Author Topic: Hiring a Hall (Read 2471 times)

John Grace · « **on:** June 11, 2013, 12:09:09 PM »

I am open to assisting in hiring a hall or suitable venue for the resistance in Ireland. We have Fr Bufe up North and by the grace of God, priests can come to Ireland.

I'm not calling on SSPX laity in Ireland to leave chapels but it is a matter for their conscience.

I realise SSPX laity will disagree and I may become an object of ridicule but my question is why have the Irish priests of the SSPX remained silent. It's not good enough and we are at war.

I happily gave them the benefit of the doubt but how much longer must one wait for them?

There is mixed opinion on remaining in SSPX chapels. Strong arguments on both sides but my support is for the resistance.

John Grace · « **Reply #1 on:** June 11, 2013, 12:17:27 PM »

The mood though in Ireland is to remain in Society chapels. I don't believe people will leave en masse.

Sienna629 · « **Reply #2 on:** June 11, 2013, 01:06:11 PM »

Quote from: John Grace

The mood though in Ireland is to remain in Society chapels. I don't believe people will leave en masse.

Likewise here in the States. I believe the word I've heard bandied about is "comfortable".

Most are "Latin Mass"-ers with no real clue as to why they are there or what the fight is all about.

I believe the numbers of the Resistance will be in similar proportion to the number that went with Tradition from the original Catholic Church (maybe 5%?)........in other words, very small.

Neil Obstat · « **Reply #3 on:** June 11, 2013, 01:23:28 PM »

Quote from: Sienna629

Quote from: John Grace
The mood though in Ireland is to remain in Society chapels. I don't believe people will leave en masse.

Likewise here in the States. I believe the word I've heard bandied about is "comfortable".

Most are "Latin Mass"-ers with no real clue as to why they are there or what the fight is all about.

I believe the numbers of the Resistance will be in similar proportion to the number that went with Tradition from the original Catholic Church (maybe 5%?)........in other words, very small.

+Williamson pretty much foresees this as you say, a small portion
will remain faithful and the majority will be swept away, just as it
happened at Vat.II.

He likens it to a swinging pendulum that takes out a swath of the
faithful with each downward swing. The protestant revolt was
a swing, then the French Revolution was another, and Vat.II was
another. Now it's the SSPX crisis. "It's perfectly normal that this
would happen this way."

That doesn't make it any more acceptable BTW.

Machabees · « **Reply #4 on:** June 11, 2013, 01:25:24 PM »

Quote from: John Grace

I am open to assisting in hiring a hall or suitable venue for the resistance in Ireland. We have Fr Bufe up North and by the grace of God, priests can come to Ireland.

I'm not calling on SSPX laity in Ireland to leave chapels but it is a matter for their conscience.

I realise SSPX laity will disagree and I may become an object of ridicule but my question is why have the Irish priests of the SSPX remained silent. It's not good enough and we are at war.

I happily gave them the benefit of the doubt but how much longer must one wait for them?

There is mixed opinion on remaining in SSPX chapels. Strong arguments on both sides but my support is for the resistance.

John Grace,

On another thread, I was asking if you knew where Fr. Bufe is residing in Ireland. Do you know where "up north" he is?

John Grace · « **Reply #5 on:** June 11, 2013, 01:49:57 PM »

Quote from: Neil Obstat

Quote from: Sienna629
Quote from: John Grace
The mood though in Ireland is to remain in Society chapels. I don't believe people will leave en masse.

Likewise here in the States. I believe the word I've heard bandied about is "comfortable".

Most are "Latin Mass"-ers with no real clue as to why they are there or what the fight is all about.

I believe the numbers of the Resistance will be in similar proportion to the number that went with Tradition from the original Catholic Church (maybe 5%?)........in other words, very small.

+Williamson pretty much foresees this as you say, a small portion
will remain faithful and the majority will be swept away, just as it
happened at Vat.II.

He likens it to a swinging pendulum that takes out a swath of the
faithful with each downward swing. The protestant revolt was
a swing, then the French Revolution was another, and Vat.II was
another. Now it's the SSPX crisis. "It's perfectly normal that this
would happen this way."

That doesn't make it any more acceptable BTW.

It would be naive to believe the vast majority will support and resist. I believe it will be small groups here and there, who remain part of the resistance.

John Grace · « **Reply #6 on:** June 11, 2013, 01:52:11 PM »

Quote from: Machabees

Quote from: John Grace
I am open to assisting in hiring a hall or suitable venue for the resistance in Ireland. We have Fr Bufe up North and by the grace of God, priests can come to Ireland.

I'm not calling on SSPX laity in Ireland to leave chapels but it is a matter for their conscience.

I realise SSPX laity will disagree and I may become an object of ridicule but my question is why have the Irish priests of the SSPX remained silent. It's not good enough and we are at war.

I happily gave them the benefit of the doubt but how much longer must one wait for them?

There is mixed opinion on remaining in SSPX chapels. Strong arguments on both sides but my support is for the resistance.

John Grace,

On another thread, I was asking if you knew where Fr. Bufe is residing in Ireland. Do you know where "up north" he is?

A contact address was given on the In This Sign You Shall Conquer website.

It's actually easier for me to get Mass in England than in Ireland. Unbelievable but true.

