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Offline SeanJohnson

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Eleison Comments 325:
« on: October 04, 2013, 08:36:44 PM »
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    Number CCCXXV (325)   5 October 2013

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    FATAL MOMENT
    Most readers of these “Comments” have probably understood by now the grave problem that is paralysing the defence of the Faith by the Society of St Pius X, and they might rather read of other things. But such is the mess created in millions of people’s minds by the global falling away from the Faith that I think one can hardly analyse too much today the nature of the Faith, the need of the Faith and how it gets undermined. Let me then, without wishing to harp on the SSPX’s recent misfortunes or misdemeanours, borrow one more example from its history of last year.

    The Society’s General Chapter of July, 2012, was hailed immediately afterwards by many of its participants as a triumph of Society unity over the distress and tensions of the several previous months. Since that time however, a more sober view of the Chapter has taken over from the euphoria, and a number of those who took part in it see it rather as having been a disaster for the Society. One of the participants, or capitulants as they are called, has described the fatal moment when the Society’s leading 39 priests (myself excluded) put their own Society and Superiors in front of the doctrine of the Faith, just as the mass of Catholic bishops had done at Vatican II.

    The Chapter’s deliberations proper opened with a serious doctrinal attack by the Rector of the SSPX seminary in Écône on the mid-April Doctrinal Declaration by which the SSPX had officially been ready to compromise with the neo-modernists in Rome on the Council, on the New Mass, on the New Code of Canon Law and on Pope Benedict’s “hermeneutic of continuity”. The attack was expressed in moderate and respectful terms, but it was most grave in substance. It meant in effect that whoever had drafted the Declaration, or encouraged its being submitted to Rome, was incompetent in Catholic doctrine. If they were consciously incompetent, they were traitors to the Faith. If unconsciously, they were unfit to be at the head of a Catholic Congregation founded to defend the Faith. So a hush fell upon the Chapter as capitulants began to realize how grave was the implicit accusation against their Superiors.

    But then the Rector of the Society’s seminary in Argentina broke the hush by saying that the Chapter could not possibly administer a slap to its Superior General by requiring of him to retract his Declaration. That retraction, he said, would be implicit in the Chapter’s final Declaration. Then some other capitulant raised a different point, and the Chapter slid on to other business. However, the doctrinal problem of the treacherous mid-April Declaration was properly resolved neither by the Chapter’s final Declaration or six Conditions for a future agreement with Rome, nor by any clear subsequent retraction on the part of the Superior General himself, on the contrary. And the Society continues to be led in practice in accordance with the same policy of being gentle with the enemies of the Faith in Rome, who tear to pieces the Faith and with it the Church.

    How could the capitulants not see that “respect for Superiors” was being put in front of the Faith ? How could they not insist that the doctrinal problem, by far the most important problem in front of the whole Chapter, should be made clear, until all of them could fully grasp what action needed to be taken immediately, and not cleverly postponed until the end of the Chapter ? The answer must be that collectively they were, like the bishops of Vatican II, children of the modern world for whom the doctrine of the Faith is not a vital necessity, but just something one learns in the seminary to become a priest, and then honours, but more or less disregards. Readers, read !

    Kyrie eleison.

    The System as one might call it, or the Establishment, or one’s structure of comfort, or “obedience”, is made to come first.
     
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    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline rlee

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #1 on: October 04, 2013, 11:08:04 PM »
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  • No wonder Bishop Tissier de Mallerais said the Chapter was a disaster.


    Offline Ecclesia Militans

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #2 on: October 05, 2013, 06:54:02 AM »
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  • And what are we now also to say about those SSPX priests who well over a year since that Chapter remain silent in the face of such treacherous behavior?  What are we to say of the faithful who continue to support these priests who remain silent by assisting at their Masses and hence show a unity of worship in the greatest public act on the face of heaven and earth?  Have they not also placed other things before the Faith?

    Shame. Shame. Shame.

    Offline Charlotte NC Bill

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #3 on: October 05, 2013, 07:19:08 AM »
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  • Wonderful EC...So the "let's wait until the end of our soiree before we insist on clarification and dismissal of this incompetent -at best-Sup Gen" mentality ruled the day...I'm not surprised..it's become like any stale organization where one must say things like 1. "great idea boss.." 2. "it was like that when I got here" and , of course, 3. "cover for me".

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #4 on: October 05, 2013, 08:14:42 AM »
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  • Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
    And what are we now also to say about those SSPX priests who well over a year since that Chapter remain silent in the face of such treacherous behavior?  What are we to say of the faithful who continue to support these priests who remain silent by assisting at their Masses and hence show a unity of worship in the greatest public act on the face of heaven and earth?  Have they not also placed other things before the Faith?

    Shame. Shame. Shame.


    And what are we to say about Pablo's video showing Fr. Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko praying with Bishop Tissier?

    They are scandalously showing unity of worship with traitors, and selling out the Resistance!!!

    How dare they!!

    They should join the Resistance!!

    We should support the Resistance and no longer attend Fr. Pfeiffer's/Hewko's Masses!!
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Charlotte NC Bill

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #5 on: October 05, 2013, 09:31:54 AM »
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  •    It seemed more like they were reaching out to Bp DeMallerais and trying to strengthen his resolve..Two bishops in the Holy Resistance would be a blessing...then maybe three..

