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Offline Machabees

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District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
« on: January 01, 2013, 07:24:40 PM »
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  • There is much here to read "in between" the lines of the SSPX secret negotiations with Rome since October 2011; and some chronology...of Fr. Edward Black, District Superior of Australia.

    More parts to the "puzzle":
    http://www.sspx.com.au/district_newletter.html

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    SSPX Australia District Newsletter – August 2012
    My Dear Brethren,

    As most of you will be aware I recently attended the General Chapter Meeting of the Society which took place at Econe Switzerland from 3rd to 14th July.  After a five-day retreat the various Superiors of the Society were able to discuss and assess various matters, most particularly the recent relations with Rome and the question of a possible canonical normalization of the Society and its recognition by the Vatican as a Personal Prelature.

     It was not that long ago, in October of last year, that we met to discuss the same question.  It appears that the present Pope wanted to find a solution to the fraught relations between our Society and the Vatican and to that end presented us in September of last year with a Doctrinal Preamble which we were to accept in view of a canonical regularization.  However, the Rome meeting concluded that this could not, in fact, be accepted without compromising the position which the Society has always adopted in regard to the reforms which have devastated the Church since the Second Vatican Council.  However, this was not the end of the matter as Rome’s proposal was open to negotiation which was subsequently conducted between the Vatican and our Superior General and his Assistants.  Unfortunately, the fact that this was conducted in secret for various diplomatic reasons gave rise to wild speculation and although details of these negotiations were not revealed the general understanding seemed to be that Rome was becoming more and more generous in our regard with the result that it was soon being affirmed that the Society would shortly be erected as a Personal Prelature.

    This situation was greeted with enthusiasm by those Traditional Catholics who perceived something of a return to the Church’s traditions during the present pontificate and who looked forward to the day when the stigma of being “excommunicated”, “schismatic” and the like would be lifted and a much wider apostolate would be opened up to the Society.  Others regarded this development with dismay, arguing that any return to Tradition is purely superficial, that the basic policies of the Vatican have not changed since the Council, that the general state of the Church continues to deteriorate and that it would be foolhardy and premature to entrust ourselves to the ecclesiastical authorities who have continued to persecute us.  Many priests and laity in different countries became vociferous about the matter with various declarations appearing on the Internet.  This confusion was compounded when it was revealed that even the four bishops of the Society were not in agreement in regard to the question.

     I quite deliberately made no public observation about these matters as so much speculation made it unclear as to what was the reality of the situation, the full details of which were yet to be revealed.  I also congratulate you all in being calm and patient and thus the Society in Australia was spared much useless controversy.  This was well advised, as shortly before the Chapter Meeting the Vatican advised Bishop Fellay that, in substance, the conditions expressed in the Doctrinal Preamble of September were, in fact, non-negotiable and this effectively brought the whole question to an end even before the Chapter was convened.

     The Chapter Meeting therefore was conducted in a manner which was far less charged with contention than might otherwise have been the case and the unity and peace of the Society has providentially been preserved.  At the end of the Meeting the following declaration was released:

    At the conclusion of the General Chapter of the Society of St. Pius X, gathered together at the tomb of its venerated founder, Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, and united with its Superior General, the participants, bishops, superiors, and most senior members of the Society elevate to Heaven our heartfelt thanksgiving, grateful for the 42 years of marvellous Divine protection over our work, amidst a Church in crisis and a world which distances itself farther from God and His law with each passing day.

    We wish to express our gratitude to each and every member of our Society: priests, brothers, sisters, third order members; to the religious communities close to us and also to our dear faithful, for their constant dedication and for their fervent prayers on the occasion of this Chapter, marked by frank exchanges of views and by a very fruitful common work. Every sacrifice and pain accepted with generosity has contributed to overcome the difficulties which the Society has encountered in recent times. We have recovered our profound unity in its essential mission: to preserve and defend the Catholic Faith, to form good priests, and to strive towards the restoration of Christendom. We have determined and approved the necessary conditions for an eventual canonical normalization. We have decided that, in that case, an extraordinary Chapter with deliberative vote will be convened beforehand.

