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Author Topic: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)  (Read 3943 times)

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Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2018, 01:58:14 PM »
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  • Hollingsworth, did +W guarantee WHEN he would comment on the sspx elections?  If not, then your childish tantrum over not seeing a commentary is baseless.  He'll comment when he comments.  It's not like you pay him for his emails.  He doesn't owe you anything.


    Offline Meg

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #16 on: July 17, 2018, 01:58:38 PM »
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  •  
    Sorry, I can’t altogether buy that explanation. Yes, as you say, he may have written this EC before the general chapter ever commenced. But that would not have prevented the bishop from tacking on a short paragraph at the end of this EC, informing the faithful, that he had much to say about the event, but that, at present, he was still formulating his thoughts, and would record his reactions in a future EC.

    My explanation was only a possibility. No one need take it as the only possibility.

    Why are you in such a hurry to see the Bishop's view on the matter? Do you highly value his opinion?
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Offline X

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #17 on: July 17, 2018, 01:58:52 PM »
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  •  
    Sorry, I can’t altogether buy that explanation. Yes, as you say, he may have written this EC before the general chapter ever commenced. But that would not have prevented the bishop from tacking on a short paragraph at the end of this EC, informing the faithful, that he had much to say about the event, but that, at present, he was still formulating his thoughts, and would record his reactions in a future EC.
    Neither can I buy your response:
    If you already surmise (rightly) what His Excellency is doing, then why does he need to add a paragraph reaffirming what the whole world already knows?

    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #18 on: July 17, 2018, 02:49:46 PM »
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  • How sad the plight of the traditional Catholic remnant.


    The SSPX has turned the fight for the Faith into a Spaghetti western.

    The Pfeiffer resistance turned it into a Harry Potter show.

    And Bp. Williamson, telling us it was hopeless to fight the enemies of the Church... retired ?


    But still blessed are we few, because our Church Fathers did not give up the fight.


                                                        St. Pope Clement I's martyrdom




    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline hollingsworth

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #19 on: July 17, 2018, 05:41:40 PM »
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  • meg:
    Quote
    Why are you in such a hurry to see the Bishop's view on the matter? Do you highly value his opinion?

    Don't you?  Of course I value his opinion.  Don't many others?  Is it not altogether fitting and proper that HE should comment, sooner than later?  After all, the bishop spent a lot of years in that organization and was unceremoniously dumped after years of faithful service. 
    Do I sound hysterical?  LOL :laugh1:


    Offline JPaul

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #20 on: July 17, 2018, 09:25:39 PM »
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  • How sad the plight of the traditional Catholic remnant.


    The SSPX has turned the fight for the Faith into a Spaghetti western.

    The Pfeiffer resistance turned it into a Harry Potter show.

    And Bp. Williamson, telling us it was hopeless to fight the enemies of the Church... retired ?


    But still blessed are we few, because our Church Fathers did not give up the fight.


                                                      St. Pope Clement I's martyrdom
    And so it is that we should look to the ancient Fathers for guidance in staying faithful in times of heresy, modern clerics who are guided by visionaries and apparitions are not reliable reflections of the sound doctrines to which we should have recourse.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #21 on: July 17, 2018, 10:24:19 PM »
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  • How sad the plight of the traditional Catholic remnant.


    The SSPX has turned the fight for the Faith into a Spaghetti western.

    The Pfeiffer resistance turned it into a Harry Potter show.

    And Bp. Williamson, telling us it was hopeless to fight the enemies of the Church... retired ?


    That's an awful simplification, to the point of distortion on the third item. Bishop Williamson comes to America often enough for a man who is 78 years old. Just a couple years ago he was doing multi-week Confirmations circuits around the world, including America. And in quite a few of those locations he was quite "on his own" without much help during the Confirmation ceremony.

    He is concerned with the plight of Traditional Catholics today, and preaches (publicly) quite often on the subject. He has a weekly newsletter "Eleison Comments" for those who aren't aware. And he did consecrate THREE other bishops to help him in his work, at least one of whom (Bp. Zendejas) is young enough to be considered a successor. But on this topic it should be kept in mind, however, that when the goal is to ordain more bishops OR priests, one needs proper candidates. Not just any human with XY chromosomes will do. So you can't exactly judge him on his output, as if quantity is the main goal.

