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Author Topic: Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?  (Read 8228 times)

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Offline Incredulous

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Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
« on: September 13, 2016, 03:18:32 AM »
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  • Since 2009, when the leaders of the SSPX sought shelter and safety in political correctness, they started losing their traditional Catholic compass.

    It has been commented more than once on this forum, that the FSSP appears to be outshining the xSPX in traditional Catholic acuмen.

    One example is the FSSP Catholic lecture series, that's quite popular on Youtube.
    It is so loaded with Catholic common sense, its attracting non Catholics to tradition.

    The 6th Generation: Generational Spirits: Lost Generation to the One Current~ Fr Ripperger


    Granted, the FSSP compromised with newChurch, but could something providential be going on here?  
    Could the FSSP, be morphing into the next leaders of Tradition, simply because they're aggressive at speaking the Truth?


     :incense:


    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi


    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #1 on: September 13, 2016, 04:53:44 AM »
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  • Quote from: Incredulous

     
    Could the FSSP, be morphing into the next leaders of Tradition, simply because they're aggressive at speaking the Truth?



    Possibly.  Although, something tells me that Fr. Ripperger will be too occupied with finding a new diocese in the near future to make any more of these "aggressive" speaking engagements.

    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle


    Offline TKGS

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #2 on: September 13, 2016, 05:37:08 AM »
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  • Of course, the one thing that the FSSP can't outshine the SSPX at is in providing the sacraments since near all the FSSP priests are ordained by Conciliar bishops who are ordained in a false and invalid rite.

    But there shouldn't be too much worry here.  The SSPX is working hard to catch up with the FSSP in this regard.  

    Offline Croixalist

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #3 on: September 13, 2016, 05:50:09 AM »
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  • Well, thanks to websites like Audio Sancto, and Youtube channels Video Sancto and Sensus Fidelium, FSSP priests have a fairly large library of decent homilies to listen to. The SSPX never made it a huge priority to do the same, although Bishop Williamson probably leads the way in that department due to his great gift for public speaking. The only advantage the SSPX ever had over the rest was sheer numbers and not having to worry about dancing around NO Masses... advantages that seems ready to be lost with every day Fellay keeps falling for the Pope's "good cop" routine. Who would have thought the Vatican could play him off of "bad cop" Benedict in order to knock the society off balance? It's ingenious! Diabolical, but ingenious.

    Fortuna finem habet.

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #4 on: September 13, 2016, 06:09:38 AM »
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  • Quote from: LaramieHirsch
    Quote from: Incredulous

     
    Could the FSSP, be morphing into the next leaders of Tradition, simply because they're aggressive at speaking the Truth?



    Possibly.  Although, something tells me that Fr. Ripperger will be too occupied with finding a new diocese in the near future to make any more of these "aggressive" speaking engagements.



    Father Rippenberger does a lot of retreats in Illinois.  Isn't it possible that it is Father Rippenberger requesting a transfer to Illinois? There is a retreat in October.
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    Offline JezusDeKoning

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #5 on: September 13, 2016, 07:32:09 AM »
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  • Quote from: Incredulous


    Since 2009, when the leaders of the SSPX sought shelter and safety in political correctness, they started losing their traditional Catholic compass.

    It has been commented more than once on this forum, that the FSSP appears to be outshining the xSPX in traditional Catholic acuмen.

    One example is the FSSP Catholic lecture series, that's quite popular on Youtube.
    It is so loaded with Catholic common sense, its attracting non Catholics to tradition.

    The 6th Generation: Generational Spirits: Lost Generation to the One Current~ Fr Ripperger


    Granted, the FSSP compromised with newChurch, but could something providential be going on here?  
    Could the FSSP, be morphing into the next leaders of Tradition, simply because they're aggressive at speaking the Truth?


     :incense:




    I think they are, especially as the current episcopacy (many of whom were ordained in the 1970s-80s and taught to hate the Latin Mass) retires and new ones are consecrated. You could have a Fraternity priest become a diocesan bishop in the next 15-20 years.
    Remember O most gracious Virgin Mary...

