spokesman for the SSPX anyway? To provide support for his readership? He's like Michael Matt 2.0 sometimes; playing both sides, occasionally feigning to be concerned about the direction the Society is taking, but never quite showing where his true loyalties lie.

    As a side note -- The Remnant deleted the following quote from Archbishop Lefebvre that I had posted the other day on their Facebook page (when they were reporting on the suppression of Ecclesia Dei).  Do you think it somehow pricked their conscience? ;)


    Quote
    "I think that many of those that left us to rejoin Rome (isn’t that right), did not rightly understand what liberalism is and how the Roman authorities at the moment, since the Council in particular, are infested with these errors. They did not understand. If they had understood, they would have fled, they would have avoided, they would have stayed with us. But they do not want to believe these errors. This is serious because by moving closer to these authorities, one is necessarily contaminated. These authorities are imbued with these principles, live with these principles – these principles of liberalism. Inevitably, they act in conformity with their ideas. And therefore, they can only have relations with us. They begin to have relations with us – relations which little by little impose these ideas on us, since they are the authorities. They are the authorities and we are the subordinates, so they impose these ideas on us. It is impossible otherwise. As long as they do not rid themselves of these errors – these errors of liberalism and modernism – there is no way we can come to an agreement with them. It is not possible. We cannot approach them because immediately we have to submit to their orientations."
    (Archbishop Lefebvre September 22, 1988)
    "I think that he [Pope Benedict] was pushed... he semi-resigned... he didn't completely resign, he semi-resigned... he made way for another pope to take his place... but he kept, nevertheless, the white habit, he kept various things of the Papacy." - Bishop Williamson

    Offline Meg

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #9 on: January 25, 2019, 07:31:33 AM »
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  • Louie Verrecchio attends the FSSP in Baltimore. Of course he can write in a 'ho-hum, move along, nothing to see here' manner. Why does he even try to be a spokesman for the SSPX anyway? To provide support for his readership? He's like Michael Matt 2.0 sometimes; playing both sides, occasionally feigning to be concerned about the direction the Society is taking, but never quite showing where his true loyalties lie.

    As a side note -- The Remnant deleted the following quote from Archbishop Lefebvre that I had posted the other day on their Facebook page (when they were reporting on the suppression of Ecclesia Dei).  Do you think it somehow pricked their conscience? ;)

    I'm not really concerned about where Verrecchio attends Mass, and I often disagree with what he writes. I'm just agreeing with what he wrote in this instance, which no one has really addressed.

    I often attend an FSSP parish too. But I also support the four Resistance bishops wholeheartedly. Where one attends Mass isn't always a true indicator of loyalties during a severe crisis.

    Even so, the Remnant tries to have a foot in both doors, regarding the SSPX and FSSP. They do not, however, support the Resistance. I'm not surprised that they deleted a post regarding +ABL. They did something similar to something I wrote in their comments section last year, on their blog. But later they actually put back my post that they originally removed.

    Maybe Huonder really is going to provide bishop duties for the SSPX. But I still haven't seen an acknowledgment from anyone that this is the case. Not that I trust all of the sources, but if the Novus Ordo bishop really were to be an active bishop for the SSPX, I would think that the conciliar church and mainstream media would have acknowledged that (out of sheer pride, if nothing else). I could be wrong.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Online Pax Vobis

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #10 on: January 25, 2019, 08:56:10 AM »
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  • Quote
    I often attend an FSSP parish too. But I also support the four Resistance bishops wholeheartedly.
    That's a contradiction of epic proportions.

    Quote
    Where one attends Mass isn't always a true indicator of loyalties during a severe crisis.
    Today's crisis IS ABOUT THE MASS.  So, yes, where one attends mass says everything.

    Quote
    Even so, the Remnant tries to have a foot in both doors, regarding the SSPX and FSSP. They do not, however, support the Resistance.
    You support the Resistance, yet attend a mass from their enemies.  Is the FSSP the enemy of the Resistance?  Of course, in philosophy, in theory.  The FSSP wouldn't exist unless the SSPX of old didn't stick with Tradition.  The FSSP sold their souls to be "part of the gang", to be "with the cool kids", for human respect.  Just like the english catholics who accepted Henry VIII as their pope, so the FSSP accepts the new mass as pleasing to God.

