Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: INSIDE STORY V  (Read 14506 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Adolphus

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 467
  • Reputation: +467/-6
  • Gender: Male
INSIDE STORY V
« on: November 15, 2014, 09:36:26 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • INSIDE STORY – V

    November 15, 2014

    Number CCCLXXXIII (383)
     
    Three good young men were swept to icy death.
    Let’s heed Our Lady, to our dying breath.


    When Bishop Fellay’s long-laid plans to save the Society of St Pius X and the Church by reconciling them through a blending of Tradition with the Council were blown out of the water in January of 2009 by the worldwide publicity given to the totally “politically incorrect” views of a colleague in the SSPX, one might have sympathised with him, were such a blending not an impossible dream. But God’s own Catholic religion mixes with its Conciliar imitation, “fruit of the work of human hands,” like oil mixes with water, or truth with falsehood. Catholics with memories reaching back to 1988 could remember Archbishop Lefebvre branding any such effort for the SSPX as “Operation ѕυιcιdє,” ѕυιcιdє firstly for the SSPX but also for anything the SSPX might have been able to do for the Universal Church.

    Therefore clear-minded Catholics breathed a great sigh of relief when in that month Providence used the Church’s enemies with their wordwide media to torpedo the joint efforts of Benedict XVI and Bishop Fellay to blend Council and Tradition. And such Catholics may have had dramatic but discreet confirmation from Providence that they were thinking correctly.

    The “lifting” by Benedict XVI of the 1988 “excommunications” of the four SSPX bishops declared by Rome immediately upon their consecration, was directly attributed by Bishop Fellay, in public, to the intervention of Our Lady, thanks to the second SSPX Rosary Crusade at the end of 2008. Yet she had told him through her messenger early in the same year that if the Crusade was not this time dedicated to the Consecration of Russia, she would use the rosaries prayed for some other purpose. If these messages are true, Heaven cannot have taken too kindly to her having been manipulated for Church politics at the SSPX Jubilee celebration in Lourdes of October, 2008.

    In any case, when on February 11, 2009, three weeks after the “lifting,” seminarians from the SSPX mother-house in Écône, Switzerland, were making a recreational excursion in the mountains nearby, three of them were caught in an avalanche, swept downhill and drowned in an icy mountain lake. And what is February 11? The Feast-day of Our Lady of Lourdes.

    Mere coincidence? Or Heaven speaking through events, by one more correspondence between the inside story of these messages and the outside story of the first two Rosary Crusades? Readers will judge for themselves. If they are convinced that the Newsociety is on the right track when it seeks official approval from the Newchurch, they will have no difficulty in dismissing this series of messages supposedly from Heaven as one more “private revelation,” unworthy of serious consideration. On the other hand if in their judgment both Newsociety and Newchurch are on the wrong track, then it would make sense that, the world being on the brink of unimaginable disaster for having neglected the Consecration of Russia, Our Lady made one more attempt to obtain that Consecration through prayers launched by the SSPX.

    Not that the SSPX was ever the salvation of the Church, but that if its prayers had been rightly directed, then as Our Lady gave her messenger to understand, she could have obtained from her Son the graces necessary to obtain that Consecration, and by it she could have saved both SSPX and Church and world. It is of no use now to “cry over spilt milk.” It is of use to practise the devotion of the First Saturdays, for Our Lady’s sake especially. She will not cease trying to save us.

    Kyrie eleison.


    Offline Centroamerica

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2655
    • Reputation: +1641/-438
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #1 on: November 15, 2014, 09:45:13 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • "In any case, when on February 11, 2009, three weeks after the “lifting,” seminarians from the SSPX mother-house in Écône, Switzerland, were making a recreational excursion in the mountains nearby, three of them were caught in an avalanche, swept downhill and drowned in an icy mountain lake. And what is February 11? The Feast-day of Our Lady of Lourdes."


    Another resistance priest told me this story.  For the sake of being discreet probably, the good bishop does not say there were four seminarians and one was pulled out alive while the other 3 perished in the storm.    :wink:
    We conclude logically that religion can give an efficacious and truly realistic answer to the great modern problems only if it is a religion that is profoundly lived, not simply a superficial and cheap religion made up of some vocal prayers and some ceremonies...


