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Offline Neil Obstat

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« Reply #15 on: July 13, 2012, 09:53:14 PM »
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  • Well now, that's more like it!

    Not only English, but a translation that smacks of credulity! I LOVE it!

    Very well composed, and quite daring, I might add. With the one caveat; perhaps
    due to some translational gloss, I would take issue with the following paragraph:

    Quote
    These expeditious methods hold no surprise, because modernist Rome has adopted those of the Italian mafia, which had denounced the founder Archbishop Lefebvre during his time. But the bishops that he had consecrated in 1988 have not learned this lesson.


    I would say, that THREE of the bishops consecrated in 1988 have not learned this
    lesson, but the ONE who has learned it has been barred at the door from gaining
    entrance because he doesn't have a "wedding garment!"

    What's a "wedding garment?" That's what you get when you indicate, by way of
    some kind of occult test, that you don't appear to think Rome has adopted the
    expeditious methods of the Italian mafia, which had denounced the founder
    +Lefebvre during his lifetime.

    The devil doesn't create anything. He just copies stuff.

    So now +Williamson would be bound hand and foot, and cast into the exterior
    darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth, but wait -- if he's weeping
    and gnashing, why is his EC 261 so calm and laden with resolve?

    When the martyrs go to their martyrdom, they are quite often given the strength
    to endure it with aplomb and dignity, for the edification of the faithful.

    It should be to our assignment to re-double our prayers, that perhaps the other
    two bishops who were not barred, and the other 39 "capitulants" might find it in
    their hearts to not capitulate!
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    Offline Sigismund

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    « Reply #16 on: July 13, 2012, 09:53:26 PM »
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  • Masonic infiltrators?  Was that from a comedian?!?
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    « Reply #17 on: July 13, 2012, 10:01:16 PM »
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  • Well, I read it and I didn't see any such accusation.  

    Maybe I just didn't want to, but I did not see one.

    You can hardly argue that the same Freemasons that have wormed their way into
    the Vatican don't have the same designs on the SSPX, whether they've succeeded or
    not -- maybe it's the possibility that looks like an accusation from French to English?
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    Offline Matthew

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    « Reply #18 on: July 13, 2012, 11:25:37 PM »
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  • There is no other way to interpret these lines:

    Quote
    This vote also expresses the consecration of the Roman agent (for setbacks), Bishop Williamson, as a figure devoted to opposing the re-amalgamation (head of the "second ring" – the British management of opposites).

    Thus, Roman and Anglo-Saxon Masonry doubles its domination by strengthening the position of its servant, Bishop Fellay, and that of his opponent to [his] orders, Bishop Williamson.

    The priests, incredulous and ignorant of the history of subversion in the Church and the SSPX, will just have to choose between the plague and cholera.
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    « Reply #19 on: July 13, 2012, 11:59:11 PM »
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  • Something tells me we're just starting to see the contents of Pandora's box, as
    Bishop Alphonso calls it.

    There is something really sinister about +Fellay's insistence on this deal business,
    and now that the GC is underway, there is something sinister about what is being
    said about it, even in the absence of news coverage. To top it off, the way that
    outside observers are looking at what's being said is all over the map.

    I have a friend who thinks the best approach is to just wait and see what happens.
    I don't care for that approach, but I don't want to be part of the misinformed, either.
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    Offline Sunbeam

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    « Reply #20 on: July 14, 2012, 07:02:48 AM »
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  • Neil Obstat,

    Thank you for the apology, which, I am happy to accept.

    Unfortunately, as you can now see, my efforts were to of no avail since Matthew has hastily deleted them, as well as the original post from Infiguris.

    I think Matthew has misunderstood the drift of the original text.
    I do not think the author was accusing the SSPX bishops of being Freemasons, but was alluding to the bishops being used one way or another to serve the ends of Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ (ie: the destruction of the Church).

    Thus I think the author sees the +Fellay / +Williamson conflict as a pincer movement for crushing all that remains in common between them, even if the combatants do not recognize the situation for what it is.

    Offline Sunbeam

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    « Reply #21 on: July 14, 2012, 09:06:19 AM »
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  • I suspected that the French text previously posted above by Infiguris and now banned by Matthew had originated from Fr Basilio Meramo in Brazil (and was, therefore, already a translation before I came to touch it.)

