[parentsfortruth]

So from my understanding, a certain board member at my church, made the audacious statement that the people at the novus ordo are receiving graces from the novus ordo since "they don't know" any better, citing "invincible ignorance." But WE couldn't get any graces from the novus ordo "since we know better." What a bunch of HOGWASH!

PEOPLE DO NOT RECEIVE ANY GRACE FROM THE NOVUS ORDO!

I know the priest that was stationed here before, also tried to say that Muslims with an image of Our Lady (who they believe is NOT Our Lady, but Fatima, the daughter of Mohammed) are actually getting graces by praying to Fatima, and not to Our Lady.

IF FATHER BOLDUC COULD HAVE HEARD THIS, HE WOULD HAVE THROWN HIM RIGHT OUT OF OUR CHURCH!

WHY THIS MEMBER IS ALLOWED TO REMAIN IS COMPLETELY BEYOND ME!

[parentsfortruth]

Want to clarify this:

The priest basically said that the people were accidentally (or unwittingly) praying to Our Lady by praying in front of that image of what they believed to be Fatima.

It was the ambiguous mealy mouthed modernist type of talk.

[Capt McQuigg]

Out there in the Catholic blogosphere is a Fr. hαɾɾιson who puts forth the argument that Muslems do worship the same God as Catholics but because they have inferior antennaes they don't get the complete picture.

You can't blame the novus ordite priests for taking this line of reasoning because their popes are telling them this.

[Matto]

PEOPLE DO NOT RECEIVE ANY GRACE FROM THE NOVUS ORDO!

I say to myself sometimes that there is no grace in the Novus Ordo, but I wonder if it is true. It is true that there is grace outside of the Church so maybe people do receive graces in the Novus Ordo. Maybe people receive the grace to see that the Novus Ordo is wrong and in time they will come to tradition. But I guess you could say that any such graces come from God despite of the Novus Ordo and not because of it.

[Roland Deschain]

So from my understanding, a certain board member at my church, made the audacious statement that the people at the novus ordo are receiving graces from the novus ordo since "they don't know" any better, citing "invincible ignorance." But WE couldn't get any graces from the novus ordo "since we know better." What a bunch of HOGWASH!

PEOPLE DO NOT RECEIVE ANY GRACE FROM THE NOVUS ORDO!

I know the priest that was stationed here before, also tried to say that Muslims with an image of Our Lady (who they believe is NOT Our Lady, but Fatima, the daughter of Mohammed) are actually getting graces by praying to Fatima, and not to Our Lady.

IF FATHER BOLDUC COULD HAVE HEARD THIS, HE WOULD HAVE THROWN HIM RIGHT OUT OF OUR CHURCH!

WHY THIS MEMBER IS ALLOWED TO REMAIN IS COMPLETELY BEYOND ME!

I wasn't aware that this was a defined article of the Faith. For one to be a heretic one must deny a dogma. As much as you and I may hate the N.O and question it's grace bestowing ability, we are in no position to deem someone a heretic for believing that the N.O does in fact give grace.

[1st Mansion Tenant]

"WHY THIS MEMBER IS ALLOWED TO REMAIN IS COMPLETELY BEYOND ME!"
How very uncharitable. You may as well has said: " Don't let them hang around and become edified, rather cast them out and let them go to Hell." Yet another reason I am glad that only God has godlike powers. Such Catholics would have wished me to the cornfield a long time ago.

[parentsfortruth]

"WHY THIS MEMBER IS ALLOWED TO REMAIN IS COMPLETELY BEYOND ME!"
How very uncharitable. You may as well has said: " Don't let them hang around and become edified, rather cast them out and let them go to Hell." Yet another reason I am glad that only God has godlike powers. Such Catholics would have wished me to the cornfield a long time ago.

Actually, he's a decision maker, and holding these kinds of views should exclude him from making decisions, much less being the "go to guy" to talk to about decisions that the board makes, most especially.

[parentsfortruth]

So from my understanding, a certain board member at my church, made the audacious statement that the people at the novus ordo are receiving graces from the novus ordo since "they don't know" any better, citing "invincible ignorance." But WE couldn't get any graces from the novus ordo "since we know better." What a bunch of HOGWASH!

PEOPLE DO NOT RECEIVE ANY GRACE FROM THE NOVUS ORDO!

I know the priest that was stationed here before, also tried to say that Muslims with an image of Our Lady (who they believe is NOT Our Lady, but Fatima, the daughter of Mohammed) are actually getting graces by praying to Fatima, and not to Our Lady.

IF FATHER BOLDUC COULD HAVE HEARD THIS, HE WOULD HAVE THROWN HIM RIGHT OUT OF OUR CHURCH!

WHY THIS MEMBER IS ALLOWED TO REMAIN IS COMPLETELY BEYOND ME!

I wasn't aware that this was a defined article of the Faith. For one to be a heretic one must deny a dogma. As much as you and I may hate the N.O and question it's grace bestowing ability, we are in no position to deem someone a heretic for believing that the N.O does in fact give grace.

If we believe that the concilliar church is a new religion, then how can the novus ordo give grace? It is a church set up to ape the true Catholic Church. It is a false religion, so it's an equal of protestantism. Protestant services do not give grace, so neither does the bogus ordo.

[PenitentWoman]

PEOPLE DO NOT RECEIVE ANY GRACE FROM THE NOVUS ORDO!

 But how do you know that for sure?  :cry:  I cannot always get to I the TLM,  and to miss my  Sunday obligation drives me into despair... not because I go to mass for myself (I go to serve the Lord)  but because I just know God  gives me grace. I cover my head. I do not let the Eucharist touch my hands and I receive only from the priest.  