    Offline Thurifer7

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 82
    • Reputation: +28/-2
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #2 on: November 15, 2014, 10:08:50 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    "In any case, when on February 11, 2009, three weeks after the “lifting,” seminarians from the SSPX mother-house in Écône, Switzerland, were making a recreational excursion in the mountains nearby, three of them were caught in an avalanche, swept downhill and drowned in an icy mountain lake. And what is February 11? The Feast-day of Our Lady of Lourdes."


    Another resistance priest told me this story.  For the sake of being discreet probably, the good bishop does not say there were four seminarians and one was pulled out alive while the other 3 perished in the storm.    :wink:


    What a pertinent detail!

    Offline Militia Jesu

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 216
    • Reputation: +0/-1
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #3 on: November 15, 2014, 10:10:52 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    "In any case, when on February 11, 2009, three weeks after the “lifting,” seminarians from the SSPX mother-house in Écône, Switzerland, were making a recreational excursion in the mountains nearby, three of them were caught in an avalanche, swept downhill and drowned in an icy mountain lake. And what is February 11? The Feast-day of Our Lady of Lourdes."


    Another resistance priest told me this story.  For the sake of being discreet probably, the good bishop does not say there were four seminarians and one was pulled out alive while the other 3 perished in the storm.    :wink:


    I'm surprised the false visionary didn't try to imply the tragedy with the four seminarians was to be a foresign of what was going to happen with the four SSPX bishops, namely:

    3 dead (+Fellay, +deG +Tissier)

    1 survivor (+Williamson)


    Ups, I shouldn't have given her this food for thought, we might end up with an "Insane Story VI" next week.

    Offline Elizabeth

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4845
    • Reputation: +2194/-15
    • Gender: Female
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #4 on: November 15, 2014, 11:06:31 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Militia, that is what I thought the purpose of relating the story was, to stir our imagination, to "connect the dots".  As part of the Inside Story.


    Offline hollingsworth

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2786
    • Reputation: +2888/-512
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #5 on: November 15, 2014, 12:01:38 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Militia Jesu:
    Quote
    I'm surprised the false visionary didn't try to imply the tragedy with the four seminarians was to be a foresign of what was going to happen with the four SSPX bishops, namely:

    3 dead (+Fellay, +deG +Tissier)

    1 survivor (+Williamson)


    Ups, I shouldn't have given her this food for thought, we might end up with an "Insane Story VI" next week.


    Matthew,
    You seem to go on a banning frenzy from time to time.  I think it may have been Ecclesia Militens this time.  Who knows, it may be me next time. ( I could care less, BTW)  Much of the time I agree with you, but your propensity for banning folks, I feel, may get the better of you from time to time, especially in light of the fact that you seem to let the Militias, the green scabs, and the holmjokes run wild.  
    This sweet little forum member, MJ, has just referred once again, without apology, to the "false visionary."  Do you know for certain, Matthew, that the woman is a "false visionary?"  The bishop, obviously, seems to think she may be quite genuine.  MJ also suggests that this "false visionary" may have been highly tempted to turn these four unfortunate priests into outlandish symbols.  That is malicious and calumnious and ought to be called such.  Are you going to let this go without comment?  MJ, with, one can be certain, gleeful approval of other forum 'Sasquatches,' speculates further about a sixth "Insane Story" from the bishop.  In other words, she's calling the good bishop "insane."  Do you believe Bp. Williamson is insane, Matthew?  You've got several knuckle-draggers on this forum who do.  Why is it that some of these sylvan creatures are rarely, or never, shown the door?  

    Offline Pete Vere

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 584
    • Reputation: +193/-4
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #6 on: November 15, 2014, 12:13:17 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    Do you know for certain, Matthew, that the woman is a "false visionary?"  


    I suppose it is possible she has witnessed the same spirit as Pablo.

    Offline Matthew

    • Mod
    • *****
    • Posts: 31183
    • Reputation: +27098/-494
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #7 on: November 15, 2014, 12:42:32 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Not only do I consider the apparition to be false, but about 94% of the membership here agrees. Something like 55 to 5.

