Author Topic: Letter of Menzingen- new (Read 13481 times)

santafe · « **on:** June 25, 2012, 12:59:10 PM »

Excellencies, and Superiors,

As you know, our Superior General responded to the letter of the 16th March from Cardinal Levada who tried to impose the doctrinal Preamble of the 14th September 2011. By this docuмent, dated 15th April, he wished to break free from the impasse created by this Preamble. According to several concurring sources, the new text seemed to satisfy the Sovereign Pontiff.

On the 13th June, 2012, Cardinal Levada returned to our Superior General his text of April, but it was amended in such a way that it still took up, in substance, the propositions of September, 2011. Msgr. Fellay also made known to him that he could not sign this new docuмent, which was clearly unacceptable. The coming General Chapter will permit the analysis of the entire dossier.

Moreover, I inform all the members of the Chapter, that in virtue of Canon 2331, Paragraph 1 and 2 (New Code 1373) the Superior General has deprived Msgr. Williamson of his office as member of the Chapter for taking a position calling for a rebellion, and for his continually repeated disobedience. He has equally forbidden him to come to Econe for the ordinations.

Finally, Msgr. Fellay has deferred the ordinations of the Dominicans of Avrille and the Capuchins of Morgon, who were foreseen to have been ordained at Econe this coming 29th June. The putting off of orders was dictated simply by the wish of Bishop Fellay to be assured of the loyalty of these communities, before laying hands upon their candidates (cf. I Timothy 5:22).

Be assured Excellencies and Superiors of my respectful and faithful priestly wishes.

Fr. Christian Thouvenot.

santafe · « **Reply #1 on:** June 25, 2012, 01:01:18 PM »

Here is the original.

Clint · « **Reply #2 on:** June 25, 2012, 01:10:43 PM »

Quote

in virtue of Canon 2331, Paragraph 1 and 2 (New Code 1373) the Superior General has deprived Msgr. Williamson of his office as member of the Chapter

Isn't this the same code of canon law that deprives the SSPX of membership in the Catholic Church?

JohnGrey · « **Reply #3 on:** June 25, 2012, 01:14:18 PM »

Quote from: santafe

Excellencies, and Superiors,

As you know, our Superior General responded to the letter of the 16th March from Cardinal Levada who tried to impose the doctrinal Preamble of the 14th September 2011. By this docuмent, dated 15th April, he wished to break free from the impasse created by this Preamble. According to several concurring sources, the new text seemed to satisfy the Sovereign Pontiff.

On the 13th June, 2012, Cardinal Levada returned to our Superior General his text of April, but it was amended in such a way that it still took up, in substance, the propositions of September, 2011. Msgr. Fellay also made known to him that he could not sign this new docuмent, which was clearly unacceptable. The coming General Chapter will permit the analysis of the entire dossier.

Moreover, I inform all the members of the Chapter, that in virtue of Canon 2331, Paragraph 1 and 2 (New Code 1373) the Superior General has deprived Msgr. Williamson of his office as member of the Chapter for taking a position calling for a rebellion, and for his continually repeated disobedience. He has equally forbidden him to come to Econe for the ordinations.

Finally, Msgr. Fellay has deferred the ordinations of the Dominicans of Avrille and the Capuchins of Morgon, who were foreseen to have been ordained at Econe this coming 29th June. The putting off of orders was dictated simply by the wish of Bishop Fellay to be assured of the loyalty of these communities, before laying hands upon their candidates (cf. I Timothy 5:22).

Be assured Excellencies and Superiors of my respectful and faithful priestly wishes.

Fr. Christian Thouvenot.

May they, whose calumnies have impugned a loyal son and diligent pastor of the Church, and whose intent, as Judas, is to render up the body of Christ to the torment of crucifixion by the perfidious for their own temporal good, have their tongues struck dumb. May their arms, set to carry out the profane simulation of Montini, become withered and useless, so that men may know that God is not mocked.

PereJoseph · « **Reply #4 on:** June 25, 2012, 01:14:21 PM »

The shot heard around the world ?

This is a craftily and expertly framed argument contained in the docuмent here. The pertinent facts of the situation, however, cry out against the diplomatic manoeuvring that already aims to present to the world the picture of disturbed individuals, weak in faith, agitating against a candid and benevolent SG dealing in an uncompromising yet gentlemanly manner with Rome. Why, for instance, were the Franciscans and Dominicans a priori excluded as a test of their loyalty to the SG, and by extension the accord, if nothing has yet been settled and will not be until the General Chapter ? And why is there talk of an accord with an unconverted Conciliar Rome in the first place ? Bishop Fellay is tightening his grip. Soon all will be neoconservative Christian Democrats who sit at the Conciliar table or they will be true Traditional Catholics, now branded as impious and insane. The calm rhetoric certainly does not consist with the ruthless violence by which Fellay has dishonestly prosecuted his projects and presently aims to accept doctrinal pluralism, abandoning the legacy of Archbishop Lefebvre for peace with the world.

