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Author Topic: Found on T.I.A. Website, Collection of Archbishop's sermons not welcome to laity  (Read 4891 times)

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Offline Ladislaus

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Did Archbishop Lefebvre soften a bit after the election of JP2?  Yes he did.  He was optimistic that he would be better than Paul VI.  Then things soured again at the time of Assisi, which ultimately led to the consecrations.

This attempt to suppress the reality of the "hard line" days is incredibly disturbing.  Let the Archbishop speak for himself.  He was of course entitled to change his mind, but the truth does not change.  He said what he said at the time.  Let the record stand.  And people are entitled to disagree with him.  It reminds me of Orwell's 1984.  In addition, he delivered most of these in public, and they were meant for public consumption and edification.  While it may be legally permitted, it's not morally acceptable for them to suppress this stuff.  Now, if there things in there contrary to faith and morals, then perhaps there would be reason to suppress them.  Perhaps the SSPX consider these sermons to be scandalous to the faithful, and are judging +Lefebvre ... all the while exploiting him and the devotion people have to him whenever it benefits them.


Offline Pax Vobis

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Thank you, TomGubbinsKimmage and Markus.  This will be a valid service to the Church now and in the future.


Online B from A

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ALL OF THE SERMONS ARE AVAILABLE ONLINE, AND CANNOT BE TOUCHED BY THE SSPX.
Are these in French?  The same sermons that were published in the books?  

Offline 2Vermont

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Did Archbishop Lefebvre soften a bit after the election of JP2?  Yes he did.  He was optimistic that he would be better than Paul VI.  Then things soured again at the time of Assisi, which ultimately led to the consecrations.

This attempt to suppress the reality of the "hard line" days is incredibly disturbing.  Let the Archbishop speak for himself.  He was of course entitled to change his mind, but the truth does not change.  He said what he said at the time.  Let the record stand.  And people are entitled to disagree with him.  It reminds me of Orwell's 1984.  In addition, he delivered most of these in public, and they were meant for public consumption and edification.  While it may be legally permitted, it's not morally acceptable for them to suppress this stuff.  Now, if there things in there contrary to faith and morals, then perhaps there would be reason to suppress them.  Perhaps the SSPX consider these sermons to be scandalous to the faithful, and are judging +Lefebvre ... all the while exploiting him and the devotion people have to him whenever it benefits them.
Interesting.
For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

Offline tdrev123

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My download still says 0% downloaded after 20 minutes, anybody have suggestions?  


Offline TomGubbinsKimmage

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https://send.firefox.com/download/42e0303bb5020e46/#U0eye8YPyFLRdraOLt5g2Q

The piratebay site is not working well at the moment for the sermons, so try this link above.
It will expire in 7 days.
It is only the first 3/4 of the econe sermons.
I will start another thread about this as I upload them.

Offline X

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Well done, Tom-

Now Menzingen can begin the legal proceedings against Cathinfo for facilitating copyright infringement, and give Matthew the choice between closing down Cathinfo, or  being sued into the ground for damages.

Naturally, they will also demand your IP address (hope you are running TOR or proxy of some kind), and depending on what kind of server/OS the linked-to site is running, they will probably attempt to indemnify all parties who downloaded content, if they can.

Are you sure you are on our side?

You may just have precipitated the demise of Cathinfo.

Offline TomGubbinsKimmage

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Why did you waste your time writing that post. Reflect before writing, and stop listening to your pride.

Think: legal proceedings for putting up a link expiring in 7 days? How likely is that now?

Demanding an IP address: After all that?

And indemnifying all parties?

Tad fantastical, don't you think?


Offline hollingsworth

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There is something about X that doesn't smell quite right to me.  I speculate, (as I have before), that X and higher ups in the "Resistance," including, perhaps, even Bp. Williamson himself, have these sermons and "much, much more."  They are well acquainted with these docuмents and know exactly what they contain.  But for one reason or another, these same 'Resistance' folks work actively to suppress the material themselves- out of fear, perhaps, or self-interest.  They could at the very least allude to the sermons from time to time and reveal generally what ABL was saying at the time, and why specifically Fellay & Co. are so hell bent on keeping them out of general circulation.  But that never seems to happen. 

