Author Topic: Don Curzio Nitoglia: Support Bishop Williamson (Read 3811 times)

John Grace · « **on:** October 26, 2012, 05:35:21 PM »

'Dumb Ox' posted this Don Curzio Nitoglia article on IA.Hopefully it is not 'archived'

http://cathinfo-warning-pornography!/Ignis_Ardens/index.php?showtopic=11223

Quote

Unofficial translation

Expulsion of Bishop Williamson: Do Not Leave Him On His Own
http://doncurzionitoglia.net/2012/10/26/es...asciamolo-solo/
26th October 2012

Bishop Richard Williamson was expelled from the Society of St. Pius X, for "having distanced himself from the management and the government of the SSPX" (Communiqué of the General House, Menzingen October 24, 2012).

In reality for several years - especially since 2009 - the "management" of the Society has taken as conditions of acceptance, required by Benedict XVI to be considered in full ecclesial communion, a perilous position of dialogue and excessive openness to the novelty of Vatican II and to the h0Ɩ0cαųst . It is particularly Bishop Williamson's opposition to these errors that are disguised under the disciplinary aspect.

The Superior General of the Society recognized - in September 2012 - that he had been deceived and that Benedict XVI wanted the Society to accept the New Mass and Vatican II. Now that is just what Bishop Williamson "had distanced" himself from and tried to correct; the new direction of the Society.

If a Superior General declares himself deceived, after several years, by a party who spoke openly and did not hide its end, or who is not able to govern or is in collusion with the enemy-party, "tertium not datur." [there is no alternative]

Benedict XVI has never hidden that, according to him, Vatican II and the Novus Ordo Mass are in continuity with Tradition. It has not been possible to recognise otherwise and whoever thinks differently offers an unacceptable lie and an insult to the common sense of every man. In Naples, they say: "qui nessuno è stupido" [here there is no one who is stupid]. The Superior in question should thank Bishop Williamson for the warning, and not expel him. Indeed he should resign himself.

The expulsion of Bishop Williamson raises fears, with a serious probability, that the desire is to resume negotiations with Benedict XVI accepting, tacitly or practically, his hermeneutic of continuity between Apostolic Tradition and the Second Vatican Council.

In these circuмstances, it is necessary to support Bishop Williamson, do not leave him alone and do not to follow the entryist course of the Society, which will gradually - similarly to the Catholic Alliance - at least tacitly accept the new Conciliar and post-Conciliar practice.

What should be done? In conscience - without wanting to engage in sterile polemics or despise anyone - I have to say publicly in order not to be a hypocrite that I can not approve of the current orientation and direction of the Society. That said, I hope not to have to return to the subject. I've never been "Society centric" and I do not like to talk and argue about the Society constantly and so I keep away from that vicious cycle. "In the Lord's House are many mansions".

As for the faithful who have asked for advice, I think they can still attend Mass celebrated by priests of the Society, if they are closer to home, but without following its new direction.

At this point of extreme confusion, the faithful can easily attend Masses of St. Pius V even if they are offered by "Ecclesia Dei" institutions or priests who make use of the Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificuм with due care, as now between them and the Fraternity there is little substantial difference. Indeed, while "Ecclesia Dei" is going from bottom to top, the Society is descending from top to bottom.

In addition, the faithful now have to give their support to Bishop Williamson, and the priests and religious houses that remain intact from any compromise with Neo-modernism and ʝʊdɛօ-Christianity. "Deeds, not words" (St. Ignatius).

Priests who do not want to be recycled by the neo-Modernists, follow Bishop Williamson. If this bishop is supported only in words but not in deeds he can not fully perform his work of full witness to the truth.

Now the priests who are not inclined to doctrinal compromise have at their disposal a bishop, at least one monastery in Brazil and, if they are numerous, they can also have many houses in which to carry out their apostolate and a seminary to train in full fidelity to Tradition candidates for the priesthood.

It's all about not being intimidated ("latrare potes, mordere no potest nisi volentem.") [He is able to bark, but not to bite unless allowed to], as when instead of the Novus Ordo Mass you chose the Traditional Mass. So now you must choose Tradition and not compromise, surrendering to Divine Providence and co-operating freely with it. "He who created you without you, will not save you without you" (St. Augustine).

Don Curzio Nitoglia

John Grace · « **Reply #1 on:** October 26, 2012, 05:59:26 PM »

http://cathinfo-warning-pornography!/Ignis_Ardens/index.php?showtopic=11223&view=getnewpost

Quote

Excellent letter, except the part about going to indults now.

True, there will be little doctrinal difference between the two camps, but one will still have certainly valid priests and bishops, and one will have questionable priests and bishops.

I would not avail myself of questionable sacraments except in the gravest necessity.

Good observation. I would advise against attending the Indult though some who attend the SSPX attend both. I believe SSPX clerics should be firm in this regard. For example, Fr Morgan has made it clear where faithful should attend Mass. I welcome this. Stick with the SSPX.