JPaul · « **Reply #5 on:** June 25, 2012, 02:17:53 PM »

Again we see the Temple guard delivers the dictates of the Chief Priest to the diciples of "that " man.

Does it need to be pointed out that the cowardly method of hiding behind the letter of the law to punish one's percieved enemies?

This is an entirely Rabbinical practice. It was used by the Judaic infiltrators to send Archbishop LeFebvre into the wastelands for decades.

It is a good bet that the possible attendees of the upcoming General Chapter are being culled to purge all opposition and "stack the deck" in favor of the High Priest.

A self percieved sense of extended authority leading to a grand delusion of self importance is at work here. The magic mirrors in the halls of Rome have done their work. I think that there is no stepping back from this precipice now, no possible reconcilliation, and certainly no misunderstanding.

There is no mistaking the trumpets of war and aggression issuing forth from Menzingen. Timely or not the conflict is thrust upon us, the battle is joined.

A moment of decision appears to us....defect, surrender , or fight.

Roman55 · « **Reply #6 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:02:29 PM »

Quote from: Clint

Quote
in virtue of Canon 2331, Paragraph 1 and 2 (New Code 1373) the Superior General has deprived Msgr. Williamson of his office as member of the Chapter

Isn't this the same code of canon law that deprives the SSPX of membership in the Catholic Church?

Too lazy to research this. Trying to see how this fits. Will you expound? Thanks!

Philomena · « **Reply #7 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:21:58 PM »

Here is what Father Domenico wrote regarding Canon 1373.

Quote from: fr.domenico

The canons in the 1917 Code are, like the 1983 Code directed to those who conspire against the Pope or their proper Ordinary. The Head of a Pious Union is not an Ordinary. This would only be if he was, in fact, already the head of a personal prelature given by Rome. So, it is either an illegal action, or he has already signed a deal.

As to the Dominicans and Franciscans, that is simply making up the law as you go along.

SeanJohnson · « **Reply #8 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:22:32 PM »

:really-mad2:

SeanJohnson · « **Reply #9 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:24:26 PM »

Do you smell what Menzingen is cooking?

If you have not approached your priest to offer him financial support for holding true, you had better get off your fat butts and do it, before you are left in the cold.

If you can't support a priest yourself, you had better start sniffing around your chapel for like-minded individuals who will help you.

The time is soon coming that many of us will be bereft of sacramental aid!

Get going TODAY!

Telesphorus · « **Reply #10 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:26:29 PM »

This is a tactical retreat - now they can say "see we were just teasing, we didn't mean to make a deal - the rumor mongers jumped at our bait, don't follow them!"

Of course the problem is not whether there's a deal or not anymore, that's secondary.

Bishop Fellay already has departed from what was previously taught on Vatican II.

ServusSpiritusSancti · « **Reply #11 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:29:14 PM »

It's obvious at this point that Bishop Fellay and Menzingen have gotten too big for their britches.

JohnGrey · « **Reply #12 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:40:42 PM »

Quote from: SpiritusSanctus

It's obvious at this point that Bishop Fellay and Menzingen have gotten too big for their britches.

Because Fellay and Mezingen can afford to be. It's almost certain that negotiations would not have reached this pitch if Fellay and the other members of the General Chapter do not effective legal control of assets and property.

Roman55 · « **Reply #13 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:43:08 PM »

Quote from: Clint

Quote
in virtue of Canon 2331, Paragraph 1 and 2 (New Code 1373) the Superior General has deprived Msgr. Williamson of his office as member of the Chapter

Isn't this the same code of canon law that deprives the SSPX of membership in the Catholic Church?

Ok, I'll take a shot at this and let the chips fall where they may and that my charitable friends in Christ can give me their 'thumbs down' vote. BTW, if I posted a thread just saying 'boo'....well you know the rest.

A Catholic cannot be deprived of membership in the Catholic Church. St. Athanasius spells it out clearly: "They have the buildings, but we have the faith". A light beam shines on that tiny little mouse and it's shadow on the wall would have the casual observer believe it was a huge monster! Suffering is long; I can hardly wrap my mind around hanging on a cross for THREE HOURS! Good times and pleasure; especially "winning" seems so 'glorious', but the time is swift and soon the smiles fade. When the ill gotten spoils are loosed from the grip, only air is gripped and sudden shock becomes the dreaded reality.

Clelia · « **Reply #14 on:** June 25, 2012, 05:08:43 PM »

He was deprived (if indeed that is possible) of membership in The Chapter; not The Catholic Church, as I read it.

I do like the axioms below, though! Good to be reminded of them! :smile: