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Offline Matthew

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Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
« on: November 18, 2023, 06:25:57 PM »
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  • DCCCLII #852
    November 11, 2023
    CALDERON’S “PROMETHEUS”
     
    “Prometheus” must appear as written first. 
    Good souls for such truth have a genuine thirst. 

    Readers over the last few years may remember how these “Comments” have recommended and promoted the book written in 2010 by Fr Alvaro Calderón on the true interpretation of the docuмents of the Second Vatican Council (1962–1965). Fr Calderón is a priest of the Society of St Pius X from Argentina who has now been teaching thomistic philosophy and theology at the Society’s priestly Seminary in La Reja, Argentina, for several decades. His faithfulness to the teaching of the Catholic Church’s Common Doctor, St Thomas Aquinas (1225–1274), is Calderón’s great strength, and it is the strength of his book Prometheus, the Religion of Man, an essay of interpretation of Vatican II. 
    The book is not easy reading, but it is an incomparable overview of the main errors of Vatican II which are still ravaging the Church 58 years later. Earlier last year the American District of the SSPX published an adaptation of “Prometheus” in English which is not entirely faithful to the original text in Spanish, because around 2012 the Society officially changed direction and no longer wishes to condemn Vatican II as clearly as Calderón condemned it, once and for all, in 2010. The Society needs new bishops to look after its worldwide flock. It wants to have them with Rome’s permission, and not without. So it cannot afford to republish a text like the “Prometheus” of 2010 without taking the sting out of it, because the “Rome” of Pope Bergoglio is intent upon driving Vatican II to the ultimate destruction of the Church. 
    For a mere taste of that sting, let us summarise here part of Calderón’s 2010 prologue to “Prometheus.” 
    When Vatican II opened in 1962, the Church’s change of direction was so drastic and so sudden that it took the whole world by surprise, and the Church is still trying to work out what it meant. Pope Benedict XVI wants to find a way of interpreting the Council in harmony with Catholic Tradition, because Catholic “Traditionalists” are claiming that the Council breaks with Tradition. “Prometheus” will then examine how to interpret Vatican II, but let us first anticipate some potential objections to what it will say. 
    The business of “interpreting” cannot go on for ever. it is common sense that words have a meaning, and mean what they say. Both great Church Councils before Vatican II, Trent and Vatican I, spoke so clearly and decisively as to settle doctrinal problems and exclude all need for any further interpretation. 
    1. Then why does the sub-title of “Prometheus” announce that it is an “Essay of interpretation”? 
    Because the texts of Vatican II do need interpretation, which shows that they are not clear, unlike texts of Trent or Vatican I. On the contrary they are deliberately confused in order to prevent Catholics from realising that the Council is not just up-dating, but completely changing, their Traditional religion. Pope Benedict wants continuity? Alas, the continuity between Vatican II and the past is in fact between the Council and the Church’s enemies of yesterday down the ages, and today. Who are these enemies? They are the Humanists, going back to the 14th century, always centring religion on man instead of on God. 
    2. But how can such a complex phenomenon as Vatican II be boiled down to one word, “Humanism”? 
    Because God is wholly simple, and the closer Catholics get to God, the more simply they can see things. 
    3. But why does a Catholic book have to resort to Greek mythology for its main title, “Prometheus”? 
    Because myths can contain profound human truths, and as the mythical Prometheus stole fire from the gods to give it to man, so the Conciliar churchmen stole the true religion from God to twist it for modern man. Prometheus was punished. The mythical Hercules rescued him. Can Aquinas rescue Conciliarists? 
    . Kyrie eleison.

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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #1 on: November 18, 2023, 06:28:41 PM »
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  • Here is the Prologue including the original book written by Fr. Calderon in 2010, as well as the Foreword written in 2021 by Angelus Press.

    The version published by Angelus Press IS NOT A TRANSLATION FROM THE ORIGINAL but a new version that has been corrected and edited in order to justify why the SSPX is going closer to Modernist Rome.

    Certainly, reading the original version (being a literal translation) is more difficult to understand due to the style of Fr. Calderon's writing.
    However, it is important to get the word out that the English version is NOT just a translation but rather a whole new book calculated to deceive. The new Angelus Press version was created to convince SSPX priests that Fr. Calderon is in favor of approaching Modernist Rome!
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    Paypal donations: matthew@chantcd.com


    Offline Plenus Venter

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #2 on: November 18, 2023, 09:31:22 PM »
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  • Here is the Prologue including the original book written by Fr. Calderon in 2010, as well as the Foreword written in 2021 by Angelus Press.

    The version published by Angelus Press IS NOT A TRANSLATION FROM THE ORIGINAL but a new version that has been corrected and edited in order to justify why the SSPX is going closer to Modernist Rome.