    Now here is a text about the General Chapter that most certainly originated from Fr Meramo:

    La pantomime de l’expulsion de Monseigneur Williamson, un abus que l’on cherche à couvrir
    du pieux manteau du droit et de la justice


    L’hypocrisise trône en majesté au « Chapitre général »

    Cher Fabián,

        Comme la mesure consistant à expulser Mgr Williamson du Chapitre général fut à tous égards abusive et contraire au droit, Mgr Fellay – qui l’avait prise – a organisé un vote à seule fin de l’avaliser ; or, en tout état de cause, le Chapitre n’est habilité à exclure aucun de ses membres, qui ont tous le droit d’y siéger en vertu des Statuts de la Fraternité.

        Ce qui eût été licite (à condition d’être justifié par ailleurs), c’eût été d’expulser l’intéressé de la Fraternité, et même dans ce cas, il n’eût pas été permis par les Statuts de l’exclure d’un chapitre.

        Un tel abus, que l’on cherche à couvrir du pieux manteau du droit et de la justice, a de quoi surprendre. Il démontre une fois de plus la manière d’agir pharisaïque de Mgr Fellay et de ceux qui se plient à ses décisions tyranniques.

        La seule chose qu’ils auraient pu légalement se permettre – quelle que soit leur inimitié pour Mgr Williamson – aurait été, soit de supporter l’intéressé, soit de l’expulser pour une cause valable éventuelle, mais non de se livrer à toute cette pantomime consistant à prendre une mesure « de droit » qui ne tient précisément pas debout sur le plan juridique.

        Cela, il fallait que ce soit dit.

        Je vous donne l’accolade dans le Christ, et que Dieu vous bénisse !

        Abbé Basilio Méramo
        Bogotá, le 13 juillet 2012


    http://wordpress.catholicapedia.net/

    My translation:

    The pantomime of the expulsion of Bishop Williamson :
    an abuse that they seek to cover in the pious cloak of law and justice


    The hypocrisy enthroned in majesty at the "General Chapter"
     
    Dear Fabian,

         As the measure, consisting of expelling Bishop Williamson from the General Chapter, was in all respects abusive and contrary to law, Bishop Fellay - who had taken it – had organised a vote for the sole purpose of endorsing it; but in any event, the Chapter is not empowered to expel any of its members, who, under the Statutes of the Fraternity, all have the right to a seat.

         What would have been lawful (on condition of it being otherwise justified), would have been to expel the person from the Fraternity, and even in that case, it would not have been permitted by the Constitution to exclude him from the chapter.

         Such abuse, which is sought to cover the pious cloak of law and justice, is what has to be surprising. It demonstrates once again the pharisaical way of acting on the part of Bishop Fellay and of those who bow to his tyrannical decisions.

         The only thing they could legally permit – whatever their animosity towards Bishop Williamson – would have been either to support the person concerned or to expel him for a possibly valid cause, but not to engage in all this pantomime of taking a measure of "law" that does not precisely stand up in law.

         This, had to be said.

         I give you an embrace in Christ, and may God bless you!

    Father Basilio Méramo
    Bogotá, 13 July 2012

    Offline Sunbeam

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    « Reply #22 on: July 14, 2012, 09:14:23 AM »
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  • CORRECTION

    In the above:
    “Such abuse, which is sought to cover the pious cloak of law and justice, is what has to be surprising.”
    should read
    “Such abuse, which they seek to cover with the pious cloak of law and justice, is what has to be surprising”


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    « Reply #23 on: July 14, 2012, 09:39:37 AM »
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  • Quote from: Sunbeam
    Neil Obstat,

    Thank you for the apology, which, I am happy to accept.

    Unfortunately, as you can now see, my efforts were to of no avail since Matthew has hastily deleted them, as well as the original post from Infiguris.

    I think Matthew has misunderstood the drift of the original text.
    I do not think the author was accusing the SSPX bishops of being Freemasons, but was alluding to the bishops being used one way or another to serve the ends of Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ (ie: the destruction of the Church).

    Thus I think the author sees the +Fellay / +Williamson conflict as a pincer movement for crushing all that remains in common between them, even if the combatants do not recognize the situation for what it is.


    Thank you.

    As I recall the translation you provided, what you say here is how I read it, too.

    I think it might have been a nuance in the grammar or something. Translations
    can be imprecise in ways that slip through the cracks, as they say.  

    Your next item, above, is less edgy, so it's probably going to survive the ax.

    But if a member is expelled from the Fraternity, how could he still have a seat in
    the Chapter? That seems odd.