These Indult groups are only established to undermine the SSPX and other groups. I would rather people attend an independent chapel than these Indult/Diocesan Mass centre's.

I was a bit disappointed when I told some folk about the news about the Bishop only to learn they had been at Mass via the Institute Christ the King.What a shame. Them crowd are worse than the FSSP.

stgobnait · « **Reply #2 on:** October 26, 2012, 06:20:06 PM »

i hope fr morgan will have more to say, than where the faithful should attend Mass, which sspx is he sticking with... only asking....

John Grace · « **Reply #3 on:** October 26, 2012, 06:43:20 PM »

Quote

Eleison Comments
CONCILIAR INFECTION Number CCLXIII (263) 28 July 2012

May Catholics who wish to keep the Faith attend a Tridentine Mass celebrated by a priest who is part of the Conciliar Church, for instance by his belonging to the Institute of Christ the King or to the Fraternity of St Peter ? The answer has to be that, as a rule, a Catholic may not attend such a Mass, even if it is a Tridentine Mass, and even if it is worthily celebrated. What can be the justification for such a seemingly strict rule ?

The basic reason is that the Catholic Faith is more important than the Mass. For if through no fault of my own even for a long time I cannot attend Mass but I keep the Faith, then I can still save my soul, whereas if I lose the Faith but for whatever reason go on attending Mass, I cannot save my soul (“Without faith it is impossible to please God” - Heb. XI, 6). Thus I attend Mass in order to live my Faith, and, belief going with worship, I attend the true Mass in order to keep the true Faith. I do not keep the Faith in order to attend Mass.

It follows that if the celebration of a Tridentine Mass is surrounded by circuмstances that threaten to undermine my faith, then depending on the gravity of the threat, I may not attend such a Mass. That is why Masses celebrated by schismatic Orthodox priests may be valid, but the Church in her right mind used to forbid Catholics to attend on pain of grave sin, because, belief and worship going together, the non-Catholic worship threatened the Catholics’ faith. Now Orthodoxy has in the course of centuries caused huge harm to the Catholic Church, but can anything compare with the devastation wrought upon that Church within mere tens of years by Conciliarism ? If then Catholics were forbidden to attend Mass in Orthodox circuмstances, would not the same Church in her right mind forbid to attend a Tridentine Mass celebrated in Conciliar circuмstances?

Then what is meant by Conciliar circuмstances ? The answer must be, any circuмstances which, over a shorter or longer period of time, are going to make me think that the Second Vatican Council was not an utter disaster for the Church. Such a circuмstance might be a charming and believing priest who has no problem with celebrating either the new or the old Mass, and who preaches and acts as though the Council presents no serious problem. Conciliarism is so dangerous because it can so be made to seem Catholic that I can lose the Faith without - or almost without - realizing it.

Of course common sense will take into account a variety of special circuмstances. For instance a good priest trapped for now within the Conciliar church may need encouragement to start on his way out of it by my attending his first celebrations of the true Mass. But the general rule must remain that I can have nothing to do with even the true Mass being celebrated in a Conciliar context. For confirmation, notice how Rome began by allowing the Institute of the Good Shepherd to celebrate exclusively the true Mass, because Rome knew that once the Institute had swallowed the official hook, eventually Rome could be sure of pulling the Institute into their Conciliar net. Sure enough. It took only five years.

That is the danger of any practical agreement without a doctrinal agreement between Rome and the Society of St Pius X. So long as Rome believes in its Conciliar doctrine, it is bound to use any such agreement to pull the SSPX in the direction of the Council, and the context of every SSPX Mass would become Conciliar, if not rapidly, at least in the long run. Forewarned is forearmed.

Kyrie eleison.

Maria Elizabeth · « **Reply #4 on:** October 27, 2012, 10:38:50 PM »

Quote from: John Grace

'Dumb Ox' posted this Don Curzio Nitoglia article on IA.Hopefully it is not 'archived'

http://cathinfo-warning-pornography!/Ignis_Ardens/index.php?showtopic=11223
Quote
Unofficial translation

Expulsion of Bishop Williamson: Do Not Leave Him On His Own
http://doncurzionitoglia.net/2012/10/26/es...asciamolo-solo/
26th October 2012

Bishop Richard Williamson was expelled from the Society of St. Pius X, for "having distanced himself from the management and the government of the SSPX" (Communiqué of the General House, Menzingen October 24, 2012).

In reality for several years - especially since 2009 - the "management" of the Society has taken as conditions of acceptance, required by Benedict XVI to be considered in full ecclesial communion, a perilous position of dialogue and excessive openness to the novelty of Vatican II and to the h0Ɩ0cαųst . It is particularly Bishop Williamson's opposition to these errors that are disguised under the disciplinary aspect.

The Superior General of the Society recognized - in September 2012 - that he had been deceived and that Benedict XVI wanted the Society to accept the New Mass and Vatican II. Now that is just what Bishop Williamson "had distanced" himself from and tried to correct; the new direction of the Society.