    I know you'll argue that you may not have any other options for mass, so you go to the FSSP.  But i'd say to you, as a friend, that by going to the FSSP/indult (the FSSP is an indult), that you are publicly accepting V2 and the new mass, so you are not fighting for Tradition, but are supporting a group who is anti-Tradition and bi/polar in the Faith (they accept Modernism and preach Traditionalism - how crazy can you get?).  Everytime you attend an indult, you are showing that you don't really believe what the Resistance stands for, because they would NEVER accept the indult...that's why they exist - to fight the errors of V2 and the new mass.  

    Not trying to judge you, but to challenge you to make the right decision.  The faith is more important than the mass.


    Offline Meg

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #11 on: January 25, 2019, 09:07:04 AM »
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  • That's a contradiction of epic proportions.
    Today's crisis IS ABOUT THE MASS.  So, yes, where one attends mass says everything.
    You support the Resistance, yet attend a mass from their enemies.  Is the FSSP the enemy of the Resistance?  Of course, in philosophy, in theory.  The FSSP wouldn't exist unless the SSPX of old didn't stick with Tradition.  The FSSP sold their souls to be "part of the gang", to be "with the cool kids", for human respect.  Just like the english catholics who accepted Henry VIII as their pope, so the FSSP accepts the new mass as pleasing to God.

    I know you'll argue that you may not have any other options for mass, so you go to the FSSP.  But i'd say to you, as a friend, that by going to the FSSP/indult (the FSSP is an indult), that you are publicly accepting V2 and the new mass, so you are not fighting for Tradition, but are supporting a group who is anti-Tradition and bi/polar in the Faith (they accept Modernism and preach Traditionalism - how crazy can you get?).  Everytime you attend an indult, you are showing that you don't really believe what the Resistance stands for, because they would NEVER accept the indult...that's why they exist - to fight the errors of V2 and the new mass.  

    Not trying to judge you, but to challenge you to make the right decision.  The faith is more important than the mass.

    Yeah, I heard it all before Pro Vobis, regarding the FSSP. It's so good of you to warn me of all of the dangers which I have heard so many, many times before. Whatever. And you ARE trying to judge me, because that's what trads here do. They (you) can't help it. Apparently, there's not much else to do these days except to judge other trads. 

    I'm scrupulous about attending Mass on Sundays, but unlike most trads here, I don't impose that on anyone here. I don't have the authority to do so, and wouldn't do so even if I could.

    You're doing what trads so often do - which is to not focus on the subject at hand, but rather to focus on the person who is providing an alternate POV.
    Tell me, what do you think of Verrecchio's article? Or have you even read it? Probably not.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Online Pax Vobis

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    Re: N.O. BISHOP TO SMOOTH CONVERSION TO ROME
    « Reply #12 on: January 25, 2019, 09:31:10 AM »
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    Tell me, what do you think of Verrecchio's article?
    I don't care to read it because it doesn't matter; the neo-sspx is done for.  Most likely the neo-sspx is using this story as a "test case" (as communists do) to see the people's reaction to having a novus ordo bishop "help out".  If there is strong reaction against it, then they'll back off and wait.  If there's not an uproar, then they know that the people are accepting of this small step towards rome, so they'll proceed or they'll just take this step in a different way, with a different bishop.

    It's rather telling that stories like this "leak" and then people try to chase down where it came from and if it's true.  The "leak" is an important part of the test since the neo-sspx can deny the story is true, while also getting "market research" on what would happen if it WAS true.

    Hollywood uses this to promote movie ideas (i.e. to see how excited people are about a "potential" movie); The Government uses "polls" (most of which are fake) to see the political reaction on an issue; the media reports "unnamed sources" to see how people react to rumors about a politician or event; etc, etc, etc

    How many "leaks" about the "deal with rome" have there been?  They happen every 5-6 months or so, in order to "test the waters" of public opinion.  If the people/priests aren't yet ready, then the neo-sspx will issue ANOTHER statement on how they love doctrine, how V2 is problematic and they're fighting for Truth, etc.  Blah, blah, blah.  Meanwhile, they continue to be friendly with new-rome officials, new-bishops and new-catholic organizations.  Actions speak louder than words and the new-sspx's actions are accepting of conciliarism.

    The neo-sspx is an indult-waiting-to-happen.  They will continue to accept Modernism, the new church and all things V2 until their organization is so changed/corrupted that "making the deal" with new-rome will be the LAST STEP in the process.  They are already beginning to THINK like novus ordo catholics, so the change has already started.


    Quote
    And you ARE trying to judge me, because that's what trads here do. They (you) can't help it. Apparently, there's not much else to do these days except to judge other trads. 
    I judge your actions and your contradiction mindset but not your heart.  If I could judge your heart as wrong, then I wouldn't have wasted my time trying to pull you back to 100% Tradition.