    Certainly, reading the original version (being a literal translation) is more difficult to understand due to the style of Fr. Calderon's writing.
    However, it is important to get the word out that the English version is NOT just a translation but rather a whole new book calculated to deceive. The new Angelus Press version was created to convince SSPX priests that Fr. Calderon is in favor of approaching Modernist Rome!
    Thank you, Matthew, I've been wondering about this.
    The entire work, then, has been altered? I want my money back!
    Is Fr Calderon's genuine work available in English?

    Offline Plenus Venter

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #3 on: November 18, 2023, 10:29:02 PM »
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  • Here is Bishop Williamson's three part summary of Prometheus from 2019:
    https://stmarcelinitiative.org/prometheus-new-man/
    https://stmarcelinitiative.org/prometheus-newchurch/
    https://stmarcelinitiative.org/prometheus-idolatry/

    Bishop Williamson's conferences an this subject are available on Matthew's Cathinfo YouTube Channel:
    https://www.youtube.com/@matthewcathinfo402

    Offline AveReginaMatris

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #4 on: November 18, 2023, 10:44:55 PM »
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  • I've read Prometheus twice, I'm a Spanish speaker. It's a great book! Basically Vatican 2 is satanic in though and origin.

    I think I have a tool from Google that can translate a whole archive from one language to another. Perhaps if some of of you are interested, I could translate the book into English. There might be some imperfections tho, due to a literal translation.

    With regards Fr Calderón, even tho he's pretty much a philosophical genius, he's not consequent with his ideas. When he wrote the book in 2010, Fellay & Co were dealing with the sell out with the modernist. Since the book is super condemnatory of Vatican 2, Menzingen order him to put the book under a mattress and didn't give promotion to it, unlike Bishop Williamson does now which is kind of ironic haha


    Offline Plenus Venter

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #5 on: November 18, 2023, 11:40:19 PM »
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  • I've read Prometheus twice, I'm a Spanish speaker. It's a great book! Basically Vatican 2 is satanic in though and origin.

    I think I have a tool from Google that can translate a whole archive from one language to another. Perhaps if some of of you are interested, I could translate the book into English. There might be some imperfections tho, due to a literal translation.

    With regards Fr Calderón, even tho he's pretty much a philosophical genius, he's not consequent with his ideas. When he wrote the book in 2010, Fellay & Co were dealing with the sell out with the modernist. Since the book is super condemnatory of Vatican 2, Menzingen order him to put the book under a mattress and didn't give promotion to it, unlike Bishop Williamson does now which is kind of ironic haha
    Interesting, thanks ARM.
    Just like they got a court order to stop publication of ABL's sermons in France. Even their beloved founder was an obstacle to their cause... but nothing changed!
    That is a generous offer to make a translation, I would certainly be happy to read the real thing rather than a neo-SSPX sanitized version.

    Offline Texana

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #6 on: November 19, 2023, 12:27:56 PM »
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  • Here is the Prologue including the original book written by Fr. Calderon in 2010, as well as the Foreword written in 2021 by Angelus Press.

    The version published by Angelus Press IS NOT A TRANSLATION FROM THE ORIGINAL but a new version that has been corrected and edited in order to justify why the SSPX is going closer to Modernist Rome.

    Certainly, reading the original version (being a literal translation) is more difficult to understand due to the style of Fr. Calderon's writing.
    However, it is important to get the word out that the English version is NOT just a translation but rather a whole new book calculated to deceive. The new Angelus Press version was created to convince SSPX priests that Fr. Calderon is in favor of approaching Modernist Rome!
    THANK YOU MATTHEW!  The first thought that comes to mind:  Lying snakes!

    Offline Texana

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #7 on: November 19, 2023, 12:36:30 PM »
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  • Here is Bishop Williamson's three part summary of Prometheus from 2019:
    https://stmarcelinitiative.org/prometheus-new-man/
    https://stmarcelinitiative.org/prometheus-newchurch/
    https://stmarcelinitiative.org/prometheus-idolatry/

    Bishop Williamson's conferences an this subject are available on Matthew's Cathinfo YouTube Channel:
    https://www.youtube.com/@matthewcathinfo402
    Dear Plenus Venter,  Thank you for sharing!


    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #8 on: November 19, 2023, 12:43:38 PM »
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  • That is messed up.  
    May God bless you and keep you