    As for those who think +Williamson doesn't "do" enough, please meditate on this passage of Scripture:

    Luke, Chapter 16:

    [27]And he said: Then, father, I beseech thee, that thou wouldst send him to my father's house, for I have five brethren, [28] That he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torments. [29] And Abraham said to him: They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. [30] But he said: No, father Abraham: but if one went to them from the dead, they will do penance.
    [31] And he said to him: If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they believe, if one rise again from the dead.


    Bishop Williamson has built up a lot of wisdom over the years; Even I (who am a little over half his age) can start to see it. 
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #22 on: July 18, 2018, 11:38:17 AM »
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  • Yes, we Americans are an impatient people :ready-to-eat:

    The rebuttal is, it's hard to find quality seminarians and there's a 6-year bake cycle before ordination.

    But even Bishop Williamson has lectured that "Americans are a people of action."

    Consider that in addition to the (Resistance & SSPX) seminarians, the SSPX rules almost 700 priests. 
    Can they all be comfortable with Francis?

    Have our four Resistance Bishops made plans to reach-out to the disaffected ones?

    Are they actively embracing them, willing and able to bring them into the Resistance fold?

    There's many a Resistance and Independent chapel who needs a priest.



    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi


    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #23 on: July 18, 2018, 01:12:42 PM »
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  • Quote
    Consider that in addition to the (Resistance & SSPX) seminarians, the SSPX rules almost 700 priests.  
    Can they all be comfortable with Francis?

    Have our four Resistance Bishops made plans to reach-out to the disaffected ones?

    Are they actively embracing them, willing and able to bring them into the Resistance fold?

    These are great questions.  Certainly a "perfect plan" would be for the Resistance Bishops to be aware of those laity who need priests and who have chapels available, or a plan to get one.  Then the bishops could reach out to sspx priests and say, "Hey, if you want to leave the neo-sspx, we have a chapel, lodgings, laity waiting to support you."

    Certainly a small % of priests have hesitated to leave the neo-sspx because they're "comfortable" and/or unsure of change.  I can't blame them.  While Divine Providence always provides for decisions made for right reasons, sometimes souls need a plan before they will make a change.

    I'd be more than willing to help organize this type of endeavor, but there has to be cooperation/guidance from the leadership to make it happen.  Maybe they are doing such things behind the scenes?  I hope so.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #24 on: July 18, 2018, 02:38:49 PM »
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  • Yes, we Americans are an impatient people :ready-to-eat:

    The rebuttal is, it's hard to find quality seminarians and there's a 6-year bake cycle before ordination.

    But even Bishop Williamson has lectured that "Americans are a people of action."

    Consider that in addition to the (Resistance & SSPX) seminarians, the SSPX rules almost 700 priests.  
    Can they all be comfortable with Francis?

    Have our four Resistance Bishops made plans to reach-out to the disaffected ones?

    Are they actively embracing them, willing and able to bring them into the Resistance fold?

    There's many a Resistance and Independent chapel who needs a priest.

    Bishop Zendejas will talk with any priest willing to listen (or vice versa). However, I get the impression that his time spent talking to priests "on the fence" has declined drastically over the past 4 years.
    Everyone is taking/has taken a side by now.

    When a priest tells one of the bishops, "I do nothing until the SSPX authorities announce a formal deal with Rome" or "The SSPX will never make a deal with Rome." or "The SSPX needs to make a deal with Rome; I can't wait!" what do you do? Call them weekly and discuss the weather?

    Don't kid yourself. If you thought of this brilliant idea, I'm sure the Resistance bishops (who are more brilliant than you) have thought of it as well -- no offense.
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
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    Offline hollingsworth

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #25 on: July 18, 2018, 09:56:03 PM »
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  • Incred:
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    Have our four Resistance Bishops made plans to reach-out to the disaffected ones (i.e. sspx priests)?

    Are they actively embracing them, willing and able to bring them into the Resistance fold?

    There's many a Resistance and Independent chapel who needs a priest.

    You mean that the bishops should make an effort to to get priests, who have left the sspx fold, into a new "Resistance fold?"  From one fold to another? From one frying pan into another fire, maybe?