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #6 on: October 05, 2013, 09:34:57 AM »
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  • Quote from: Charlotte NC Bill
      It seemed more like they were reaching out to Bp DeMallerais and trying to strengthen his resolve..Two bishops in the Holy Resistance would be a blessing...then maybe three..


    Obviously.

    I was mocking EM's ridiculous position.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline s2srea

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #7 on: October 05, 2013, 09:40:48 AM »
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  • Quote from: SeanJohnson

    I was mocking EM's ridiculous position.


    Indeed, why attempt to summon shame among those you say you cannot judge?

    Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
    The circuмstances of any particular individual, I cannot judge.  For example, ignorance, matter of conscience, etc.


    What a warped mentality; one which I predict will bring ruin to the Resistance, and which I want absolutely no part of.

    The true shame should be on those giving counsel to others on when and how to obtain the sacraments- for example, what to confess and not confess to an NSSPX priest, as Ecclesia Militans has done- when that is the duty reserved for ones spiritual director.

    This is a circus.


    Offline curioustrad

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #8 on: October 05, 2013, 10:29:03 AM »
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  • Quote from: Charlotte NC Bill
      It seemed more like they were reaching out to Bp DeMallerais and trying to strengthen his resolve..Two bishops in the Holy Resistance would be a blessing...then maybe three..


    That might be very difficult given that +W mentioned the reply of the rector of La Reja to the rector of Econe. The rector of La Reja was one of the 4 bishops and he wasn't English, French or Swiss.
    Please pray for my soul.
    +
    RIP

    Offline hollingsworth

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #9 on: October 05, 2013, 10:30:19 AM »
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  • Quote
    The Chapter’s deliberations proper opened with a serious doctrinal attack by the Rector of the SSPX seminary in Écône on the mid-April Doctrinal Declaration by which the SSPX had officially been ready to compromise with the neo-modernists in Rome on the Council, on the New Mass, on the New Code of Canon Law and on Pope Benedict’s “hermeneutic of continuity”. The attack was expressed in moderate and respectful terms, but it was most grave in substance. It meant in effect that whoever had drafted the Declaration, or encouraged its being submitted to Rome, was incompetent in Catholic doctrine. If they were consciously incompetent, they were traitors to the Faith. If unconsciously, they were unfit to be at the head of a Catholic Congregation founded to defend the Faith. So a hush fell upon the Chapter as capitulants began to realize how grave was the implicit accusation against their Superiors.


    I guess, then, that my first question has to be:  Who was this Rector in Econe? Certainly, he is not still the Rector, is he?  We all know how Bp. Fellay operates.  

    Offline curioustrad

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #10 on: October 05, 2013, 10:36:12 AM »
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  • I believe the rector is the same Fr. De Jorna.
    Please pray for my soul.
    +
    RIP


    Offline hollingsworth

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #11 on: October 05, 2013, 11:44:43 AM »
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  • Does anyone know how Fr. de Jorna survived?  Is he under house arrest bychance?  Surely he has been made to pay in some way, hasn't he?

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #12 on: October 05, 2013, 12:59:28 PM »
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  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    Does anyone know how Fr. de Jorna survived?  Is he under house arrest bychance?  Surely he has been made to pay in some way, hasn't he?


    According to the Econe website, he is still rector.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Frances

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #13 on: October 05, 2013, 01:57:06 PM »
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  • [/quote]

    And what are we to say about Pablo's video showing Fr. Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko praying with Bishop Tissier?

    They are scandalously showing unity of worship with traitors, and selling out the Resistance!!!

    How dare they!!

    They should join the Resistance!!

    We should support the Resistance and no longer attend Fr. Pfeiffer's/Hewko's Masses!![/quote]

     :dancing-banana:Spoken as a native New Yorker.  Love that sarcasm.  Looks like many don't "get it." :dancing-banana:

    What is to be said when both Fathers Pfeiffer were present at each other's Masses?  (They did NOT concelebrate, lest a rumor develop.)My, this IS confusing!
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  

    Offline Ecclesia Militans

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    Eleison Comments 325:
    « Reply #14 on: October 05, 2013, 05:01:55 PM »
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  • Quote from: SeanJohnson
    Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
    And what are we now also to say about those SSPX priests who well over a year since that Chapter remain silent in the face of such treacherous behavior?  What are we to say of the faithful who continue to support these priests who remain silent by assisting at their Masses and hence show a unity of worship in the greatest public act on the face of heaven and earth?  Have they not also placed other things before the Faith?

    Shame. Shame. Shame.


    And what are we to say about Pablo's video showing Fr. Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko praying with Bishop Tissier?

    They are scandalously showing unity of worship with traitors, and selling out the Resistance!!!

    How dare they!!

    They should join the Resistance!!

    We should support the Resistance and no longer attend Fr. Pfeiffer's/Hewko's Masses!!

    First of all, do you actually want to compare praying the Rosary in a private chapel with not only the public and official prayer of the Church, but the greatest act of worship on the face earth and heaven?  Now we know you are getting silly.

    Secondly, the cause of the Resistance is the defence of the Catholic Faith.  Ask yourself this question then:

    Did Fr. Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko joining in praying the Rosary with Bishop Tissier de Mallerais help or undermine the cause?  

    To the many faithful watching this, I am certain that most, if not all, thought that Bishop Tissier de Mallerais was thinking about joining the Resistance and not the Fathers coming back to the SSPX.  Witnessing this eliminated the leprosy that many thought the Fathers had caught.  Therefore, it helped the Resistance cause way more than it hurt it.