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #9 on: November 21, 2023, 02:34:13 AM »
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  • Prólogo
    Prometeo
    La religion del hombre
    Ensayo de una hermenéutica del Concilio Vaticano II
    Padre Álvaro Calderón (Enero 17, 2010)
    Faltan apenas dos años para que se cuмpla el 50o aniversario del Concilio Vaticano II, y todavía no salimos del pasmo en que nos puso este giro de timón en la Barca de Pedro. Y utilizando el plural no me refiero solamente a los católicos de buena fe, sino a todo el mundo : tradicionalistas y progresistas, católicos y no católicos. Hoy domingo, Benedicto XVI visita por segunda vez la sinagoga de Roma como signo de amistad, y el rabino aún se pellizca para creer lo que sus ojos ven – no es para menos : las dos veces que los visitó San Pedro no se mostró tan afable 1 –. Mañana lunes, la Fraternidad San Pío X visita por segunda vez el ex Santo Oficio de Roma y no nos termina de sorprender el motivo que allí nos tiene : discutir sobre el Concilio a la luz del magisterio anterior, porque el mismo Benedicto XVI reconoce que el Vaticano II todavía no se acaba de entender. 
    Sí, se hace absolutamente necesario entender qué es el Concilio – «quid sit», dicen los escolásticos – a la luz del Magisterio de siempre, que es la única luz que tenemos en este tiempo de tinieblas. El Papa ha hablado de una necesaria «hermenéutica» de los textos conciliares, término de etimología griega que significa «interpretación». Hasta ahora habría prevalecido una «hermenéutica de ruptura» con el pensamiento católico tradicional, y Benedicto XVI pide que se haga una «hermenéutica de continui- dad». Bien, he querido responder a este pedido, y el presente librito – como reza el subtítulo – es un ensayo de hermenéutica del Concilio Vaticano II. Pero haré algunas aclaraciones antes de comenzar la aventura. 
    Hasta no hace mucho, con la palabra «hermenéutica» se significaba el arte de interpretar textos que ofrecían alguna dificultad especial, generalmente por su antigüedad, y se decía especialmente del arte de interpretar las Sagradas Escrituras, que a la gran antigüedad le suma el tener múltiples autores humanos y un único autor principal, el Espíritu Santo. Pero el subjetivismo moderno habla de «hermenéutica» para la interpretación de todo texto, poniendo ahora la dificultad no en alguna característica particular, sino en la dificultad general que el hombre tendría para transmitir su pensamiento. Un auténtico teólogo católico no puede aceptar que se hable de una «hermenéutica», por ejemplo, de los textos del Concilio de Trento o del Vaticano I, porque son textos actuales que hacen justamente la interpretación autorizada de la Tradición, en lo que ésta tenía necesidad todavía de ser explicada. Si para leer Trento, que hace una hermenéutica de la Tradición, yo, Padre Calderón, necesito la aplicación de un arte especializado para poder, a mi vez, interpretarlo, quiere decir que Usted, Lector, tendrá que hacer una hermenéutica de mi interpretación. ¿Quiere decir que nunca nadie puede hablar claramente con nadie el mismo lenguaje? Exactamente eso es lo que piensa un moderno subjetivista, pero está gravemente equivocado. 
    Sin embargo, ya ha visto el Lector que intento hacer una hermenéutica del Concilio Vaticano II. He dudado si dejar ese subtítulo, pues da a pensar que participo del vergonzoso defecto del subjetivismo, y por eso lo aclaré apenas en mi tercer párrafo – aunque muchos no pasarán de leer los títulos –. Mas, si bien está mal hablar de «hermenéutica» para los docuмentos del magisterio eclesiástico, no lo está para los textos del último Concilio, porque han sido redactados bajo una especie de código para iniciados. Y aunque no digo que me haya vuelto un especialista en el asunto, me parece que he ido descubriendo la clave para interpretarlos. 
    Una nota más respecto a «hermenéutica», que me surge de comparar una edición antigua del Diccionario de la Real Academia Española con la versión digital más nueva. En la edición de 1914 se lee para dicho término : “Arte de interpretar textos para fijar su verdadero sentido, y especialmente el de interpretar los textos sagrados”, mientras que la edición de 1992 trae lo mismo salvo las palabras “para fijar su verdadero sentido”. Señal del triunfo del subjetivismo, pues ya no se cree que ningún texto tenga un sentido verdadero único. Pero tampoco es cierto. El presente ensayo busca hallar el sentido verdadero, dentro – por supuesto – de la deliberada confusión con que esos textos se escribieron 1
    El Papa ha pedido que se haga una «hermenéutica de la continuidad», y eso es lo que hice. En el Concilio hubo algo de nunca visto – de allí el pasmo general –, pero había mucho de antiguo. Ante el temblor conciliar, los católicos hemos visto de re- pente caerse todo. Pero si uno se pone a pensar, la causa de este derrumbe no puede reducirse a lo que pasó hace cincuenta años : las termitas debilitaban desde hace mucho la estructura del edificio. Una tesis principal de la explicación que aquí doy es que el Vaticano II se inserta en un proceso continuo que arranca con el Renacimiento. Pero como no nos da el presupuesto para meternos a historiadores, este aspecto histórico no está propiamente explicado, sino sólo señalado por algunos jalones. De todas maneras, alcanza para mostrar que los que hicieron el Concilio estaban en continuidad con cinco siglos de catolicismo liberal. La pretensión, entonces, de Benedicto XVI tiene su parte de verdad. 