    We must never forget that the sanctification of souls always starts within ourselves. It is the fruit of a faith which becomes vivifying and operating by the work of charity, according to the words of St. Paul: “For we can do nothing against the truth: but for the truth” (cf. II Cor., XIII, 8), and “as Christ also loved the church and delivered himself up for it… that it should be holy and without blemish” (cf. Eph. V, 25 s.).

    The Chapter believes that the paramount duty of the Society, in the service which it intends to offer to the Church, is to continue, with God’s help, to profess the Catholic Faith in all its purity and integrity, with a determination matching the intensity of the constant attacks to which this very Faith is subjected nowadays.
    For this reason it seems opportune that we reaffirm our faith in the Roman Catholic Church, the unique Church founded by Our Lord Jesus Christ, outside of which there is no salvation nor possibility to find the means leading to salvation; our faith in its monarchical constitution, desired by Our Lord Himself, by which the supreme power of government over the universal Church belongs only to the Pope, Vicar of Christ on earth; our faith in the universal Kingship of Our Lord Jesus Christ, Creator of both the natural and the supernatural orders, to Whom every man and every society must submit.

    The Society continues to uphold the declarations and the teachings of the constant Magisterium of the Church in regard to all the novelties of the Second Vatican Council which remain tainted with errors, and also in regard to the reforms issued from it. We find our sure guide in this uninterrupted Magisterium which, by its teaching authority, transmits the revealed Deposit of Faith in perfect harmony with the truths that the entire Church has professed, always and everywhere.

    The Society finds its guide as well in the constant Tradition of the Church, which transmits and will transmit until the end of time the teachings required to preserve the Faith and the salvation of souls, while waiting for the day when an open and serious debate will be possible which may allow the return to Tradition of the ecclesiastical authorities.

    We wish to unite ourselves to the other Christians persecuted in different countries of the world who are now suffering for the Catholic Faith, some even to the extent of martyrdom. Their blood, shed in union with the Victim of our altars, is the pledge for a true renewal of the Church in capite et membris, according to the old saying sanguis martyrum semen christianorum.

    “Finally, we turn our eyes to the Blessed Virgin Mary, who is also jealous of the privileges of her Divine Son, jealous of His glory, of His Kingdom on earth as in Heaven. How often has she intervened for the defense, even the armed defense, of Christendom against the enemies of the Kingdom of Our Lord! We entreat her to intervene today to chase the enemies out from inside the Church who are trying to destroy it more radically than its enemies from outside. May she deign to keep in the integrity of the Faith, in the love of the Church, in devotion to the Successor of Peter, all the members of the Society of St. Pius X and all the priests and faithful who labor alongside the Society, in order that she may both keep us from schism and preserve us from heresy.

    “May St. Michael the Archangel inspire us with his zeal for the glory of God and with his strength to fight the devil.

    “May St. Pius X share with us a part of his wisdom, of his learning, of his sanctity, to discern the true from the false and the good from the evil in these times of confusion and lies.” (Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre; Albano, October 19, 1983).

    Given at Ecône, on the 14th of July of the Year of the Lord 2012

    Therefore the Society will continue its work much the same as before until God’s Providence decides that the propitious moment has come when the Church Authorities recognise the disastrous impact which the Second Vatican Council and the new liturgy have had upon the Church and our Society can be recognised and work with them for a true restoration of all things Catholic.

     Various administrative changes will soon take place in the Society in Australia.  Many of you are aware that the Superiors of the different countries are appointed for terms of six years.  I am about to complete my second term as Superior of Australia and I will be replaced in that role by Father John Fullerton who is an American priest who has already served a term as the Superior of the United States and who is at present the Rector of St. Mary’s College Kansas.  Once Father Fullerton arrives in Sydney, which may not be for several weeks yet, I will take up my new position at Hampton in Melbourne.  It has been a great privilege for me to serve you during these last twelve years during which time I have become very fond of Australia.  I am most grateful for all of your prayers and support and therefore I am very pleased I will be staying with you for a little while longer.