Maybe I'm just a deluded and wretched sinner, but I just don't  understand how we can know for certain n that grace is impossible. I really feel that in my devotion to the Blessed Mother,  and most recently my Lenten time in adoration,  that God has blessed me and sees my heart.  :sad:

 Sometimes it's just so depressing to deal with all this confusion.  Becoming traditional was supposed to help me, so I could move on from my intense shame, but instead my cross just gets heavier and heavier.

[parentsfortruth]

PEOPLE DO NOT RECEIVE ANY GRACE FROM THE NOVUS ORDO!

 But how do you know that for sure?  :cry:  I cannot always get to I the TLM,  and to miss my  Sunday obligation drives me into despair... not because I go to mass for myself (I go to serve the Lord)  but because I just know God  gives me grace. I cover my head. I do not let the Eucharist touch my hands and I receive only from the priest.  

Maybe I'm just a deluded and wretched sinner, but I just don't  understand how we can know for certain n that grace is impossible. I really feel that in my devotion to the Blessed Mother,  and most recently my Lenten time in adoration,  that God has blessed me and sees my heart.  :sad:

 Sometimes it's just so depressing to deal with all this confusion.  Becoming traditional was supposed to help me, so I could move on from my intense shame, but instead my cross just gets heavier and heavier.

The novus ordo, is a man worshipping service, set up not for the worship of God, but for the worship of MAN set up against God. You are under no obligation to attend it whatsoever.

Yes, the Church told us that Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation we should go to Mass, but if we -cannot- go to Mass, would God want us to go somewhere that will at least endanger our souls, and at worst, be against the First Commandment of "worshipping strange gods before Me?"

There is a saint that rather would have died than receive communion from a heretic. Read the life of Saint Hermenegild.

You are under no obligation to imperil your soul by going to the bogus ordo.

To answer your question. YES, I AM 100% sure!

[MyrnaM]

There is such a grace known as actual grace, it is given to all and urges us to act on something good.  Example:  If you are instructing a novus ordo person, to research and look into how the Church was.  Today and for the past decades, however, it has led so many outside the church and into a new religion.  That person is receiving actual grace, grace to act on what you are telling them, however if they walk away, and refuse to look into it, the grace disappears once it is rejected.  

[Nishant]

Muslims with an image of Our Lady (who they believe is NOT Our Lady, but Fatima, the daughter of Mohammed)

The Mohammedans do reverence Our Lady highly, as a holy and devout woman, though not as the Mother of God.  The Portugese town was so named by a Christian prince who fell in love with a Mohammedan girl named Fatima. Our Lady's choice of this town, so that she would be known to future generations as Our Lady of Fatima, perhaps indicates she has a plan to lead these poor erring souls one day to true faith in her Son.

[parentsfortruth]

Muslims with an image of Our Lady (who they believe is NOT Our Lady, but Fatima, the daughter of Mohammed)

The Mohammedans do reverence Our Lady highly, as a holy and devout woman, though not as the Mother of God.  The Portugese town was so named by a Christian prince who fell in love with a Mohammedan girl named Fatima. Our Lady's choice of this town, so that she would be known to future generations as Our Lady of Fatima, perhaps indicates she has a plan to lead these poor erring souls one day to true faith in her Son.

They don't even believe she's the Mother of Jesus in that image, much less Our Lady, or the Mother of God. They believe that image is of the daughter of Mohammed!

[PerEvangelicaDicta]

There is such a grace known as actual grace, it is given to all and urges us to act on something good.  Example:  If you are instructing a novus ordo person, to research and look into how the Church was.  Today and for the past decades, however, it has led so many outside the church and into a new religion.  That person is receiving actual grace, grace to act on what you are telling them, however if they walk away, and refuse to look into it, the grace disappears once it is rejected.  

In regard to the novus ordo vs tridentine rite, I am not wise enough to know about whether or what grace is derived, if any.  But to MyrnaM's statement, it may be the difference between actual vs sanctifying grace.  

[ServusSpiritusSancti]

So from my understanding, a certain board member at my church, made the audacious statement that the people at the novus ordo are receiving graces from the novus ordo since "they don't know" any better, citing "invincible ignorance." But WE couldn't get any graces from the novus ordo "since we know better." What a bunch of HOGWASH!

PEOPLE DO NOT RECEIVE ANY GRACE FROM THE NOVUS ORDO!

I know the priest that was stationed here before, also tried to say that Muslims with an image of Our Lady (who they believe is NOT Our Lady, but Fatima, the daughter of Mohammed) are actually getting graces by praying to Fatima, and not to Our Lady.

IF FATHER BOLDUC COULD HAVE HEARD THIS, HE WOULD HAVE THROWN HIM RIGHT OUT OF OUR CHURCH!

WHY THIS MEMBER IS ALLOWED TO REMAIN IS COMPLETELY BEYOND ME!

I wasn't aware that this was a defined article of the Faith. For one to be a heretic one must deny a dogma. As much as you and I may hate the N.O and question it's grace bestowing ability, we are in no position to deem someone a heretic for believing that the N.O does in fact give grace.

If we believe that the concilliar church is a new religion, then how can the novus ordo give grace? It is a church set up to ape the true Catholic Church. It is a false religion, so it's an equal of protestantism. Protestant services do not give grace, so neither does the bogus ordo.

Those who attend the NO without knowing it's wrong won't be held accountable on Judgement Day.

It's those who know the truth about Vatican II and attend the NO anyway that are sinning.