    Offline Last Tradhican

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #6 on: September 13, 2016, 09:32:20 AM »
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  • Quote from: TKGS
    Of course, the one thing that the FSSP can't outshine the SSPX at is in providing the sacraments since near all the FSSP priests are ordained by Conciliar bishops who are ordained in a false and invalid rite.  


    Yes, that is the problem with the FSSP and the Indult mass.

    If one believes the new sacrament of ordination and the new formula for consecrating bishops are valid, then I don't see any reason for going to an SSPX mass as opposed to the FSSP or Indult, other than driving distance.

    I for one have serious doubts about the validity of the new sacrament of ordination and the new formula for consecrating bishops, so I go to SSPX ordained priests.
    The Vatican II church - Assisting Souls to Hell Since 1962

    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. Mat 24:24

    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #7 on: September 13, 2016, 09:58:57 AM »
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  • Quote
    If one believes the new sacrament of ordination and the new formula for consecrating bishops are valid, then I don't see any reason for going to an SSPX mass as opposed to the FSSP or Indult, other than driving distance.

    WHAT!?  So you have no problem with the indult mass' condition of publicly accepting the novus ordo?  That's shocking.  The whole reason we're in this mess is because of V2 and the novus ordo, and the indult mass is related to these 2 evils.  

    In the very beginning, the Anglican mass was the EXACT same as the True Mass, except one had to accept the condition that the pope was the head of the church.  In the same way, the indult mass CAN (though not always) be EXACTLY the same as the True Mass, except for the condition that one accepts the novus ordo.

    No.  One cannot accept the novus ordo, even implicitly, for to do so is a compromise of the Faith.

    ---
    To get back on topic, the FSSP priests (some of them) may sound "great" and "catholic" but they have compromised the Faith by accepting modernism.  In the short term, there may be solid priests as part of their group but once rome gets involved, their seminaries will be infiltrated and modernized. Their priests may sound good, but so do some protestant radio broadcasts.      


    Offline Last Tradhican

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #8 on: September 13, 2016, 10:33:48 AM »
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  • Quote from: Pax Vobis
    Quote
    If one believes the new sacrament of ordination and the new formula for consecrating bishops are valid, then I don't see any reason for going to an SSPX mass as opposed to the FSSP or Indult, other than driving distance.

    WHAT!?  So you have no problem with the indult mass' condition of publicly accepting the novus ordo?  
    No.  One cannot accept the novus ordo, even implicitly, for to do so is a compromise of the Faith.


    Of all the people I know that go to the FSSP and indult not one of them ever had to "publicly accept the Novus Ordo". If that is the reason you go to the SSPX, then you'll have no problem with the deal with Rome, no one is going to tell you to accept the Novus Ordo or leave. The SSPX has for quite some time been saying that the Novus Ordo can be a valid mass.
    The Vatican II church - Assisting Souls to Hell Since 1962

    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. Mat 24:24

    Offline TKGS

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #9 on: September 13, 2016, 10:45:00 AM »
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  • Quote from: Pax Vobis
    Quote
    If one believes the new sacrament of ordination and the new formula for consecrating bishops are valid, then I don't see any reason for going to an SSPX mass as opposed to the FSSP or Indult, other than driving distance.

    WHAT!?  So you have no problem with the indult mass' condition of publicly accepting the novus ordo?  That's shocking.  The whole reason we're in this mess is because of V2 and the novus ordo, and the indult mass is related to these 2 evils.      


    You didn't read the original comment.  It was an "if" statement.  He is correct that IF one believes the new orders are valid THEN there's really no reason to go to the SSPX.  He went on to say that he does not subscribe to that belief.

    Offline Arsenius

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #10 on: September 13, 2016, 10:45:11 AM »
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  • Fr. Hesse (R.I.P.) has specifically said that he has absolutely no doubts about the validity of the new rite of episcopal consecration as it is even more specific than the old. He was also ordained in the Novus Ordo and never was conditionally ordained because he was sure of the validity of his priesthood.