     Several further changes will take place amongst the priests.  As previously stated I am to go to Hampton where I will replace Fr. Doran who has been transferred to Canada.  Fr. Todd Stephens will replace Fr. Taouk who in turn will go to Brisbane to replace Fr. Anderson who has been appointed to the United States.  We welcome to Australia a newly ordained priest, Fr. Christopher Polley, who will come to Rockdale to take the place of Fr. Todd Stephens.  It is envisaged that at the end of the year an exchange will take place between Fr. Polley and Fr. Vachon who is presently at Park Ridge.

    New appointments have also been made amongst the Sisters at Rockdale.   Sister Mary Gemma who has spent many years with the community here and latterly as Superior will soon leave Australia for the United States where she will become the Superior of the convent at Browerville.  She will be succeeded by Sister Mary Theophane, an American, who at present is Superior of the community at Marseille in France.  We welcome back to Australia our own Sister Mary Michael, the first member of the Sisters of the Society of St. Pius X who has spent the last few years at St. Mary’s Kansas.  Sister Mary Joachim recently left us for America and will be replaced shortly by Sister Mary Monica from the Philippines.

    Our heartfelt thanks and prayers go with the Priests and Sisters who are leaving us and we wish them every grace, strength and blessing in their new apostolate.

    I am delighted to announce that our Superior General Bishop Fellay will be visiting Australia very soon from 4th until 21st August and will visit our principal churches in Perth, Adelaide, Melbourne (Hampton and Tynong) Sydney and Brisbane.  He will also spend several days at the seminary in Goulburn.  Precise details of his visit will be announced at these different centres.
    With every good wish and blessing,

    Yours most sincerely in Christ,

    Fr Edward Black
    District Superior


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #1 on: January 01, 2013, 07:38:38 PM »
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  • Talk about a non-statement blather of nothingness.

    All I see here is the SOS about how nothing has changed, and we are the same old sspx, now that everything has been resolved.

    What a bunch of crap.

    Why do they even waste the effort to publish this tired pablum?
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline nipr

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #2 on: January 01, 2013, 08:11:14 PM »
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  • Quote from: Seraphim
    Talk about a non-statement blather of nothingness.

    All I see here is the SOS about how nothing has changed, and we are the same old sspx, now that everything has been resolved.

    What a bunch of crap.

    Why do they even waste the effort to publish this tired pablum?


    Because people would rather hear a "once upon a time...and they lived happily ever after" story than read the headlines.

    Offline magdalena

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #3 on: January 01, 2013, 08:23:28 PM »
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  • The proof is in the pudding.  And the pudding isn't looking too good.  
    But one thing is necessary. Mary hath chosen the best part, which shall not be taken away from her.
    Luke 10:42

    Offline Anthony Benedict

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #4 on: January 01, 2013, 09:03:52 PM »
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  • One might question the use of the term "confusion" regarding the split within the Society.  Frankly, there seems little.

    Legitimate, vital questions remain unanswered by Mentizingen.  This is hardly "confusion" but, instead, a deliberate avoidance which reasonable men cannot escape considering in the light of continuing statements by certain figures in Rome and Society representatives that a deal is very much still in the offing.

    Clear arguments representing the Society's own "tradition" ( nothing more nor less than Church tradition itself, prior to the Revolution ) on capital points, offered by a deeply troubled "minority", are characterized as "rebellious", "dissident", etc.  While not very sporting, it is little else than simple political retaliation.  But, again, it hardly constitutes a state of "confusion".  Mentingen's iron fist in a titanium glove is not subtle.


    Offline Francisco

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #5 on: January 02, 2013, 05:48:58 AM »
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  • Quote from: Seraphim
    Talk about a non-statement blather of nothingness.