    Objectively, His Excellency hasn't made a very compelling case for this.

    By the way, I can respectfully disagree with him on this issue without becoming his enemy, calling him insane, or any of that.

    How about I just...disagree with him?

    It's called acting in a masculine manner. I can follow someone who isn't perfect. I don't have to fall head-over-heels in love with everyone I follow, nor do I have to follow anyone "with all my heart" talking about them constantly, etc.

    That's how women are wired to behave. Not men.

    A man can leave a corrupt SSPX priest's chapel and staunchly continue to support the SSPX. A woman would tend to dump the whole group after having a bad experience with one priest.

    Focusing on the personal and the individual is the way female brains work.


    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    Paypal donations: matthew@chantcd.com


    Offline hollingsworth

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2786
    • Reputation: +2888/-512
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #8 on: November 15, 2014, 12:53:06 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • PV:
    Quote
    hollingsworth said:
    Do you know for certain, Matthew, that the woman is a "false visionary?"


    I suppose it is possible she has witnessed the same spirit as Pablo.


    Terse, but not necessarily cryptic, Pete.  Dare I ask what you mean?  You strike one as being a fairly smug, confident fellow, who is, or pretends to be anyway, always a little ahead of the curve. But it's your use of the participle "witnessed" that throws me off a bit.  By "has witnessed," do you really mean 'has been possessed' by the same spirit as Pablo.  Are you suggesting that both she and Pablo may be overtaken or possessed by the demonic?  Because "witnessed" places both parties outside that "same spirit."  It conveys to me the meaning that both these individuals make exterior observations about what that "same spirit" is doing, but are not actually, spiritually united with it in the pursuit of its evil intentions.
    You may ignore this inquiry, just as you have presently ignored my questions to you concerning Fatima on another thread.  I can well understand that you might have real problems with the visionary, if you believed Fatima to be either a hoax, or the Consecration to be a fait acompli, or in some other way believed that Lucy may not have gotten her story straight, or that over the years she went a little soft upstairs and began to confuse things.  Then I could understand readily why you might dismiss the present visionary out of hand.

    Offline holmoak

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 81
    • Reputation: +178/-0
    • Gender: Female
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #9 on: November 15, 2014, 01:05:55 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Matthew
    Objectively, His Excellency hasn't made a very compelling case for this.


    Norms and Processes for Judging Private Revelations  



    The Bishop's Role

     When an allegedly supernatural event has occurred, it is the responsibility of the local bishop to conduct an investigation, usually through a committee of experts.



    Norms for Discernment

     1) The first norm for evaluating miraculous events is that there be moral certainty, or at least great probability, that something miraculous has occurred. The commission may interview the visionaries, call other witnesses, visit the site of the events.

     2) The second norm deals with the personal qualities of the subjects who claim to have had the apparition; they must be mentally sound, honest, sincere, of upright conduct, obedient to ecclesiastical authorities, able to return to the normal practices of the faith (such as participation in communal worship, reception of the sacraments).

     3) A third category deals with the content of the revelation or message: it must be theologically acceptable and morally sound and free of error.

     4) The fourth positive criterion is that the apparition must result in positive spiritual assets which endure (prayer, conversion, increase of charity).

     These four criteria may also be restated in a negative way. There must be no doubt that what is occurring is truly exceptional and beyond human explanation. There must be no doctrinal error attributed to God or to the Blessed Virgin Mary or some other saint. The third negative criterion is that there must be no hint of financial advantage to anyone connected with the apparitions, nor must any of the visionaries be accused of serious moral improprieties at the time when the visions were being received, nor may there be evidence of mental illness or psychopathic tendencies.



    Verdicts

     At the end of the investigative process, the committee may submit to the bishop(s) one of the following verdicts or conjectural judgements: constat de supernaturalitate (the event shows all the signs of being an authentic or a truly miraculous intervention from heaven); constat de non supernaturalitate (the alleged apparition is clearly not miraculous or there are not sufficient signs manifesting it to be so); non constat de supernaturalitate (it is not evident whether or not the alleged apparition is authentic).