    Quote

        What would have been lawful (on condition of it being otherwise justified), would have been to expel the person from the Fraternity, and even in that case, it would not have been permitted by the Constitution to exclude him from the chapter.
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    Offline Sunbeam

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    « Reply #24 on: July 14, 2012, 09:43:06 AM »
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  • FOR THE RECORD

    The French text posted by Infiguris and banned from CathInfo can be found here:  

    La subversion de la FSSPX vient de marquer une nouvelle étape.



    Offline Kelley

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    « Reply #25 on: July 14, 2012, 10:50:22 AM »
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  • SSPX Press Communiqué of July 14, 2012

    The General Chapter of the Society of Saint Pius X ended this Saturday, July 14, 2012, in Econe (Switzerland).
    Gathered near Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre’s tomb, the capitularies have given thanks to God for the profound unity that prevailed among them during all these workdays.
     
    The General Chapter will soon make a statement to Rome, which will then be made public.
     
    The General Superior, Bishop Fellay, thanks deeply all the priests and faithfuls for their fervent prayers during this chapter.


    Source: Dici


    Offline Maria Auxiliadora

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    « Reply #26 on: July 14, 2012, 02:18:25 PM »
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  • Quote from: Kelley
    SSPX Press Communiqué of July 14, 2012

    The General Chapter of the Society of Saint Pius X ended this Saturday, July 14, 2012, in Econe (Switzerland).
    Gathered near Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre’s tomb, the capitularies have given thanks to God for the profound unity that prevailed among them during all these workdays.
     
    The General Chapter will soon make a statement to Rome, which will then be made public.
     
    The General Superior, Bishop Fellay, thanks deeply all the priests and faithfuls for their fervent prayers during this chapter.


    Source: Dici


    The statement above (changed to red) was changed to:

    The General Chapter will soon make a common statement to Rome...

    Does that change mean anything to you?
    The love of God be your motivation, the will of God your guiding principle, the glory of God your goal.
    (St. Clement Mary Hofbauer)

    Offline Sunbeam

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    « Reply #27 on: July 14, 2012, 04:52:06 PM »
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  • Here, at the suggestion of Neil Obstat, is another short commentary from Fr Basilio Meramo touching upon the subject of this thread.

    Allowance needs to be made for the facts, firstly that Fr Meramo writes in a satirical style using metaphors that invite reflection, and secondly that the French (at least as it appears to me) is a rather stilted translation from the original Portuguese.

    LA DANSE MACABRE

    On sait, à présent, pour quelle raison Monseigneur Fellay a dit et affirmé – sans que s’y arrêtent la plupart des clercs, y compris les trois autres évêques (qui ne s’opposent que médiocrement à lui), et des fidèles – qu’il acceptait le concile Vatican II à 95%, aussi inouï que cela puisse paraître. Si on le sait, c’est parce que Mgr Fellay le montre par son va-et-vient dialectique (ou sa danse macabre) en disant qu’on ne doit pas voir une super-hérésie dans le concile Vatican II, alors même que toute la révolution liturgique, morale et doctrinale repose sur ledit concile (cf. sa lettre aux trois évêques du 14 avril dernier).

    Ainsi que le déclare en outre notre gourou éclairé par la lumière divine, celle-ci fait voir (révèle) à son âme mystique que l’on a exagéré en imputant à Vatican II les erreurs dues à l’interprétation et à l’application erronées du Concile, ce qu’ont toujours dit le cardinal moderniste Ratzinger et presque toute la mouvance mi-libérale, mi-conservatrice, mais qu’a toujours nié Monseigneur Lefebvre, car les erreurs en question sont dues non pas aux mauvaises interprétations du Concile, mais au Concile lui-même.

    Ces deux années de conversations et de dialogues axées sur la recherche d’un accord montrent à présent leurs effets dans l’encéphale comprimé de Monseigneur Fellay, qui parvient aujourd’hui à voir et à comprendre ce qui était auparavant inaccessible aux neurones engourdis de sa masse cérébrale, mais qui – passée cette période de dialogue doctrinal – allume l’étincelle l’illuminant désormais, à savoir que ce que d’aucuns dénoncent comme étant les erreurs du Concile provient en réalité d’une incompréhension de celui-ci. EUREKA, s’est exclamé Archimède ! Encore heureux qu’il ait pensé à sortir de l’eau malgré l’extase où l’avait plongé sa découverte…

    Et comme si cela ne suffisait pas, il avance une troisième raison qui le conforte un peu plus encore dans sa position suggérée par la grâce de Dieu : il y a des choses plus importantes que le très controversé Vatican II, cette pomme de discorde du Jardin d’Éden (à moins que ce ne soit son succédané suisse, la pomme de Guillaume Tell). En effet, l’Église a des problèmes encore plus graves à résoudre, et nous sommes avant tout les enfants de l’Église, non ceux de la Résistance au Concile.