    All I see here is the SOS about how nothing has changed, and we are the same old sspx, now that everything has been resolved.

    What a bunch of crap.

    Why do they even waste the effort to publish this tired pablum?


    .....I am about to complete my second term as Superior of Australia and I will be replaced in that role by Father John Fullerton who is an American priest who has already served a term as the Superior of the United States and who is at present the Rector of St. Mary’s College Kansas.  Once Father Fullerton arrives in Sydney, which may not be for several weeks yet, I will take up my new position at Hampton in Melbourne.  It has been a great privilege for me to serve you during these last twelve years during which time I have become very fond of Australia.  I am most grateful for all of your prayers and support and therefore I am very pleased I will be staying with you for a little while longer.....

    He is in his early sixties and I heard that he considers himself old. He is "very fond of Australia" and is staying on in Melbourne, a cushy place, so no problem for him to dole out this "bunch of crap".

    Offline Gail

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #6 on: January 02, 2013, 06:28:07 AM »
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  • Francisco,

    I am an Australian, and I know Fr. Black, and although I support the priests of of the Resistance completely, nevertheless I know Fr. Black to be a very dedicated and sincere priest,  and after so many years of responsibility of leadership in England and Australia, he well and truly deserves a rest!

    Offline Mea Culpa

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #7 on: January 02, 2013, 09:08:19 AM »
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  • Quote from: Gail
    Francisco,

    I am an Australian, and I know Fr. Black, and although I support the priests of of the Resistance completely, nevertheless I know Fr. Black to be a very dedicated and sincere priest,  and after so many years of responsibility of leadership in England and Australia, he well and truly deserves a rest!



    I disagree about this "rest" thing.  

    With the given knowledge of Bp. Fellay's intentions to join Rome, Fr. Black should be well aware that this is a battle (even if martyrdom is necessary) in all of us to hold fast/strong to the True Faith.

    I'm still to read about a Saint that looked to "rest" while living on earth.

    True rest is only crowned in Heaven.





    Offline Gail

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #8 on: January 02, 2013, 02:24:34 PM »
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  • I meant a physical rest NOT a spiritual rest.

    Offline bowler

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #9 on: January 02, 2013, 04:12:55 PM »
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  • Fr. Black did a great job countering the SSPX Dialogue Mass infiltrators with his letter to the The Remnant, maybe that is why he was replaced as the District Superior of Australia?

    From- http://credidimus.wordpress.com/2012/07/11/dialogue-mass/

    Dialogue Mass
    by Rev. E. Black

    As must surely be the case with many readers of The Remnant, I have
    followed the series of articles on the Dialogue Mass  under the title
    ‘Debating the Relevant Issues’ with increasing bemusement.

    In what sense is the question of the Dialogue Mass relevant to us and
    where is this debate going? The extremely detailed article of Mr Tofari was
    certainly reminiscent of the content and style of the liturgical reformers of
    the 1950s and it is not surprising that it should have evinced the alarmed
    response of Mr Dahl. Are there really any traditional Catholics ready to
    repeat the painful experiences of 50 years ago? Mr Tofari’s article seems to
    indicate that he, at least, is one. Although he rightly states that Dialogue
    Mass is not a matter of doctrine but of praxis, he nevertheless also states
    that it is an important question. Indeed it is. Silence and sound are
    mutually exclusive. If his assertion is ever conceded in practice that a
    single person who decides to avail himself of making the responses at
    Mass has every right to do so then it spells the final end of what was once
    the universal and exclusive practice of the Western Church for more than
    1000 years. Although this is an important matter, it is likewise a tiresome
    one – for it seems that every traditional institution and practice must be
    permanently placed in a position of self-defence and called upon at any
    time to justify itself.