    La palabra clave de toda mi interpretación es el «humanismo», pronunciada por primera vez en el siglo XIV. Aunque no siempre con rencor, desde el comienzo se contrapuso a la palabra «cristianismo». Afirmo, entonces, que el Concilio Vaticano II es el mayor – y quizás último – esfuerzo por sostener un humanismo católico, que se levanta ante el cristianismo o Religión de Cristo, como la Religión del Hombre. 
    Los seres humanos tenemos una fuerte tendencia a reducir todas las cosas a un único principio, y se suele observar que las explicaciones que lo logran resultan muy mentirosas. Mi «hermenéutica» puede caer bajo esta sospecha, pues habiendo puesto el «humanismo» como principio, pretendo resolver de allí uno tras otro los mil problemas que plantea el Concilio. Pero si bien puede ser cierto que, en la mayoría de los casos, quien mucho simplifica mucho miente, le hago la observación, querido Lector, que no siempre. Porque toda la realidad tiene, en verdad, un único principio, que es Dios Nuestro Señor, y la sospechada tendencia a la reducción del intelecto humano, no es otra cosa que el habitus de la sabiduría – teología es su otro nombre – que trata de aparecer. Cuando las cosas se ven a la luz de los verdaderos principios teológicos, entonces se simplifican enormemente, tendiendo a verse tan simples como simple es Dios. Sí, aun los errores. Esto puede resultar un poco más misterioso, pero los errores teológicos no tienen muchas maneras de cometerse, por la misma simplicidad de las verdades a que se oponen. He aquí mi defensa entonces : si la luz bajo la que he enfocado el problema del Concilio es de sabiduría verdadera, puede ser que mi explicación sea simple y cierta. Y, en confianza, me parece que es así, que no por otro motivo se publica este librito. 
    Como suele pasar, una defensa pide otra. La sabiduría de la que me glorío no es mía, es la de Santo Tomás, a la que veinte años de paz en mi querido Seminario me han permitido acercarme. Si hay algo por lo que pecaron los teólogos del Concilio, es por haberla abandonado. 
    El título propio del librito es «La religión del hombre». Lo de «Prometeo» fue por no dejarlo tan seco. A los humanistas del Re- nacimiento les gustaba resucitar los mitos griegos, y la figura de Prometeo encarna de manera interesante el espíritu del humanismo. Según Esquilo, Prometeo sería un titán – de naturaleza divina – hermano de Atlas y de Tifón, pero a diferencia de ellos, su virtud no consistía en la fuerza bruta sino en la astucia : su nombre significa Prudente. Cultor de Zeus en un principio, se vuelve tan favorable al género humano – a quien según otros autores habría plasmado – que lo salva del diluvio en que el airado Zeus quería anegarlo, termina robando el fuego divino en unas cañas para dárselo a los hombres, y en el sacrificio de un buey decepciona a Zeus ofreciendo al hombre la parte mejor. Como castigo divino, él será encadenado a una roca, donde un águila le devora perpetuamente el hígado, y los hombres serán seducidos por Pandora, que desata todas las calamidades. Finalmente Hércules lo libera y lo reconcilia con Zeus. [En la entrada del Rockefeller Center hay una especie de altar levantado a Prometeo, en el que una estatua dorada lo representa trayendo a los hombres la divina llama]. 
    El Concilio es Prometeo en el acto de su latrocinio. Fue una maniobra de prudencia humana llevada a cabo por una jerarquía de constitución divina, que hizo arder para los hombres el incienso que pertenece a Dios – la pintura de la tapa representa es- te momento, con un Prometeo de torva mirada; es obra de Jan Cossiers, siglo XVII, según un boceto de Rubens, y se halla en el Museo del Prado –. Como en la parábola del administrador infiel (Lc 16), el Concilio anuló los pagarés de las deudas de los hombres para con Dios, prometiendo a todos la salvación; y en el cul- to de su nueva Misa ha dado al hombre la parte mejor. Pero tampoco faltan las consecuencias, pues la caja de Pandora ha volcado sus males en toda la Iglesia, mientras la jerarquía católica ha quedado encadenada, con su propia incoherencia royéndole las entrañas. ¿Quién será el Hércules capaz de liberarla? Creemos que sólo un retorno del tomismo a Roma. 
    Las páginas que siguen son difíciles. Este trabajo, según creo y espero y estoy persuadido, es mi última palabra acerca del Concilio. Cuatro son – siguiendo mítico – los hercúleos trabajos que he acometido respecto a la crisis desatada por el Vaticano II :
    • El primero ha tratado sobre la autoridad doctrinal del magisterio conciliar, publicado hace poco bajo el título de «La lámpara bajo el celemín». No puede uno meterse a teólogo sin resolver de algún modo ese asunto. 