    On perçoit aujourd’hui la dialectique de constant va-et-vient (le double langage) qu’emploie Monseigneur Fellay, cette marionnette mue par des fils invisibles au bout desquels elle se livre à sa danse macabre. Et il menace ou fait décapiter quiconque ne suit pas le rythme de sa mélodieuse musique, car comme le joueur de flûte de Hamelin, il entraîne des rats dans la rivière, où ils se noient.

    Ainsi le voit-on exclure des ordinations et du Chapitre Général un évêque, Monseigneur Williamson, et décider au dernier moment de ne pas ordonner des moines d’Avrillé et de Morgon tant qu’ils n’auront pas témoigné de leur loyauté envers lui. J’espère que tout cela n’est qu’un symptôme de ce qu’on appelle dans les Alpes le mal des montagnes (à bon entendeur, salut), surtout si le grand chef est un gourou alpin doté d’une mitre et d’un pouvoir et s’il est soutenu de manière occulte par la Rome apostate et antéchristique, ce qui réalise les prophéties de La Salette devant nos yeux incrédules.

    Abbé Basilio Méramo

    Bogotá, 5 juillet 2012


    http://wordpress.catholicapedia.net/

    DANCE MACABRE

    We know, now, for what reason Bishop Fellay said and asserted -- without stopping himself there -- to most of the clerics, including the three other bishops (who are only moderately opposed to him), and to the faithful -- that (as incredible as it may appear) he accepts 95% of the Second Vatican Council. If we know it, it is because Bishop Fellay shows it by his back-and-forth dialectic (or his dance of death) saying that we should not see a super-heresy in Vatican II, even though the entire liturgical, moral and doctrinal revolution, is based upon the said council (see his letter to the three bishops of last April 14).

    As further declared by our guru, illumined by the divine light, it is shown (revealed) to his mystical soul that they have gone too far by imputing to Vatican II errors that are due to the interpretation and the misapplication of the Council, as the modernist Cardinal Ratzinger and nearly all of the half-liberal half-conservative movement have always said; but which has always been denied by Archbishop Lefebvre, because the errors in question are due not to misinterpretation of the Council, but to the Council itself.

    These two years of conversations and dialogues, focused on reaching an agreement, now show their effects in the constricted brain of Bishop Fellay, who now manages to see and understand what was previously inaccessible to the benumbed neurons of his brain matter, but which -- after this period of doctrinal dialogue -- lights the spark now illuminating it, to know that what some denounce as the errors of the Council, actually comes from a misunderstanding of it. EUREKA, exclaimed Archimedes! Still happy, despite the ecstasy, that he has thought to get out of the water wherein he had plunged to make his discovery ...

    And as if that were not enough, he advances a third reason which confirms him a little more in his position suggested by the grace of God: that there are things more important than the very controversial Vatican II, this bone of contention from the Garden of Eden (unless it is a Swiss substitute for William Tell's apple). Indeed, the Church has bigger problems to solve, and we are primarily children of the Church, not those of the Resistance to the Council.

    We perceive, today, the dialectic of constant back-and-forth (the double-talk) employed by Bishop Fellay, the puppet moved by invisible strands after which it surrenders itself to its dance of death. And he threatens or beheads anyone not keeping pace with his melodious music, because, like the Pied Piper of Hamelin, he drags rats into the river where they drown.

    Thus we see a bishop, Monsignor Williamson, excluded from the ordinations and from the General Chapter, and the decision at the last moment not to ordain some monks from Avrillé and from Morgon until they have demonstrated their loyalty to him. I hope that all this is only a symptom of what is called in the Alps, “mountain sickness” (a word to the wise, Hello), especially if the great chief is an Alpine guru endowed with a mitre and a power and if he is adequately supported by the occult and apostate anti-christian Rome, which makes real, before our incredulous eyes, the prophecies of La Salette.

    Father Basilio Méramo
    Bogotá, 5 July 2012