Just so people know, I retract my opinion that the SSPX has no right to defy a valid pope if they think conciliar popes are valid, and I also retract sedevacantism.

Reason 1: SSPX has the faith, and it seems that a valid pope has no right to alter the faith, therefore the SSPX are in communion with eternal rome, and not in schism, whereas the reigning pope is in schism. But he is still the pope because:

Reason 2: I now think Francis is the pope because it seems more prudent to follow the advice of priests and bishops than make the decision on my own. Until the traditional bishops and priests condemn the pope as an antipope then I will say that he is the pope, but not proudly, because I cant wait for him to be deposed, disgrace that he is to the church. Basically i am letting the bishops of tradition do the thinking for me on the issue of whether we have a pope. This position thouroughly disgusts me and I despise the liberal traitors and freemasons in the vatican, but until some traditional bishops meet together and decide to condem the claim of this man, then i will stay out of it. Holding on to the SV position would only create divisions between myself and the only traditional Catholic organisation in this country.

Might change my mind, because i still have not got a better reason why francis is pope other than 2, but i have been contemplating this for a while, and i see my place as within the church, not as a home aloner, because i hope for a vocation to be fulfilled.

Dont anyone think that this is some miracle, because the arguments against SV were ridiculous. This is a decision based on practicalities and emotion and even faith, not on hard facts to answer the question.

End of.

You seem a bit rudderless, soulguard. The waters of our day are rough and the fog dense, but you seem to have thrown the ores overboard, too, determined to wait until the rudder starts to work on its own.  

Congratulations on realizing that the SSPX of Archbishop Lefebvre was never in schism. This is truly old news, but it was all Vatican sanctioned propaganda designed to confuse the faithful as well as many of the priests and religious. As it was not in schism and continued to offer the true Mass and valid sacraments and, thereby, save souls, it really, really, really displeased the Devil and his agents in Rome. So, guess what?  They, demonstrating a persistence that is worthy of praise within itself, systematically infiltrated the SSPX (call a spade a spade). We are seeing the fruits of their hellish hounds let loose against many priests and faithful who you know to be part of what has become known as the Resistance. You shall know them by their fruits. And they are clever little sowers of cockle, indeed. Their fruits are in full bloom. You can find them in the chaos and confusion section at your local SSPX chapel. They didn’t barge in and declare war. That would be far too obvious. Nope, they are charming and polished – just like all other socio-paths . . . producers of glossy magazines and seducers of the lukewarm.


The Devil has been having a field day with you, obviously . . . “. . . it seems more prudent to follow the advice of priests and bishops than make the decision on my own.”  Yes, of course, but which ones? The ones who are being persecuted in the name of Tradition or the ones doing the persecution in the supposed name of Tradition, but, in fact, are true champions of change. The ones suffering true persecution are easily recognized: they have been left without hearth and home. They have been exiled from their communities and their reputations have been dismantled, but they are holding to the true Faith and a suitcase and far too many frequent-flyer points.

Soulguard, you are obliged only to hold to the Roman Catholic Faith. It’s found in your catechism. Read it and heed it in order to guard your soul!

Not sure why you felt the need to announce this if you "might change [your] mind ," "[made the decision based on] practicalities and emotion" and the fact that you recognize the arguments against your former position were "ridiculous."

Soulguard, there are some traditional bishops and priests who "condemn the claim of this man". You might check out the Insitiute of the Mother of Good Counsel  http://www.sodalitiumpianum.com/index.php?pid=1  Don Floriano Abrahamovic is loosely affiliated, and probably others. Then there's CMRI. Why do you need to make a firm commitment on this issue. Let it ride and it will eventually be clarified. Just follow the Catholic teaching and live a life of prayer and sacrifice and don't worry about declaring yourself at this stage.

This seems sincere soulguard and I hope you continue in your faith. I would not assert or make the claim that Bergoglio is anybody. If you are uncertain just don't make any statement about the papacy is what I would do. Remember in cuм Ex Apostolatus it is stated that even if every cardinal votes or (i) the promotion or elevation, even if it shall have been uncontested and by the unanimous assent of all the Cardinals, shall be null, void and worthless. The SSPX has the faith.

The bishops don't have to speak for it to be null.

edit

Quote from: Stubborn

The main reason most of us say he is the pope is because according to the law, that's what he is. Beyond that, there's really isn't anything anyone can do about it even if he were not the pope.  

We need to persevere and keep the faith no matter what - in this crisis, that means keep the faith in spite of the conciliar popes. It is beyond a travesty to even say that, but that's just the way it is until heaven does something about it.



 

According to the law he is not pope.....
 http://www.dailycatholic.org/cuмexapo.htm

Either way, cuм ex tells us what we are to do about it. Beyond contradicting him, no one - alone or all together - can do anything about it.

1. ....Roman Pontiff,who is the representative upon earth of God and our God and Lord Jesus Christ, who holds the fulness of power over peoples and kingdoms who may judge all and be judged by none in this world, may nonetheless be contradicted if he be found to have deviated from the Faith.

The Church is the one who established the  election procedures, and since those procedures are followed for each election, including the NO elections, the presumption is that the newly elected person is the new pope. That is the law. That is the way the Church works.

Our knowledge of his heresies in no way qualify or authorize us to determine that he was never elected as pope. That is not how the Church works.

Even though all the faithful on earth may know well that the pope has committed sins to which the censure of ipso facto excommunication is affixed by the Church, this knowledge in no way qualifies them to declare him deprived of his office, or never to have been elected -  and because there is no clergy or tribunal within the Church to make this final decision, sad though it is, the man who was elected remains the pope till he retires or dies.

SG is going through the same thing many of us have gone through while trying to sift through the same confusion - but as has been said, keep the faith and do not be concerned whether the man is pope or not - there's nothing you can do about it either way.

In the number of years I have gone to the Latin mass, I have gone to masses said by priests, who do not hold the sede vacantist position, for about half of those years. I still continue to do so, without any problems.

You don't need to talk about these things in order to go to mass or to collaborate with other Catholics towards a common goal.

The traditional bishops have about as much power as the rest of us to turn things around, we are all in the same boat, relying on Almighty God to sustain us through this storm and to end this chastisement. All we can do is to hang on to our Faith, pass it down, and remain united with all who hold the Catholic Faith.