    Meanwhile, Bp. W., tell us what you thought about the general chapter.  Perhaps a few choice comments about the Jєω-loving Fr. Bouchacourt; a reflection or two about Bp de Galerreta, who not that long ago was cosignatory with you and Bp Tissier on a letter of protest directed to the then SG, Bp. Fellay.  Then, maybe, a few words about the new SG, the pronunciation of whose name is still not clear to all.  It wouldn't hurt either, perhaps, to mention the Argentine connection, which each of these three has, coupled with the fact that Fr.  Pagliarwhatever and pope Francis share the same country of origin.  I know, it's just a mere coincidence. :o

    I could go on, but I don't wish to be accused of having a childish tantrum, or of being an action-oriented American.  But I can get all the information aboutd AI online.  There are tons of it there.


    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #26 on: July 19, 2018, 12:20:33 PM »
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  • I see.  We are dumb dummies compared to the Resistance Bishops :farmer:

    But please allow one further observation.

    Was it not Our Lady of Good Success who advised Mother Mariana that a prelate would arise to fight and save Catholic tradition?
    Most of us believe this to be true.



    Many even speculated that this prophecy implied the prelate was +ABL ?

    But with all the shenanigans that have come to pass and based on the fruits of both the neo-SSPX and SSPX Resistance,
    it seems clear, this prelate will not come from the +ABL line.  

    Who will fully engage the fight?

    We, "watch and pray"... but stay on the look-out, to see the fruits from elsewhere.  
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Seraphina

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #27 on: July 19, 2018, 12:54:57 PM »
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  • Stop looking for a man to "restore all things" and start looking to a Woman, Our Lady.

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #28 on: July 19, 2018, 04:07:36 PM »
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  • .
    Quote
    Man has all of these material abilities or faculties of animal and vegetable, but he also shares with the angels the spiritual faculties of mind and will, in other words he has sensation and reason, meaning the ability of the mind to read within particular sensations their universal essences, and the ability of will to desire in accordance with what his mind has read. These two faculties no animal has (when an animal behaves with apparent intelligence, like a bee for instance, that is thanks only to the animal instincts implanted in it by its supremely intelligent Creator).

    Angels have mind and will, but no material faculties of the animals, because angels are purely spiritual. (The animal faculties of sense-knowledge and sense-desire all involve matter, absent in the angels.)

    Now whatever is truly human, or human as such, is what men have that neither animals, vegetable nor mineral have. But all machines are purely mineral and essentially, by their essence, inanimate. At their most complicated they still have no principle or origin of life or movement from within them. Any movement of them by electricity for instance, is from without. It follows that computers have no inner grasp whatsoever of any truly human activity, which, as human, completely escapes them. All they can do is register from outside what is observable and computable in people’s behaviour, and churn out statistics and spread-sheets, i.e. numbers, which they are good at. But Churchill said – he was no Saint but he was a human politician – “there are lies, damned lies, and statistics.” And why do statistics lie, if not because the essentially human essentially escapes them?

    Here is an example. In New York maybe 15 years back, a group of computer experts set up a computer, Deep Blue, to play chess against Kasparov, the world chess champion. Now if there is a game suited to computers, it is chess, because if only one can process billions of alternative moves in a few minutes, or seconds, one can come up with the best move that leaves nothing to chance. Guess what? After a few games the experts had to reset the computer to respond to how Kasparov was playing! Computers have no inner life or initiative, they cannot think outside of the box programmed into them, they cannot possibly respond to any eventuality outside of their box. Game, set and match to human beings!
    .
    But when it comes to machines, is it impossible for inanimate objects to be controlled by demons, or by men through the power of demons? 
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline hollingsworth

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    Re: Eleison Comments - Artificial Intelligence? Part 1 (no. 574)
    « Reply #29 on: July 19, 2018, 06:33:28 PM »
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  • Incred:
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    Was it not Our Lady of Good Success who advised Mother Mariana that a prelate would arise to fight and save Catholic tradition?
    Most of us believe this to be true.

    I don't necessarily believe it.  In fact, I could be persuaded at this point that ABL may have made some very serious missteps, for which numbers of traditional Catholics are paying a heavy price today.