    The Bishop's decision regarding alleged apparitions usually does not attempt to interpret or give the spiritual significance of the events, nor to interpret the messages or identify the heavenly persons who may have appeared.

    The general criteria used by the Church in evaluating a reported Marian apparition can be divided into these three categories:  1)  the revealed message content; 2) the nature of ecstasy and other concurring phenomena; and 3) the spiritual fruits.
     

     
     

    Offline Matthew

    • Mod
    • *****
    • Posts: 31183
    • Reputation: +27098/-494
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #10 on: November 15, 2014, 01:10:21 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    "In any case, when on February 11, 2009, three weeks after the “lifting,” seminarians from the SSPX mother-house in Écône, Switzerland, were making a recreational excursion in the mountains nearby, three of them were caught in an avalanche, swept downhill and drowned in an icy mountain lake. And what is February 11? The Feast-day of Our Lady of Lourdes."


    Another resistance priest told me this story.  For the sake of being discreet probably, the good bishop does not say there were four seminarians and one was pulled out alive while the other 3 perished in the storm.    :wink:


    Wow -- that's quite a sign actually.

    There were 4 bishops in the SSPX. How many of them will survive the fight against Modernism? So far, only 1 is standing out (+Williamson).

    And this sign happened on Our Lady of Lourdes of all days -- which is significant given the timing of the Rosary Crusade.

    Quote from: +Williamson
    If these messages are true, Heaven cannot have taken too kindly to her having been manipulated for Church politics at the SSPX Jubilee celebration in Lourdes of October, 2008.


    So the Crusade was ended or launched in Lourdes in October 2008?

    Of course, this could very well be a sign from heaven, but it has absolutely nothing to do with Dawn Marie or any alleged apparitions she has received...
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    Paypal donations: matthew@chantcd.com


    Offline holmoak

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 81
    • Reputation: +178/-0
    • Gender: Female
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #11 on: November 15, 2014, 01:11:19 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • More than 1,500 visions of Mary have been reported around the world, but in the past century only nine cases have received church approval as worthy of belief.


    Granting approval is never brief, with some cases taking hundreds of years. Visionaries and witnesses must be questioned and the fruits of the apparitions, such as conversions, miracles and healings, must be examined.

    According to the norms, the local bishop should set up a commission of experts, including theologians, canonists, psychologists and doctors, to help him determine the facts, the mental, moral and spiritual wholesomeness and seriousness of the visionary, and whether the message and testimony are free from theological and doctrinal error.

    Offline John Grace

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5521
    • Reputation: +121/-6
    • Gender: Male
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #12 on: November 15, 2014, 01:26:23 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • There will always be disagreement. I myself am not favourable to the Grunerite Fatimists. The message of Fatima is one thing but this Gruneritism is another. Most people in the Indult world here in Ireland regard him as a charlatan. I heard him speak but never had much interest in Father Gruner.

    Offline Elizabeth

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4845
    • Reputation: +2194/-15
    • Gender: Female
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #13 on: November 15, 2014, 02:29:47 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: holmoak


    According to the norms, the local bishop should set up a commission of experts, including theologians, canonists, psychologists and doctors, to help him determine the facts, the mental, moral and spiritual wholesomeness and seriousness of the visionary, and whether the message and testimony are free from theological and doctrinal error.


     :cheers:

    Offline 2Vermont

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 10057
    • Reputation: +5252/-916
    • Gender: Female
    INSIDE STORY V
    « Reply #14 on: November 15, 2014, 02:30:36 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: hollingsworth

    Matthew,
    You seem to go on a banning frenzy from time to time.  I think it may have been Ecclesia Militens this time.  Who knows, it may be me next time. ( I could care less, BTW)  Much of the time I agree with you, but your propensity for banning folks, I feel, may get the better of you from time to time, especially in light of the fact that you seem to let the Militias, the green scabs, and the holmjokes run wild.  


    I fully admit that I don't have a clue WTH is going on on this forum lately, but describing Matthew as having a "propensity for banning folks"?

     :roll-laugh1:
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)