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Author Topic: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX  (Read 21982 times)

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Offline Nadir

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Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
« Reply #120 on: November 15, 2019, 09:02:40 PM »
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  • Therefore, in an ideal Catholic world, women would abstain from sports.


    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #121 on: November 15, 2019, 10:00:37 PM »
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  • Your post contains absolutely zero justification for women in sports.

    I needn't provide any.  Burden of proof is squarely on you, since the Church has never forbidden it or declared it to be sinful or bad.  Find me a single pre-Vatican II theologian who stated that female sports are categorically sinful, bad, or displeasing to God.  THEN I might begin to listen to your drivel.

    Sports can have many benefits.  I'm not talking about competitive sports or anything involving immodest dress.  There are many physical, psychological, and emotional benefits.  Getting into shape can give one more energy to perform one's duties of state.  There's absolutely NO reason whatsoever that girls should be deprived of this.

    It's idiots like yourself that make Traditional Catholics look like an Amish cult.


    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #122 on: November 16, 2019, 08:42:32 AM »
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  • Lads,

    In the "6th Age of the Church", this is as far as they can go...




    And even then, according to Sean Johnson, there's still the problem with unrestrained "boobs" :facepalm:


    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #123 on: November 16, 2019, 09:25:49 AM »
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  • With this ridiculous unqualified assertion, it would be sinful if girls enjoyed a little pickup game of badminton and a girls'-only outing in the park ... even if they had ankle-length dresses on the entire time.

    This is just stupid.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #124 on: November 16, 2019, 09:38:50 AM »
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  • I needn't provide any.  Burden of proof is squarely on you, since the Church has never forbidden it or declared it to be sinful or bad.  Find me a single pre-Vatican II theologian who stated that female sports are categorically sinful, bad, or displeasing to God.  THEN I might begin to listen to your drivel.

    Sports can have many benefits.  I'm not talking about competitive sports or anything involving immodest dress.  There are many physical, psychological, and emotional benefits.  Getting into shape can give one more energy to perform one's duties of state.  There's absolutely NO reason whatsoever that girls should be deprived of this.

    It's idiots like yourself that make Traditional Catholics look like an Amish cult.

    There, there, Loudestmouth-

    I accept your concession.

    Your retreat from defending women in sports (i.e., your initial position on this thread, which defended a competitive and immodest volloyball team of fake trads), and your subsequent transition to defending women in non-competitive "sports" after you were thoroughly trounced, is duly noted.

    No need for all the hot air and blather to cover/disguise your retreat.

    It was already pointed out to you that the popes had discouraged female participation in sports (e.g., Pius XI: "The means employed to give health to the body, the noble instrument of the soul should take into account suitability of time and place. They should not excite vanity or promote immodesty. And they must not lessen a young woman’s reserve and self-possession which are both the ornament and guarantee of virtue.” (Letter, A Lei, Vicario Nostro, May 2, 1928), as these types of activities damage the femenine psyche and make manly women (and foment lesbianism).

    It was only after this, that you moved into pretending you had always and only been defending girls participation in non-competitive "sports."

    Of course, nobody in the entire thread was ever protesting girls participating in non-competitive "sports" (e.g., fishing, horseback riding, hiking, etc.), which are really just recreations, and not properly "sports" at all.

    To pretend that you have only been defending girls recreation/non-competitive "sports" is betrayed by the fact that you intervened in this protest thread at all, which does not concern such things.

    In any case, here is an excerpt from a longer TIA article (which Incred therefore surely supports!) to instill in you the common sense you are lacking regarding women in sports (and why it leads to lesbianism):

    https://www.traditioninaction.org/Cultural/B003cpWomenSports.htm

    "Increasingly masculine girls

    Popes Pius XI and Pius XII were addressing an age-old problem, a badly governed feminine spirit that tempts men with immodest clothing and bold attitudes. Consciously or unconsciously seductive, these women at least remain feminine, and their censurable position is still a natural one. Today a new long step has been taken down the stairs of decadence: the emergence of the masculine girl.


    A masculine young woman ... or a feminine young man?

    LA Times, August 22, 2004
    The new model is a strange androgynous figure. “Baller girls” is what some of the modern young athletes call themselves: girls who live for basketball, baseball, soccer, football – for the game, the sport, not for the skills and virtues that will help them as future wives and mothers. They are rough, sassy girls with the muscles of men, good enough to play against the “guys,” girls who have traded in their femininity in their mania for sports.