    I'm going to trust a graduate of the Angelicuм who spent many years as what would today be called an "independent priest" rather than some arm-chair theologians.

    The FSSP is generally much more traditional than what some critics think. The faithful who attend their parishes are also much more traditional than what critics like to think. "Indult" might have meant liberal/compromise/immodest dress, etc several decades ago but things have changed.
    “We seek and we pray for our return to that time when, being united, we spoke the same things and there was no schism between us.” ~ St. Mark of Ephesus

    "It is only when something very good is broken that you will pay almost any price to restore it" ~ Fr. Alexander Schmemann


    Offline Mark 79

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #11 on: September 13, 2016, 10:47:56 AM »
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  • Quote from: TKGS
    Of course, the one thing that the FSSP can't outshine the SSPX at is in providing the sacraments since near all the FSSP priests are ordained by Conciliar bishops who are ordained in a false and invalid rite.

    But there shouldn't be too much worry here.  The SSPX is working hard to catch up with the FSSP in this regard.  


    And yet there was an alleged Eucharistic Miracle with the Novus Ordo rite.

    Is it possible that the rites are displeasing to God, but valid?  If so, the FSSP use of the old rites is valid and pleasing.

    Besides Fr. Ripperger, Fr. Phil Wolfe's sermons excel far beyond anything I have ever heard on the grounds of the SSPX: http://www.romans10seventeen.org

    Offline Last Tradhican

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #12 on: September 13, 2016, 10:48:55 AM »
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  • P.S.- the SSPX since at least 2004, when they wrote an article about it, believes that the new formula for consecrating bishops is valid. They also believe that the new ordination rite is valid. They also believe the conciliar "popes" are popes. I on the otherhand, have serious doubts about all three. If I believed as they do, I would even go to a Novus Ordo that strictly follows the Latin original. If one believes with certainty of faith (as the SSPX preaches) that Paul VI was the pope, then I see no reason not to attend the Novus Ordo as long as it is faithful to the original in Latin of Paul VI.
    The Vatican II church - Assisting Souls to Hell Since 1962

    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. Mat 24:24

    Offline Last Tradhican

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #13 on: September 13, 2016, 10:58:01 AM »
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  • Quote from: Arsenius
    Fr. Hesse (R.I.P.) has specifically said that he has absolutely no doubts about the validity of the new rite of episcopal consecration as it is even more specific than the old. He was also ordained in the Novus Ordo and never was conditionally ordained because he was sure of the validity of his priesthood.

    I'm going to trust a graduate of the Angelicuм who spent many years as what would today be called an "independent priest" rather than some arm-chair theologians.

     


    All the other graduates of the conciliar Angelicuм believe the same. They are all the modernist bishops and priests in the Novus Ordo.

    I can't believe with certainty of faith what you claim to believe.  
    The Vatican II church - Assisting Souls to Hell Since 1962

    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. Mat 24:24

    Offline Arsenius

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    Is the FSSP starting to fill the xSPX vacuum?
    « Reply #14 on: September 13, 2016, 11:00:48 AM »
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  • Quote from: Last Tradhican
    Quote from: Arsenius
    Fr. Hesse (R.I.P.) has specifically said that he has absolutely no doubts about the validity of the new rite of episcopal consecration as it is even more specific than the old. He was also ordained in the Novus Ordo and never was conditionally ordained because he was sure of the validity of his priesthood.

    I'm going to trust a graduate of the Angelicuм who spent many years as what would today be called an "independent priest" rather than some arm-chair theologians.

     


    All the other graduates of the conciliar Angelicuм believe the same. They are all the modernist bishops and priests in the Novus Ordo.

    I can't believe with certainty of faith what you claim to believe.  


    Have you heard any of Fr. Hesse's talks?
    “We seek and we pray for our return to that time when, being united, we spoke the same things and there was no schism between us.” ~ St. Mark of Ephesus

    "It is only when something very good is broken that you will pay almost any price to restore it" ~ Fr. Alexander Schmemann