If a Superior General declares himself deceived, after several years, by a party who spoke openly and did not hide its end, or who is not able to govern or is in collusion with the enemy-party, "tertium not datur." [there is no alternative]

Benedict XVI has never hidden that, according to him, Vatican II and the Novus Ordo Mass are in continuity with Tradition. It has not been possible to recognise otherwise and whoever thinks differently offers an unacceptable lie and an insult to the common sense of every man. In Naples, they say: "qui nessuno è stupido" [here there is no one who is stupid]. The Superior in question should thank Bishop Williamson for the warning, and not expel him. Indeed he should resign himself.

The expulsion of Bishop Williamson raises fears, with a serious probability, that the desire is to resume negotiations with Benedict XVI accepting, tacitly or practically, his hermeneutic of continuity between Apostolic Tradition and the Second Vatican Council.

In these circuмstances, it is necessary to support Bishop Williamson, do not leave him alone and do not to follow the entryist course of the Society, which will gradually - similarly to the Catholic Alliance - at least tacitly accept the new Conciliar and post-Conciliar practice.

What should be done? In conscience - without wanting to engage in sterile polemics or despise anyone - I have to say publicly in order not to be a hypocrite that I can not approve of the current orientation and direction of the Society. That said, I hope not to have to return to the subject. I've never been "Society centric" and I do not like to talk and argue about the Society constantly and so I keep away from that vicious cycle. "In the Lord's House are many mansions".

As for the faithful who have asked for advice, I think they can still attend Mass celebrated by priests of the Society, if they are closer to home, but without following its new direction.

At this point of extreme confusion, the faithful can easily attend Masses of St. Pius V even if they are offered by "Ecclesia Dei" institutions or priests who make use of the Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificuм with due care, as now between them and the Fraternity there is little substantial difference. Indeed, while "Ecclesia Dei" is going from bottom to top, the Society is descending from top to bottom.

In addition, the faithful now have to give their support to Bishop Williamson, and the priests and religious houses that remain intact from any compromise with Neo-modernism and ʝʊdɛօ-Christianity. "Deeds, not words" (St. Ignatius).

Priests who do not want to be recycled by the neo-Modernists, follow Bishop Williamson. If this bishop is supported only in words but not in deeds he can not fully perform his work of full witness to the truth.

Now the priests who are not inclined to doctrinal compromise have at their disposal a bishop, at least one monastery in Brazil and, if they are numerous, they can also have many houses in which to carry out their apostolate and a seminary to train in full fidelity to Tradition candidates for the priesthood.

It's all about not being intimidated ("latrare potes, mordere no potest nisi volentem.") [He is able to bark, but not to bite unless allowed to], as when instead of the Novus Ordo Mass you chose the Traditional Mass. So now you must choose Tradition and not compromise, surrendering to Divine Providence and co-operating freely with it. "He who created you without you, will not save you without you" (St. Augustine).

Don Curzio Nitoglia

I love this letter.

But, excuse me for asking, who is Don Curzio Nitoglia?

Telesphorus · « **Reply #5 on:** October 28, 2012, 02:57:04 AM »

Quote from: Maria Elizabeth

I love this letter.

But, excuse me for asking, who is Don Curzio Nitoglia?

He's written for effedieffe.com for some time now.

Here is Dumb Ox's description of him:

Quote from: Dumb Ox

"Who is this priest? I see that he is not a member of the SSPX".

Don Curzio is a former priest of SSPX who left in 1985 to help found the Istituto Mater Boni Consilii. He came to reject the sedeprivationist thesis and returned as an independent priest allied closely to SSPX.

More specifically he caters for the spiritual needs of the sisters belonging to the Disciples of the Cenacle at Velletri. They are the nuns established by Don Francesco Putti, founder of the review Si Si No No.

Between them they continue the work of Don Putti, who was himself formed by Padre Pio and was encouraged to enter the priesthood by the saint, and continue to publish Si Si No No.

Here is a site of his:

http://www.doncurzionitoglia.com/testi_liberamente_consultabili_donCurzio.htm

Ethelred · « **Reply #6 on:** October 28, 2012, 07:01:39 AM »

Don Nitoglia also looked after the sisters of the SSPX in Albano, Italy.

And he wrote one of the theologically smartest defences for Bishop Williamson in 2009, unmasking the "h0Ɩ0cαųst" lie with traditional Catholic theology.

(Don Nitoglia is one of the few traditional Catholic clerics in continental Europe who's very well versed with the "h0Ɩ0cαųst" complex.)

bowler · « **Reply #7 on:** October 28, 2012, 08:45:25 AM »

Attending an indult mass in an emergency would be the same as attending a Novus-SSPX mass, except for one BIG difference, which is why I don't attend the indult:

I have serious doubts as to the validity of their priests, and even more doubts about their bishops, "consecrated" in the new rite.