Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Is Father Ringrose dumping the R & R crowd?  (Read 480353 times)

0 Members and 12 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Maria Auxiliadora

  • Supporter
Re: Is Father Ringrose dumping the R & R crowd?
« Reply #860 on: April 27, 2018, 06:28:00 PM »
Not for your benefit Ladislaus, for he is immune to correction, but for others that they may not be corrupted by his errors which lead to sedeprivationism and sedevacantism.
 
Ladislaus said repeatedly that "the Magisterium is not part of divine Revelation."  He said that the Magisterium is "extrinsic" to divine revelation and formally not part of it.
 
When confronted with this error with the evidence of dogma, he claimed that he was referring to the "act of revelation" and not the "content of revelation."  He said that the Magisterium was indeed a part of the content of revelation but not part of the act of revelation.
 
So is the Magisterium part of the "act of revelation"? This has already been addressed in an earlier post but it is worth repeating because the consequence are the difference between heaven and hell.  Yes, the Magisterium is just as much a part of the "act of revelation" as it is a part of the "content of revelation." Now the "content of revelation" ended with the death of the last Apostle but the "act of revelation" continues.  
 
Revelation as an act continues always, and will continue always until the last person receives this revelation.  For the act of revelation itself refers to the action verb, the infinitive, to reveal, and its verb forms, revealing, revealed, (have) revealed.  The verb is transitive meaning that it always requires a receiver of the action.  There can be no "act of revelation" without a receiver of the revelation.  
 
"When the Pope defines a dogma," he is engaging the Magisterium. The Magisterium is the "teaching authority" of the Church, that through the pope, engages the Attributes of Infallibility and Authority that Jesus Christ endowed His Church to teach in His name without the possibility of error.  The Magisterium is a "part of the content of divine Revelation" in that it was revealed directly  and explicitly by Jesus Christ. The Magisterium is "part of the "act of revelation" whenever it makes the "content of revelation" known to anyone.  "He that heareth you, heareth me" and whenever anyone "heareth," the "act of revelation" is taking place.
 
So Ladislaus is pretending to be making an esoteric distinction that they less intelligent readers could not appreciate.  The reason for this is that he is trying to cover up his error and in so doing, he is making a bigger error.  When the Magisterium, engaged by the pope, defines a doctrine of divine revelation it is a "part (of the act) of divine revelation" without adding to the "content of revelation."
 
The Magisterium is the necessary but insufficient material cause and instrumental cause of dogma.  God is the formal cause and the final cause of dogma.  Dogma is divine revelation defined by the Church directly by the work of the Holy Ghost.  It is as St. Pius X said, "a truth fallen from heaven." It is immutable in both its form (the truth defined) and its matter (the words by which it is defined).  Revealed doctrine is the formal object of divine faith found in Scripture and Tradition and constitutes the remote rule of faith.  Revealed doctrine that is defined by the Magisterium is called Dogma and is called the formal object of divine and Catholic faith and constitutes the proximate rule of faith.  The "rule of faith," both remote and proximate, is always divine revelation.
 
Proof that Ladislaus is lying is really easy to see.  He claimed that "the Magisterium is NOT part of divine revelation" because it is "extrincic" to and "formally distinct from divine revelation" so that it can judge the content of revelation.  The context of this claim requires that the Magisterium be "not part (of the content) of divine revelation" because it is the "content of revelation" that it is judging when it defines revealed doctrine. The appeal to the "act of revelation" was only done to cover up his blunder, and it is a huge blunder. But to claim that the Magisterium is "extrinsic" to the "act of revelation" is just as big a blunder.
 
It is the Protestants who claim that the Magisterium is "not part of the content of divine revelation."  It is in fact the one unifying doctrine of all Protestant sects.  It is the schismatics who claim that the Magisterium is "not part of the act of revelation" when they deny the jurisdiction of the pope, and thus deny his teaching authority which is derived from his jurisdiction, to make God's revelation known.
 