Ekim · « **Reply #7 on:** June 11, 2013, 02:06:37 PM »

Our chapel here in the states has little support to the resistance. Most have helped start the chapel and saw it move from random hotel rooms to the solid edifice they have now. Many are second generation and have no real desire for the fight their parents had. They grew up in the chapel and it is "Comfortable", it's still Latin, and on the surface all things seem to be the same...sorta. Unless there is a HUGE change, I don't see our resistance group getting much larger than the 20 to 30 people who come for the resistance Mass.

Sienna629 · « **Reply #8 on:** June 11, 2013, 03:08:10 PM »

Quote from: Ekim

Our chapel here in the states has little support to the resistance. Most have helped start the chapel and saw it move from random hotel rooms to the solid edifice they have now. Many are second generation and have no real desire for the fight their parents had. They grew up in the chapel and it is "Comfortable", it's still Latin, and on the surface all things seem to be the same...sorta. Unless there is a HUGE change, I don't see our resistance group getting much larger than the 20 to 30 people who come for the resistance Mass.

BINGO!!!!

BTW, 20 or 30 is really good! We'd be lucky to get 8-10 from our Chapel.

Wessex · « **Reply #9 on:** June 11, 2013, 07:00:26 PM »

The dissidents must widen their audience to accommodate other non-SSPX trads. If they reject the help of SVs they will be losing that population that left the Society over the years. Ditto if Bp. W keeps away from independent apotolates.

SeanJohnson · « **Reply #10 on:** June 11, 2013, 07:51:32 PM »

Quote from: Wessex

The dissidents must widen their audience to accommodate other non-SSPX trads. If they reject the help of SVs they will be losing that population that left the Society over the years. Ditto if Bp. W keeps away from independent apotolates.

Wrong!

The resistance is the continuation of the real SSPX.

I am surprised to read you suggesting such a thing.

The real SSPX is anti-sedevacantist, while acknowledging that the sedevacantist thesis is a possibility.

John Grace · « **Reply #11 on:** June 12, 2013, 05:23:09 AM »

Quote

Wrong!

The resistance is the continuation of the real SSPX.

I am surprised to read you suggesting such a thing.

The real SSPX is anti-sedevacantist, while acknowledging that the sedevacantist thesis is a possibility.

A real SSPX is also

http://ireland.sspx.net/monthly%20bulletin/2012/BulletinIrelandAPR12.pdf

Quote

Motu Proprio Masses: One thing is to encourage priests to celebrate the true Mass, but it is another thing to encourage our faithful to attend such Masses. The reason being that in addition to the Traditional Liturgy, sound doctrine is also required, and this latter is called into question when a priest, albeit in good faith, accepts the doctrinal rectitude of the NOM in theory or in practice.

As I cited before when I told some SSPX laity that Bishop Williamson had been expelled, they told me, they had been to Mass via the Institute Christ the King the very same week. The same folk promote JPII 'new evangelisation' newspapers and Indult papers outside SSPX chapels.

So attacking sedes is not necessary.

Raphaela · « **Reply #12 on:** June 12, 2013, 04:35:32 PM »

Quote from: SeanJohnson

Quote from: Wessex
The dissidents must widen their audience to accommodate other non-SSPX trads. If they reject the help of SVs they will be losing that population that left the Society over the years. Ditto if Bp. W keeps away from independent apotolates.

Wrong!

The resistance is the continuation of the real SSPX.

Sean, I absolutely agree. if the Resistance starts to compromise with the SVs, they'll be wrecked. (The SVs have spectacularly come to nothing - just endless splitting and bickering - "by their fruits ye shall know them ... "). But as the Neo-SSPX moves towards liberalism, it would be the obvious thing for the Resistance to be tempted by the devil towards SVism. Fortunately all the priests seem to be strongly against it, and Bishop Williamson too, of course.

John Grace · « **Reply #13 on:** June 12, 2013, 04:46:48 PM »

Quote from: Raphaela

Quote from: SeanJohnson
Quote from: Wessex
The dissidents must widen their audience to accommodate other non-SSPX trads. If they reject the help of SVs they will be losing that population that left the Society over the years. Ditto if Bp. W keeps away from independent apotolates.

Wrong!

The resistance is the continuation of the real SSPX.

Sean, I absolutely agree. if the Resistance starts to compromise with the SVs, they'll be wrecked. (The SVs have spectacularly come to nothing - just endless splitting and bickering - "by their fruits ye shall know them ... "). But as the Neo-SSPX moves towards liberalism, it would be the obvious thing for the Resistance to be tempted by the devil towards SVism. Fortunately all the priests seem to be strongly against it, and Bishop Williamson too, of course.

I see where you are coming from but a good friend of mine is supportive of the resistance but is sedeprivationist. They have Mass in Ireland though I am not involved in it.

Is it a temptation of the devil?

I'm not going to lose friends over a differing of opinion on SVism. I couldn't bring myself to support Sedeprivationism.

It would be naive to believe Bishop Williamson is only Traditional Bishop. I'm not in the know regarding the sede world but am unhappy about the bickering in it.

Fr Gallagher SSPX is well aware priests visit Ireland. One was booted out of seminary by then Fr Williamson. Fr Bernard Hall. He is in England.

stgobnait · « **Reply #14 on:** June 12, 2013, 04:51:36 PM »

i dont believe im SV, but i cannot bear to look at bergelio...