    El segundo lleva como nombre «El misterio pascual», que fue publicado sustancialmente en los Cuadernos de La Reja no 4. Allí trato de desentrañar los sofismas de la nueva teología en torno a su nueva versión del misterio de la Redención. El asunto es infinito y siempre quedan cosas por decir. Me publicaron un artículo complementario en las actas del Primer Simposio de Pa- rís, de octubre del 2002 : «La Iglesia, sacramento universal de salvación» (en francés). Quedó en el tintero otro artículo que se habría llamado Alter Christus, sobre la noción moderna del sacerdocio. Pero al menos se publicó una síntesis que incluye este punto en las Actas del 5o Congreso Teológico de Sì Sì No No, de abril del 2002 : «Cuestión disputada sobre la Redención. Noción teológica del Misterio Pascual», cuya versión española fue publicada en los Cuadernos de La Reja no 6. ¿Redondearé algún día estos asuntos? No he descartado la intención, pero por ahora no tengo ánimos ni para pensarlo. Aunque creo haber hecho lo que debía y estoy muy satisfecho por eso, es extremadamente desagradable tener que gastar el cerebro en considerar un pensamiento tan falso y hueco como el moderno. 
    ï El tercer trabajo es «El Reino de Dios», cuya primera versión fue presentada en el Tercer Simposio de París, de octubre del 2004, pero nunca llegó a publicarse en sus actas. ¿Por qué? Porque al trabajito le creció una rama más grande que su propio tronco y no quise podarlo. Lo que ocurrió es que, al querer saber por qué los modernos distinguen la Iglesia del Reino de Dios, saltó a la vista una confusión que la mayoría de los teólogos anti- liberales no había evitado : identificar el fin temporal propio del orden político con un fin puramente natural. Cometido este error, no se pueden refutar Dignitatis humanae ni Gaudium et spes. De allí que la investigación, que en un primer momento se pensaba reducir a los autores modernos en torno al Concilio, tuvo que retroceder siglos en el tiempo y cambiar notablemente de objeto. Este asunto me parece importantísimo, porque involucra a los mismos maestros que los tradicionalistas tenemos, y con la ayuda de Dios, tengo decidido llevarlo a término. 
    El cuarto trabajo es el que Usted, Lector, tiene en mano. Pretende ser una exposición de la idea que dirigió la labor del Con- cilio, presentada a modo de síntesis y confrontada con la doctrina tradicional. Supone, entonces, todos los trabajos anteriores, donde muchos de los puntos que aquí se tocan en resumen reciben un tratamiento más desarrollado. Tendría que haberlo publicado, por lo tanto, después de «El Reino de Dios», pero ya ve que no ha sido así. De allí que ésta sea mi última palabra, aunque después probablemente siga hablando otro rato. 
    Las páginas que siguen, decía, son difíciles, porque la teología modernista es falsa y hueca, pero en la ansiedad de evitar los anatemas que pudieran excluirla de la Iglesia, ha ido tejiendo sus sofismas con sutileza, y si uno quiere precisar su errores, necesita sacarle buena punta al lápiz. Pero cuando, además de la precisión, se busca la síntesis general de la multitud de los errores conciliares sin la paciencia para dedicar mil páginas a toda esta cuestión, el resultado es... bueno, no lo quiero desanimar, es como un mural pintado por un miniaturista. Creo que en la lectura de esta obrita se pueden perder muchos detalles – que sólo serán capaces de apreciar los que hayan estudiado ese punto en particular – sin que se deje de entender la idea general. Pero los párrafos vienen muy condensados, y mi animoso Lector no dejará de sentir cierto agobio. Como no he logrado arrepentirme, no le pido perdón. 
    Si se fija en el índice, verá que el trabajo está dividido en cuatro capítulos. En el primero intento decir «quid est», qué es el Concilio, es decir, busco definirlo, señalando sus grandes principios y propiedades. Luego, en los tres capítulos siguientes, considero lo que el Concilio hizo. Esta es una buena manera de proceder, pues como dicen los escolásticos, agere sequitur esse, el obrar sigue al ser, y para explicar la obra conciliar, convenía estudiar primero su naturaleza íntima. 
    Sólo me queda expresar mi agradecimiento a Monseñor Richard Williamson, quien no sólo me alentó y casi conminó a que emprendiera esta tarea – de allí que se adelantara esta última parte de mi programa –, sino que me dio la idea clave para que se resolviera como se resolvió, pues a él le pertenece en esencia el esquema que se va construyendo con la conclusión de cada capítulo. Puedo decir que no me decidía a enfrentar este ensayo, calculando que implicaría un gran trabajo con poco provecho, pero al poner como principio el humanismo del Concilio con su giro antropocéntrico, cada asunto ocupó su puesto sin ningún esfuerzo. Nunca pensé que un proyecto tan complejo podía resolverse en tan poco tiempo. Creo que ha sido el mérito de la obediencia y de la docilidad de dejar la propia idea y tomar la ajena. Y creo también que es consecuencia de estar en la verdad. 
    Pero basta ya de confidencias y emprendamos la marcha.