This is where Ladislaus' sedeprivationism leads, that is, to both heresy and schism.  It destroys the papal office by dividing its form and its matter.  Sedeprivationists claim that the jurisdiction conferred by God on the Pope directly in his office, that we know as a dogma of faith, has been removed.  By whom we may ask?  What God confers on anyone, only God can remove.  But Ladislaus wants to be "lord of the harvest" so he has no problem telling God what to do.  Unfortunately for Ladislaus, this leads only to heresy and schism.  Those who follow him in this error will find themselves in a church of their own making that is not the Catholic Church for it does have the necessary attributes which make the Church founded by Jesus Christ the Church that it is.  Their church has no pope, no magisterium, no rule of faith, and no material or instrumental means to ever correct these permanent deficiencies.  It is a church that is hopeless and can only lead to despair which is why it is not uncommon to find them returning to the Novus Ordo religion.  
 
Drew    


^^^THIS^^^

Offline drew

  • Supporter
Re: Is Father Ringrose dumping the R & R crowd?
« Reply #861 on: April 27, 2018, 07:47:29 PM »
Drew, do you have an IQ that's even in the double-digit range?

I was not referring to Dogmas as axioms, but various R&R principles (which are wrong and misapplied).  Please read the post I was responding to before inserting your foot in your mouth.

And you add another calumny that I do not believe in Dogma at all.

Ladislaus,

I refer to Dogmas as my rule of faith upon which my R&R is grounded.  You have referred to these as "axioms."  If you have evidence of "various R&R principles which are wrong and misapplied" then be specific in your allegations.  But understand this, the evidence of "misapplications" is when the end is the overthrowing of Dogma.

You are currently in a church without a pope, without magisterium, without dogma, without a moral sense of true obedience, and without any means to ever correct these permanent defects.  This is proof that your church is not the Catholic Church.  This is where you are right now.  But one thing you do  not lack is axioms.  You have a bucket full of axioms that have less substance than a politicians promise.  Maybe the pope is not your rule of faith.  It might be better to say, "Axioms are Ladislaus' rule of faith" because that's all you have left. 
 
Drew


Offline Stubborn

  • Supporter
Re: Is Father Ringrose dumping the R & R crowd?
« Reply #862 on: April 28, 2018, 04:34:00 AM »
This is both tragic and laughable.  You hold your own private judgment as your proximate rule of faith and then have the nerve to call me faithless.  You don't believe that the Magisterium and Church's Universal Discipline cannot become thoroughly corrupted and harmful to faith, and you call me a faithless fool?

Ladism: "Again, this is nothing more than the Disciplinary Infallibility of the Church ... which is held to be theologically certain by all theologians."

I asked you to post some quotes from any of the above "all theologians" pre-V1, but you will not. The reason you will not is because you you are well aware that there are no theologians at all who ever held to such a ridiculous proposition - ergo, you are lying and by now, you surely *know* you are lying. Yet, you keep the lie alive in an effort to recruit other unknowing souls into error.

You then ask a question which no Catholic would even ask because to do so would demonstrate a definitive unbelief in the divine law of papal succession and the dogma of the pope's infallibility, no different than most sedes.

You falsely claim that you are not a sedevacantist, yet you doubt the validity of the popes, even referring to yourself as a "sededoubtist", meanwhile you've repeated the maxim; "a doubtful pope is no pope" many times - ergo, you are in fact a sedevacantist. Aside from yourself, who do you think you are fooling? 

Offline Stubborn

  • Supporter
Re: Is Father Ringrose dumping the R & R crowd?
« Reply #863 on: April 28, 2018, 04:44:05 AM »
And you add another calumny that I do not believe in Dogma at all.
Let's adopt one of your own ladisms to help you understand better:

You are a dogmadoubtist, yet a doubtful dogma is no dogma at all - ergo, you are a dogmavacantist, this relieves you from believing in dogma at all.

Re: Is Father Ringrose dumping the R & R crowd?
« Reply #864 on: April 28, 2018, 09:31:23 AM »
Ladism: "Again, this is nothing more than the Disciplinary Infallibility of the Church ... which is held to be theologically certain by all theologians."

I asked you to post some quotes from any of the above "all theologians" pre-V1, but you will not. The reason you will not is because you you are well aware that there are no theologians at all who ever held to such a ridiculous proposition - ergo, you are lying and by now, you surely *know* you are lying. Yet, you keep the lie alive in an effort to recruit other unknowing souls into error.
Your belief that everything after V1 is somehow invalid is not "Old Catholic" heresy.