    Look, for example, at the picture at left. Is the figure in it a he or a she? One doesn’t really know at first glance if the basketball player is a masculine girl or a feminine young man.

    It is, in fact, a young woman, a popular college basketball player who represented the US at the Olympics. For some young girls aspiring to be athletes, she has become a new model ideal.

    She is an icon for the “baller girls” in-the-making who surround her in the picture at right. They wear their baggy t-shirt and shorts not just on the court, but at home, at school, in the malls, even to church. They slick back their hair tight, no curls, bows and fancy barrettes for them. They shuffle everywhere in tennis shoes and socks. This kind of behavior represents a trend toward the ever more masculine girl. Such women seem to have taken a step past the loss of the instinct of modesty that Pope Pius XII warned against, they are losing the very instinct of femininity.

    One can only wonder about the harsh and unhappy future of girls who reject their femininity openly and blatantly. They clearly have lost the notion of the dignity of the woman in view of her most noble office as wife, mother and helpmate of man. The masculine woman does not reflect a true emancipation. It is rather the debasing of the feminine character, a rejection of the wise plan of God. It is a position against nature.

    Health of soul takes precedence over health of body

    Catholic Morals are not like styles, they do not change with the times. What was immodest or indecent yesterday has not miraculously become acceptable today because of the omission or the complacence of the Conciliar Church. The words of Pope Pius XII to girls and women continue to be appropriate today:
    Quote
    “Beyond fashion and its demands, there are higher and more pressing laws, principles superior to fashion, and unchangeable, which under no circuмstances can be sacrificed to the whim of pleasure or fancy, and before which must bow the fleeting omnipotence of fashion. These principles have been proclaimed by God, by the Church, by the Saints, by reason, by Christian morality…

    "As St. Thomas of Aquinas teaches, the good of our soul must take precedence over that of our body, and to the good of our body we must prefer the good of the soul of our neighbor” (Allocution to the girls of Catholic Action of May 22, 1941).
    There is only one way, today, as yesterday and tomorrow, for the Catholic girl and woman to counter immodesty in immoral fashions, bad language, and masculine attitudes: an absolute rejection of them. For the good of the soul, certain gymnastic exercises and sports are simply not suitable for Catholic young ladies."
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #125 on: November 16, 2019, 09:56:49 AM »
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  • With this ridiculous unqualified assertion, it would be sinful if girls enjoyed a little pickup game of badminton and a girls'-only outing in the park ... even if they had ankle-length dresses on the entire time.

    This is just stupid.

    Without any qualifications, I reject your categorical absolute statement that girls/women playing any sports is bad, harmful, and sinful. 

    It's utterly idiotic.  If someone wanted to put stipulations on it, that it shouldn't be competitive, or create any issues regarding modesty, that's one thing and has merit, but your statement of position is absurd.  As you have it, if a girls' school went on a picnic in a secluded area and the started playing badminton, it would be a sin.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #126 on: November 16, 2019, 10:02:38 AM »
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  • Of course, nobody in the entire thread was ever protesting girls participating in non-competitive "sports" (e.g., fishing, horseback riding, hiking, etc.), which are really just recreations, and not properly "sports" at all.

    To pretend that you have only been defending girls recreation/non-competitive "sports" is betrayed by the fact that you intervened in this protest thread at all, which does not concern such things.

    You idiot.  You made a post that stated, categorically and absolutely, without any qualifications whatsoever, that girls cannot play sports ... without even so much as attempting to define the basic terms like "sport".  I rejected the statement outright.  Without actually admitting that your statement needs to be qualified, now here you're half walking it back by allowing for certain qualified "not-really-sports".  So where would a game of badminton fit in?  Is that "properly" a sport?  You have two teams of girls competing to get the higher score.  Is this wrong?  It sounds like you're suggesting that solitary exercise is OK, but nothing in groups.  But, again, you're too stupid to actually articulate what you're talking about, so I'm left in the position of having to draw it out from your dull wits.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #127 on: November 16, 2019, 10:06:07 AM »
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  • Is competition wrong for girls at all?  Can they play board games against each other?  Competitive chess?  Should girls' schools not even have a valedictorian?  Should there be no competition for who has the best grades?

    Your'e blending together a bunch of separate considerations into your toxic emotional effeminate outbursts.

    Make some kind of rational argument, stop emoting like a girl, and then I'm prepared to listen.  Until you make definitions, define your terms, I'm arguing with an amorphous wobbling ever-shifting bowl of jello.