    La Reja, 17 de enero de 2010 
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    Offline poenitens

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #10 on: November 21, 2023, 06:47:20 AM »
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  • I've read Prometheus twice, I'm a Spanish speaker. It's a great book! Basically Vatican 2 is satanic in though and origin.

    I think I have a tool from Google that can translate a whole archive from one language to another. Perhaps if some of of you are interested, I could translate the book into English. There might be some imperfections tho, due to a literal translation.

    With regards Fr Calderón, even tho he's pretty much a philosophical genius, he's not consequent with his ideas. When he wrote the book in 2010, Fellay & Co were dealing with the sell out with the modernist. Since the book is super condemnatory of Vatican 2, Menzingen order him to put the book under a mattress and didn't give promotion to it, unlike Bishop Williamson does now which is kind of ironic haha
    ¡Viva Cristo Rey y viva Santa María de Guadalupe!

    Where can I find the original book in Spanish without the modifications the SSPX published it with?

    It would be a cool little project to translate the bulk of it with this tool you speak of, and then correct manually whatever passage it rendered awkwardly. The question is whether there is a real interest from English readers.
    ¡Viva Jesús!

    Please, disregard any opinions and references that I have posted that may seem favorable to any traditionalist group, especially those that pertinaciously deny EENS (CMRI, Sanborn, Dolan and associates, for example).


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #11 on: November 21, 2023, 07:28:50 AM »
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  • But did Father Calderon identify the true root cause of the V2 heresies?  I doubt it.

    Karl Rahner explained what that was and also marveled that none of the V2 "conservative" Fathers noticed it.

    Root error was not "humanism" per se.  That was more evident in the wrings of JP2 Wojtyla the Great.  Bishop Williamson was closer when he characterized it as "subjectivism".

    But the core error was the new V2 ecclesiology which was necessary to undermine Catholic soteriology.  Everything else flows from this, and yet the SSPX and 95% of all Trad clergy promote the notion that there's salvation outside the Church.

    It's very simple, really, so that a child can understand it.  But there's a cognitive dissonance at work.

    MAJOR:  There's no salvation outside the Church (dogma).
    MINOR:  Heretics, schismatics, and infidels can be saved (believed by most Trads).
    CONCLUSION:  Heretics, schismatics, and infidels can be in the Church.

    There's only one way to get non-Catholics "saved," given the dogma that there's no salvation outside the Church, and that is to redefine what it means to be inside the Church.  So, the resulting "Church" is in fact the V2 ecclesiology, where the Catholic Church constitutes the essential core, but the Church also includes heretics, schismatics, and infidels who belong to it and are inside it formally while remaining in a certain degree of material separation.

    This subjectivized soteriology also leads directly to Religious Liberty.

    But you can count on one hand the number of Trad clergy who recognize this.  There are many more faithful who have figured this out, but a shockingly small number of Trad clergy.

    Offline Texana

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #12 on: November 21, 2023, 04:05:21 PM »
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  • But did Father Calderon identify the true root cause of the V2 heresies?  I doubt it.

    Karl Rahner explained what that was and also marveled that none of the V2 "conservative" Fathers noticed it.

    Root error was not "humanism" per se.  That was more evident in the wrings of JP2 Wojtyla the Great.  Bishop Williamson was closer when he characterized it as "subjectivism".

    But the core error was the new V2 ecclesiology which was necessary to undermine Catholic soteriology.  Everything else flows from this, and yet the SSPX and 95% of all Trad clergy promote the notion that there's salvation outside the Church.

    It's very simple, really, so that a child can understand it.  But there's a cognitive dissonance at work.

    MAJOR:  There's no salvation outside the Church (dogma).
    MINOR:  Heretics, schismatics, and infidels can be saved (believed by most Trads).
    CONCLUSION:  Heretics, schismatics, and infidels can be in the Church.

    There's only one way to get non-Catholics "saved," given the dogma that there's no salvation outside the Church, and that is to redefine what it means to be inside the Church.  So, the resulting "Church" is in fact the V2 ecclesiology, where the Catholic Church constitutes the essential core, but the Church also includes heretics, schismatics, and infidels who belong to it and are inside it formally while remaining in a certain degree of material separation.

    This subjectivized soteriology also leads directly to Religious Liberty.

    But you can count on one hand the number of Trad clergy who recognize this.  There are many more faithful who have figured this out, but a shockingly small number of Trad clergy.
    Dear Ladislaus,
    What is the true root cause of the V2 heresies?  How did Rahner explain?  Could you please cite the source, a book or quote?  Please share! Thank you.


