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Author Topic: Eleison Comments - Charity 2025 (no. 913)  (Read 36898 times)

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Offline Stubborn

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Re: Eleison Comments - Charity 2025 (no. 913)
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2025, 05:47:10 AM »
You argue from what you perceive to be the "unfixable conclusion". It is a backwards way of viewing the situation. Rather argue from the premise of faith:

R&R argues thus:

The "Church" is in crisis - we must "save" it somehow waiting with fingers crossed for the heretics to elect another heretic who will "fix" the Church.
You've derailed yourself again, you're not even in the right argument. We help save the Church by persevering in the faith.

If the Cardinals are gone there is no way to get a new pope.

The cardinals are not gone, so wth are you talking about?

Now, allow me to correct some of your many errors......
A heretic is NOT a member of the Church.

First, you need to make the distinction between heretics as is noted in the canon below. There are heretics who've never had the faith, and there are Catholics who've fallen into the sin of heresy - as is the case with all of the conciliar popes....
Canon 751
"Generally the norms specified in the above canons are to be observed whenever it is a case of the baptism of the infant of two heretics or schismatics, or of two Catholics who have fallen into apostasy, heresy, or schism."

If they are the latter....
Canon 2314
§ 1. All apostates from the Christian faith and each and every heretic or schismatic:
1.° Incur by that fact excommunication"

Excommunication is a censure attached to the sin (of heresy in this case) by the Code of Canon Law. Note that excommunication does not mean one is outside of the Church.

What is a censure?
From Commentary on the Code of Canon Law....
"1525. A censure is a penalty by which a subject (by Baptism) of the Church is deprived of some spiritual benefits, or of benefits connected with matters spiritual, because of obstinate violation of some law of the Church, until such time as he repents and obtains absolution."

There is much more I could post from this source to completely contradict your whole sede mentality, but to what end?

Offline Stubborn

  • Supporter
Re: Eleison Comments - Charity 2025 (no. 913)
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2025, 01:47:52 PM »

Poll: Are heretics members of the Catholic Church? - Crisis in the Church - Catholic Info

I guess most the people that voted ^^^ here don't know wth they are talking about either - it is good that we have you here to "correct our errors".
As usual, you blind yourself to what the Church teaches, twist other teachings of the Church and insist on exclaiming things that are contrary to what the Church teaches - all for the sake of maintaining an empty chair.

 I gave you clear quotes from the 1917 Code of Canon Law, you reject them all - for no other reason than for the sake of maintaining a vacant chair. Talk about an absurd reason to go contrary to what the Church, in no uncertain terms, teaches. There's not a face palm emoji big enough.

The Church teaches what it teaches, even if, like you, the whole world votes contrary. Instead of ranting off into the wild blue yonder like a protestant fool, please, explain how the Church teachings below do not mean what they say. FROM THE TEACHINGS BELOW, how is it possible that you are able to get and insist that all members of the Church's hierarchy are outside of the Church due to heresy. USE ONLY THE TEACHINGS BELOW.
Quote
Canon 2314
§ 1. All apostates from the Christian faith and each and every heretic or schismatic:
1.° Incur by that fact excommunication"

Excommunication is a censure attached to the sin (of heresy in this case) by the Code of Canon Law. Note that excommunication does not mean one is outside of the Church.

What is a censure?
From Commentary on the Code of Canon Law....
"1525. A censure is a penalty by which a subject (by Baptism) of the Church is deprived of some spiritual benefits, or of benefits connected with matters spiritual, because of obstinate violation of some law of the Church, until such time as he repents and obtains absolution."
When you finally figure out that it is YOU who is altogether wrong, let us know will ya?



Offline Stubborn

  • Supporter
Re: Eleison Comments - Charity 2025 (no. 913)
« Reply #27 on: January 20, 2025, 04:42:32 AM »

William Roper: “So, now you give the Devil the benefit of law!”

Sir Thomas More: “Yes! What would you do? Cut a great road through the law to get after the Devil?”

William Roper: “Yes, I'd cut down every law in England to do that!”

Sir Thomas More: “Oh? And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned 'round on you, where would you hide, Roper, the laws all being flat? This country is planted thick with laws, from coast to coast, Man's laws, not God's! And if you cut them down, and you're just the man to do it, do you really think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then? Yes, I'd give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety's sake!”