    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #128 on: November 16, 2019, 10:07:45 AM »
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  • For the good of the soul, certain gymnastic exercises and sports are simply not suitable for Catholic young ladies."
    We do have an obligation to respect our temples of the Holy Ghost. In that regard, 120 minutes per week of moderate exercise is a reasonable target for meeting that obligation. That obligation can be met with modesty and without violating the boundaries of male/female roles. Women can certainly play at games without becoming sportanists (portmanteau of sports and satanists).

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #129 on: November 16, 2019, 10:09:56 AM »
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  • Start by taking modesty totally out of consideration, and assume all parties are perfectly in keeping with standards of modesty.

    1) Is physical activity / exertion wrong for girls?

    2) Is any competition among girls wrong?

    Sounds to me like you consider any kind of more intense physical exertion to be wrong in limiting your list to things like hiking.  What about jogging or even running, assuming there's no competition?  But then you never clearly articulate anything.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #130 on: November 16, 2019, 10:13:08 AM »
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  • You idiot.  You made a post that stated, categorically and absolutely, without any qualifications whatsoever, that girls cannot play sports ... without even so much as attempting to define the basic terms like "sport".  I rejected the statement outright.  Without actually admitting that your statement needs to be qualified, now here you're half walking it back by allowing for certain qualified "not-really-sports".  So where would a game of badminton fit in?  Is that "properly" a sport?  You have two teams of girls competing to get the higher score.  Is this wrong?  It sounds like you're suggesting that solitary exercise is OK, but nothing in groups.  But, again, you're too stupid to actually articulate what you're talking about, so I'm left in the position of having to draw it out from your dull wits.
    Loudestmouth-

    No need to get your panties in such a bunch.

    I absolutely stated girls have no business in sports, period.

    But you conveniently ignore that I also say that what you call “non-competitive sports” (eg., hiking, fishing, etc) are really not “sports” at all, but simple recreations.

    You really ought to read a bit more carefully before you open your big mouth and repeatedly make a fool of yourself.

    Oh yeah: And lest your diversion be successful, I would like to remind you that your presence in this thread was not to defend women participating in what you call “non-competitive sports” (ie., mere recreations), but in a competitive volleyball game, with immodesty to boot!
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #131 on: November 16, 2019, 10:14:54 AM »
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  • Gents, 

    Why not direct all that bile towards someone more deserving? Ummm… Poche anyone?

    https://www.cathinfo.com/general-discussion/serial-habitual-liar-falsifier-of-scripture/

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #132 on: November 16, 2019, 10:18:07 AM »
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  • We do have an obligation to respect our temples of the Holy Ghost. In that regard, 120 minutes per week of moderate exercise is a reasonable target for meeting that obligation. That obligation can be met with modesty and without violating the boundaries of male/female roles. Women can certainly play at games without becoming sportanists (portmanteau of sports and satanists).
    Exercise is not competition.
    Neither is it a sport (unless you are watching ESPN2, where they shake a stick and call it a sport), but a recreation.
    Generally, if it is not competitive, it is not a sport.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #133 on: November 16, 2019, 10:23:47 AM »
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  • Exercise is not competition.
    Neither is it a sport (unless you are watching ESPN2, where they shake a stick and call it a sport), but a recreation.
    Generally, if it is not competitive, it is not a sport.
    Would you argue that playing a card or board game is sinful?  After all, someone wins, hence there is competition.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Holy Family Academy - ANOTHER SCANDAL IN PHOENIX
    « Reply #134 on: November 16, 2019, 10:24:49 AM »
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  • Start by taking modesty totally out of consideration, and assume all parties are perfectly in keeping with standards of modesty.

    1) Is physical activity / exertion wrong for girls?

    2) Is any competition among girls wrong?

    Sounds to me like you consider any kind of more intense physical exertion to be wrong in limiting your list to things like hiking.  What about jogging or even running, assuming there's no competition?  But then you never clearly articulate anything.
    Modesty is your argument (ie., women can play sports if modestly dressed).
    Then I made you back off that position by recalling the popes’ teaching On preserving and protecting the feminine psyche and character.
    Confronted with that, you invented “non-competitive sports,” (ie., no sport st all, but mere recreations) and tried to make the conversation about that (as though you hadn’t initially intervened to defend women’s volleyball (ie., competitive).
    Essentially, you have completely capitulated to me, and bowed down at my feet.  I accept your surrender, and look forward to defeating you again on the next subject.
    To date, your resume includes:
    -defending women in pants
    -defending women in sports
    -defending women in makeup 
    Not very traddy, it it?
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."