    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #13 on: November 21, 2023, 10:55:30 PM »
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  • Here is a translation of the Prologue by Bp. Williamson --

    CALDERON,    PROLOGUE   TO  “PROMETHEUS”


    PROLOGUE 
    By Fr. Calderón (January 17, 2010)
    In two years’ time there will be the 50th Anniversary of the opening of the Second Vatican Council in 1962, yet the Catholic Church has still not got over the shock of its sudden change of direction at that Council, better known as Vatican II. In fact not just Catholics, but the whole wide world was taken by surprise by Vatican II, and the churchmen themselves are still trying to work out what it meant.
    Pope Benedict XVI is calling for a way to be found to interpret Vatican II as being in line with Catholic Tradition, because so-called “Traditionalists” are interpreting Vatican II on the contrary as a break with Tradition. This little book is meant as an answer to the Pope’s call, as its subtitle states – “An essay to interpret Vatican II”. But before I embark on this adventure, let me make a few things clear at the outset.
    If I, Fr Calderón, present in this book my interpretation of Vatican II, will there still be needed an interpretation of my interpretation ?  That is ridiculous. The process could go on forever. The truth is that words can be used to state without ambiguity what a person or Council, for instance, wants to say. Thus Church Councils like Trent in the 16th century or Vatican I in the 19th century both used precise words in order to clear up, in modern times, Church teaching that was being questioned by protestants and liberals respectively, and both Councils succeeded absolutely in the purpose of excluding the need for any further interpretation of Church doctrine on the points covered. In fact no serious Catholic theologian may even try to reinterpret these Councils’ definitions, and the true Church’s language is habitually clear in this way. Only modern subjectivists have lost their grip on words saying what they mean, and meaning what they say. “Verba significant ut sonant,” said the Latins. Words mean what they say. That is common sense.
    But then why has the sub-title of this book, mentioned above, stated that it is an “essay of interpretation”?
    Precisely because the texts of Vatican II are not written in the clear language of the true Catholic Church. Rather, they are written in a style which suggests that they are written for initiates to interpret them with the help of a secret password. This password I think I have found. That is what this book will present. That is why I am also entering into this fantasy world of “interpretation”, in order to bring out the real meaning of the deliberately confused texts of Vatican II. As I wish to show, the churchmen of Vatican II had something to hide – they meant to change the Catholic religion. Hence their deliberate confusion, to disguise what they were up to.
    However, if Benedict XVI calls for an interpretation that harmonizes Vatican II with Catholic Tradition, in one sense he is right, namely that it was centuries of humanism from inside the Church which finally led to its triumph at Vatican II. Such an earthquake as Vatican II never happens overnight. The centering of the Catholic religion on man instead of on God began in fact with the Renaissance some 600 years ago. In this respect my book will fulfill the Pope’s request for an interpretation of Vatican II that shows it is in continuity with the preceding centuries, but that is, by their man-centredness, not by their godliness ! So it is hardly the continuity that Benedict was hoping for, on the contrary. Nevertheless, “humanism”, or the turn to man, is the key to my own interpretation of Vatican II. From its beginning in the 14th century humanism was opposed to Christianity, turning to man maybe, but away from God. However, since this book is concerned with doctrine and not with history, then it gives only enough historical details to illustrate the thesis that Vatican II was a major attempt to reconcile humanism with Catholicism.
    Now a further objection might be that such a complicated phenomenon as Vatican II, with its huge variety of factors in play and consequences following, cannot possibly be reduced to one single word such as “Humanism” without oversimplifying the reality of what took place at the Council. And as a general rule that principle is true, namely that huge events cannot be boiled down to just one word. However, the one True God is absolutely simple, because for Him to have any separate parts, to put these parts together into one Being would have required somebody or something prior to God – impossible.  So the more God is involved in anything, the simpler it is liable to become, and the more things are soon in the light of true theological principles, the simpler they are seen to be. Thus seen in the light of true theological principles, even errors are capable of being simply analyzed. 
    So my analysis of Vatican II as an attempt to mix oil and water, or to reconcile man-centredness with God-centredness, may not be wrong just because it is simple. Nor is my analysis of Vatican II just mine. I have drawn it essentially from the philosophy and theology of St Thomas Aquinas, which were for Pius X in his great Encyclical, “Pascendi”, the prime remedy to that scourge of modernism which has flayed the Universal Church ever since Vatican II. Woe to the Council Fathers who scorned Thomas Aquinas !
    So much for the sub-title of this book, “The religion of Man”, but why resort to Greek mythology for its main title, “Prometheus” ?  Because like all classic mythology, the myth of Prometheus contains much truth bearing on man and life and human nature, and he in particular embodies the spirit of Humanism. For he was of divine nature and a worshipper of Zeus, the chief god, but Prometheus so came to favor mankind that finally he stole fire from the gods, to whom it belonged by right, in order to give it to men. Likewise the Council Fathers of Vatican II stole from Heaven the Catholic religion in order to hand it over to men, which meant that it ceased to be the true religion of God and became a poor imitation according to the wishes of men. And just as the mythical Prometheus was severely punished by Zeus with being chained to a rock where an eagle constantly tore out his entrails, so the Council Fathers were severely punished by God with their true Church being torn to pieces, a process still going on in 2010. In the Greek myth, Prometheus was finally rescued by the mighty Hercules.  Will there be a Hercules to rescue the Church from Vatican II ?  St Thomas Aquinas ?
    This book is difficult to read, but it should be the last of four essays of mine on Vatican II. The first of the four was entitled “The Lamp under the Bushel” (Mt. V, 14). It examined whether Vatican II texts come under the Magisterium or teaching authority of the true Church. The second essay was entitled “The Paschal Mystery”. It began the endless task of disentangling the subtle errors of the modernists which entangle the mystery of the Redemption, which is at the heart of the Catholic sacrifice of the Mass. The third essay was entitled “The Kingdom of God”, another minefield of modernist errors, where, as it seems to me, even good theologians so defend the truth with liberal arguments that in the end they can no longer properly refute terrible docuмents of Vatican II like Gaudium et Spes and Dignitatis Humanae. And the fourth essay is this same book entitled “Prometheus, the Religion of Man”. It follows on the three previous essays where ideas summarized in “Prometheus” are developed at greater length. Time must tell whether I may continue to write on the Council, or not. I do hope that I do not have to dwell on the endless entanglements fabricated by the enemies of God to undermine and destroy His true Church.
    If “Prometheus” makes difficult reading, that is precisely because the Council Fathers were obliged to cover their tracks to get their Revolution accepted by the mass of Catholics. They would certainly have rejected that Revolution had they seen clearly what was going on. To refute in the necessary detail all of the Council’s errors would have required a far longer book.  To present a synthetic overview of those errors has required that this short book jump over a lot of detail, but that has also meant that many a paragraph is so packed with content that many a reader may feel overwhelmed. However, I have written “Prometheus” as I have written it, and I am not sorry, because it overviews the Council as I wanted to overview it.
    So “Prometheus” divides into four parts:  Part one, the being or nature of the Council, because anything must first be in order to act, and then three parts on the Council’s action. Parts two, three and four present the Council’s New-man, New-church and New-religion respectively, which are like a new building’s bricks, walls and edifice respectively.
    It just remains for me to express my thanks to Bishop Richard Williamson, who not only encouraged me and almost compelled me to undertake this task – given that this essay should go ahead as being the last of my program – but he also provided me with the key idea, in order to shape it in the manner that it came out to be shaped. For instance to him belongs in essence the schema which you find being built up at the conclusion of each Chapter. I can say that I did not want to face up to the task of writing this essay, because I calculated that it would mean a lot of work for little profit, but as soon as I fixed on the Humanism of the Council with its turn to man being the central principle, then each question dropped into place without effort. Never did I think that such a complicated project could be resolved in such a short time. I attribute this success to the merit of obedience and to the docility of leaving one’s own idea aside in favor of my neighbor’s idea. I also believe that the ease of writing was a consequence of telling the truth. 
    Enough of preliminaries. Let us get going !
    Father Alvaro  Martin Calderón

