A word to curioustrad:

It's not anyone's job to answer your disingenuous questions on this forum.

Your opening post shows arrogance towards and contempt for Father Pfeiffer.

You're a disgrace.

Relax, Telesphorus.  He's on our side.  

Relax, Telesphorus.  He's on our side.  

Then let him act like it.  Instead he posts like a troll.

When somebody starts their own church we need to make sure it professes the One Holy Catholic Faith - the Apostolic part will follow in due course - no doubt.

Exhibit A.

What is curioustrad trying to say here, that Fr. Pfeiffer, Bishop Williamson, and the rest of the resistance have started their own church?

I don't consider someone like that to be on the side of the resistance. This forum supports the resistance, we don't need to question them or insult them when all they're doing is remaining faithful to the mission of Archbishop Lefebvre.

Fr. Cekada does not claim to follow the mission of Archbishop Lefebvre. He still speaks well of the Archbishop but also sometimes criticizes him.

Quote from: ServusSpiritusSancti

Fr. Cekada does not claim to follow the mission of Archbishop Lefebvre. He still speaks well of the Archbishop but also sometimes criticizes him.

Well he must be following some mission or other or what religion is he ? Don't you see the point about the unity of the Church as an essential sign of the presence (or absence) of the Church Herself ?

He is with Bishop Dolan and the SGG (St. Gertrude the Great) in Cincinnati, Ohio.

I agree that it is a shame there isn't more unity amongst Traditional Catholics, but I think the resistance had no choice but to part ways with the Neo-SSPX.

This whole thread began as a question/response to Pablo the Mexican who asked us to pray for the repose of the soul of a Novus Ordo priest. Now I have absolutely no qualms about praying for Fr. Hurtado. However, I have always heard Trads in the mould of the Archbishop decry the modern church as not being Catholic. There reigns among Trads a kind of schizophrenia: the Novus Ordo is and is not the Catholic Church and Trads are also the Catholic Church.

Faced with this ecclesial crisis one has to adopt a certain approach as to whether the conciliar church is (a) Catholic and (b) to be obeyed. Now most Trads over here would say the conciliar church is NOT Catholic and NOT to be obeyed - I agree.

Problem: If the official apparatus is not Catholic and not to be obeyed, then where is the Catholic Church ? All theologians and canonists prior to the Council speak in terms of "profession of Faith" as a prerequisite for membership in the church, but unity of government is also essential, i.e. submission to the Roman Pontiff and the Catholic bishops in communion with him. Thus two essential credentials must be established: what Faith is professed (what do they believe) and are they in union with the Roman Pontiff ?

The original question was a request of the SSPX-SO to make an official statement as to what this group believes. Any Catholic may ask a priest what he believes i.e. for the Faith he professes, and most crucially what position they take as regards the question of submission to the Roman Pontiff.

The minute somebody starts talking episcopal consecration, we're no longer talking about the reception of "just another order" we're talking about the issue of submission to the Roman Pontiff and the unity of the Church.

Archbishop Lefebvre was acutely aware of this second problem - ecclesial unity - and in the 1974 declaration and the letter to the 4 bishops addresses the unity issue in conjunction with the lack of profession of Faith in the conciliar church. In other words he proceeded to consecrate to perpetuate the priesthood because there was a failure to profess the Faith by the conciliarists. Now Archbsihop Lefebvre wandered all over the place on these questions as the sedes and Bishop Williamson all admit until the consecrations and then he never wavered. If the Archbishop could make a simple declaration of his theological reasons for disobeying Rome in 1974 and the reasons for proceeding with an episcopal consecration without pontifical mandate in 1988, is it too much to ask for a small group of Trad priests to draw up a theological statement of principles and reasons for seeking episcopal consecration (when the need arises) ?

That's all I'm saying.