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Author Topic: Joint Statement of SSPX-MC Priests: Fr. David Hewko & Fr. Hugo Ruiz V  (Read 28888 times)

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Offline Ladislaus

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Re: Joint Statement of SSPX-MC Priests: Fr. David Hewko & Fr. Hugo Ruiz V
« Reply #20 on: July 11, 2023, 08:34:43 AM »
Quote from: bvmariae on July 10, 2023, 05:26:04 PM
4. SINCE THE NEW MASS IS AN INTRINSICALLY EVIL RITE, CATHOLICS SHOULD NOT PARTICIPATE IN IT, NOT ONLY BECAUSE IT OFFENDS OUR FAITH, BUT ALSO BECAUSE IT IS AN ATTACK AGAINST IT, SINCE IN THE LONG RUN THE NEW MASS MAKES THOSE WHO PARTICIPATE IN IT ACQUIRE A PROTESTANT SPIRIT. CONSEQUENTLY, ATTENDANCE AT THE NEW MASS IS IMMORAL AND THEREFORE IT IS UNLAWFUL TO POSITIVELY ADVISE ANYONE TO PARTICIPATE IN IT. NEITHER IS IT LICIT TO RECEIVE THE HOSTS THAT HAVE BEEN CONSECRATED THERE, BECAUSE COMMUNION, BEING THE DIRECT FRUIT OF THE NEW MASS, IS THE MOST PERFECT FORM OF PARTICIPATION IN THIS MASS.

Yet another repudiation of Bishop Williamson.
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Offline Ladislaus

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Re: Joint Statement of SSPX-MC Priests: Fr. David Hewko & Fr. Hugo Ruiz V
« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2023, 08:36:14 AM »
Quote from: bvmariae on July 10, 2023, 05:26:04 PM
5. ALL THE NEW SACRAMENTS OF THE NEW CONCILIAR CHURCH ARE OBJECTIVELY DOUBTFUL BECAUSE WE CAN NO LONGER BE SURE OF THE INTENTIONS OF THEIR MINISTERS. AND ALSO OF THE NEW MASS AND OF THE EUCHARIST.

So the only reason they're doubtful is due to "the intentions of the ministers"?  Does this mean it's possible that they'd align with a Novus Ordo priest (without conditional ordination) if it was determined that he was ordained in the New Rite by someone who clearly had the proper intention to ordain, such as a Bishop Schneider, for instance?
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Offline SeanJohnson

Re: Joint Statement of SSPX-MC Priests: Fr. David Hewko & Fr. Hugo Ruiz V
« Reply #22 on: July 11, 2023, 08:37:01 AM »
Quote from: Ladislaus on July 11, 2023, 08:28:16 AM
This appears to be a repudiation of Bishop Williamson's statements regarding the purported Novus Ordo "Eucharistic" "miracles".

Yup, they’ve been saying that stupid shit for years.  By arbitrarily deciding what God can do, and why He can do it, they dismiss as impossible that which is eminently plausible.  The basis of their error is pretending that any such miracle must necessarily endorse the Novus Ordo (rather than promote belief in the Real Presence which that rite attacks).  I say pretend, because this nonsense really began as an opportune club for an already warring Fr. Pfeiffer to beat +Williamson with.  Hewko realized that he could abandon Pfeiffer, but not Pfeifferianism, if he wanted to retain any faithful (who still expect him to give Williamson the occasional wallop, to prove he’s still the last of the Mohicans, if he wants to retain them).
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Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: Joint Statement of SSPX-MC Priests: Fr. David Hewko & Fr. Hugo Ruiz V
« Reply #23 on: July 11, 2023, 09:50:23 AM »
In the midst of the tragedy of the ever-increasing splintered Traditionalism movement, the historian in me finds it fascinating that we are witnessing, in real time, the re-creation of how protestantism became so splintered in such a short period.  That's the only positive I can find in the present day.

Sure, there was bickering and debate in the 70s and 80s between the various Trad clerics (same as today) but they didn't have the resources/$ to properly split off from everyone and force the laity to choose.  Such priests also still found a balance between serving the faithful and debating theology.  They still knew and acted as if mass/sacraments > debate. 

Unfortunately, now that clerics can easily find/fund any kind of building to turn into a chapel, there is no impediment to them achieving the logical conclusion of their never-ending "lines in the sand" and personal, theological, isolationist daydreams.  Instead of having any kind of prudence, or discretion or moderation - the typical Trad cleric who's "in charge" of something becomes a mini-pope, a mini-hierarchy, with dreams of "saving the church" in their own way.  :facepalm:  Childish insanity.
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Offline poenitens

Re: Joint Statement of SSPX-MC Priests: Fr. David Hewko & Fr. Hugo Ruiz V
« Reply #24 on: July 11, 2023, 10:05:35 AM »
Quote from: Ladislaus on July 11, 2023, 08:36:14 AM
So the only reason they're doubtful is due to "the intentions of the ministers"?
That's what bugs me about +Lefebvre, +Williamson, Hewko, Ruiz and the SSPX.

There are very objective reasons to believe that the NO sacraments are invalid, but they decide to make the basis of the doubt this subjective thing (the intention of the minister).

Even worse, they claim that the validity, say of a conferred holy order, must be assessed "case by case". What do they mean by this? Do they interrogate the bishops to see how catholic they felt the day they conferred the order?

"And which of you by taking thought, can add to his stature by one cubit?" - If a man does not have the supernaturally conferred episcopacy on his soul, he can't do anything even if he's maxed out his theological virtues that day.

There was a case of +Tomás de Aquino defending some "priest" in Brazil, ordained by the Novus Ordo and NOT conditionally ordained, who I understand worked with the resistance there. There's an audio on YouTube of the bishop defending the priest but I can't seem to find it now.
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