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    Offline Marulus Fidelis

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Prometheus (no. 852)
    « Reply #14 on: November 22, 2023, 06:23:19 AM »
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  • But did Father Calderon identify the true root cause of the V2 heresies?  I doubt it.

    Karl Rahner explained what that was and also marveled that none of the V2 "conservative" Fathers noticed it.

    Root error was not "humanism" per se.  That was more evident in the wrings of JP2 Wojtyla the Great.  Bishop Williamson was closer when he characterized it as "subjectivism".

    But the core error was the new V2 ecclesiology which was necessary to undermine Catholic soteriology.  Everything else flows from this, and yet the SSPX and 95% of all Trad clergy promote the notion that there's salvation outside the Church.

    It's very simple, really, so that a child can understand it.  But there's a cognitive dissonance at work.

    MAJOR:  There's no salvation outside the Church (dogma).
    MINOR:  Heretics, schismatics, and infidels can be saved (believed by most Trads).
    CONCLUSION:  Heretics, schismatics, and infidels can be in the Church.

    There's only one way to get non-Catholics "saved," given the dogma that there's no salvation outside the Church, and that is to redefine what it means to be inside the Church.  So, the resulting "Church" is in fact the V2 ecclesiology, where the Catholic Church constitutes the essential core, but the Church also includes heretics, schismatics, and infidels who belong to it and are inside it formally while remaining in a certain degree of material separation.

    This subjectivized soteriology also leads directly to Religious Liberty.

    But you can count on one hand the number of Trad clergy who recognize this.  There are many more faithful who have figured this out, but a shockingly small number of Trad clergy.
    Wouldn't that be the instrumental cause but man in the place of God the final cause?