Offline X

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There is something about X that doesn't smell quite right to me.  I speculate, (as I have before), that X and higher ups in the "Resistance," including, perhaps, even Bp. Williamson himself, have these sermons and "much, much more."  They are well acquainted with these docuмents and know exactly what they contain.  But for one reason or another, these same 'Resistance' folks work actively to suppress the material themselves- out of fear, perhaps, or self-interest.  They could at the very least allude to the sermons from time to time and reveal generally what ABL was saying at the time, and why specifically Fellay & Co. are so hell bent on keeping them out of general circulation.  But that never seems to happen.

Dear Mr. Hollingsworth-

You are very likely going to experience the consequences of your obstinacy and incomprehension.

Do you seriously believe that Menzingen would just sit by while Mr. Kimmage gives away the store on CI??

That Menzingen would sue the family of ABL, menace Avrille, but leave CI unmolested (even though Menzingen monitors CI 24 hours/day)??

I 100% expect Matthew to receive a letter from US District legal counsel within the next 30 days.

When that happens, let us talk again about who/what doesn't "smell right."

This will be my last post until then.

Offline Incredulous

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Fellay sued and won in the French courts, but never proved he owned legitimate copyrights.  It was a possible bluff.

An SSPX lawsuit in America would draw adverse publicity.  I doubt Fr. Wegner would have the stomach for it?

But at this stage of the game, the SSPX is coming out of oven, with a fully baked newChurch prelature deal.

My guess is, it doesn't matter to them anymore.
"Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi


Offline TomGubbinsKimmage

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Dear Mr. Hollingsworth-

You are very likely going to experience the consequences of your obstinacy and incomprehension.

Do you seriously believe that Menzingen would just sit by while Mr. Kimmage gives away the store on CI??

That Menzingen would sue the family of ABL, menace Avrille, but leave CI unmolested (even though Menzingen monitors CI 24 hours/day)??

I 100% expect Matthew to receive a letter from US District legal counsel within the next 30 days.

When that happens, let us talk again about who/what doesn't "smell right."

This will be my last post until then.
You probably do have experience with the law, but are strangely very naive as to how it works.
By the time that letter comes, if it does, the link will be useless. Matthew has plausible deniability. Menzingen know this. Matthew can also say that he is not hosting the content. They only go after the big players who encourage copyright violations. Not someone who allows a few links to be posted.

 Which is why the user above is right.... They won't even bother.

Offline TomGubbinsKimmage

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Methinks that X is annoyed that the sermons will not be in the hands of "trusted laymen" because of this.

All the hallmarks of a priest attached to the idea that we must have an organisation in the resistance, or at least is yearning for his days in the SSPX.

Father, (if you a priest) those days are over! The SAJM nor the MCSPX won't undo that.

This is the will of God: loose independent pockets. Don't frustrate it.

Offline Meg

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Methinks that X is annoyed that the sermons will not be in the hands of "trusted laymen" because of this.

All the hallmarks of a priest attached to the idea that we must have an organisation in the resistance, or at least is yearning for his days in the SSPX.

Father, (if you a priest) those days are over! The SAJM nor the MCSPX won't undo that.

This is the will of God: loose independent pockets. Don't frustrate it.

I'm fairly sure that X is not a priest. His identity has been revealed here previously.

I hope that the sermons will be posted for all to see. Though there will need to be some sort of verification that they come from +ABL. Are the sermons in written form, or vocal/audio form? We can all recognize +ABL's voice, but it may be difficult to verify a written sermon.

And....there are laymen who would like to twist +ABL's words in order to conform him to their own particular ideology, such as some (certainly not all) sedevacantists/sedewhatevers, and followers of Plinio de Oliveira.

Just want to add that it is quite reprehensible that Bp. Fellay would sue the family of Archbishop Lefebvre over the sermons. 
"It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

~St. Robert Bellarmine
De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

Online B from A

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Are the sermons in written form, or vocal/audio form? 

Just want to add that it is quite reprehensible that Bp. Fellay would sue the family of Archbishop Lefebvre over the sermons. 
Are the sermons in French or English? 
.
Are they the same sermons as in the books that got published by Editions Saint-Remi?  
.
IIRC, +Fellay didn't sue the family, but the publisher, Editions Saint-Remi.  The family had given ESR permission to publish them, but the XSPX sued anyway.  I was told at the time:  "The sermons were transcribed on order of Mgr Lefebvre by Abbé Guépin who was then with the Society, and he kept them with the Archbishop's permission.