    Second Vatican Council (1962 – 1965)

    The standard procedure of the liturgical reformers has always been to
    appeal to the practice of the early Church, ignoring the greater part of her
    history until the twentieth century, (save for the purposes of ridiculing it),
    in order to justify their innovations. Once papal sanction is granted to their
    ideas they invariably invoke this authority, oftentimes without adequate
    justification. It is truly remarkable how they did, in fact, obtain sanction for
    most of their proposed reforms both before and after the Second Vatican
    Council even to the point of the de facto abolition of the traditional rite of
    Mass itself! At the time, the average Catholic had no notion of the
    machinations of the leaders of the Liturgical Movement, or indeed of the
    liturgical practices of the primitive Church.  The argument of papal authority
    was enough for all of the reforms to be generally accepted without
    question. The final step then is to present the innovations as the authentic
    tradition of the Church.

    Mr Tofari’s article follows the same method. He attempts to prove his case
    by an appeal to the primitive Church and the Oriental rites to establish and
    prove active lay participation in the sense that such participation should be
    vocal; derides the liturgical practices of the medieval, baroque and
    subsequent eras and he even makes a case that the development of the
    liturgical practice during these long centuries was vitiated by the influence
    of Protestant individualism and pietism, etc. Even more fantastically he
    appropriates a description of the form of Low Mass which is known and
    loved by all of us as ‘the great Irish silence’, as if this practice was not
    universal throughout the worldwide Church! Such a thesis entirely
    excludes the operation of the Holy Ghost in the development and
    enrichment of the Church’s worship throughout history.



    Solemn High Mass

    One of the most perplexing assertions is as follows: ‘… for nearly 200 years
     after the Renaissance the unfortunate liturgical status quo remained
    virtually static despite the enormous efforts of Dom Guéranger and a host
    of others. Despite more than a few errors from some, all agreed on one
    completely orthodox thought: the Church’s liturgical piety must be restored
    to the forefront of the daily life of the average Catholic.’ How can the
    liturgical life of the Church as always practised be unfortunate? Whatever
    they had in mind to foster liturgical piety it was certainly not the Dialogue
    Mass which did not exist, nor indeed was envisaged at the time.
    Furthermore, this statement overlooks the fact that it is precisely the Low
    Mass which brings this liturgical piety to the forefront of the daily life of the
    average Catholic. Given that the Solemn High Mass is the accepted original
    and authentic form of the Roman liturgy, it is manifest that it could not be
    celebrated every day except in places like great cathedrals and monastic
    establishments. In order to make it possible for the priest to celebrate and
    for the laity to participate on a daily basis the ‘silent’ Low Mass was
    devised. [The author is aware that parts of the Low Mass are to be recited
    in a clear voice. He uses the term ‘silent’ in order to distinguish it from
    Dialogue Mass].

    [uploaded attachment - it was too wide and I tried to shrink it ~ N.G.]
    Iconostasis in a Greek Catholic Cathedral

    Could anything be more apostolic – the possibility which the Low Mass
    provided of having the Holy Sacrifice in almost any place or circuмstance –
    thus rendering the highest act of worship accessible to all? This is surely
    the greatest expression of an authentic active lay participation in the
    liturgical life of the Church! To appeal to the Oriental rites as providing
    superior lay participation is fatuous. Mr Tofari states that, ‘even today the
    very idea of the laity attending the Divine Liturgy as muted spectators is
    incomprehensible in the Eastern rites’. Of course, as in the Roman rite, the
    laity of the Eastern Rites may participate in the liturgical chant but unlike us
    they may not, in reality, be spectators at all as the iconostasis completely
    obscures their view! Interestingly enough, the iconostasis is not intended
    as a means of excluding the laity, but rather its doors represent the link
    between heaven and earth. This indeed represents more authentically the
    idea of the union of priest and people at the Mass throughout the
    centuries. A notion which, of course, is completely rejected by the Liturgical
    Movement of the twentieth century. Furthermore, the Orientals may not
    assist at Mass every day for the reasons stated above, and finally, there is
    no provision for Dialogue Mass in the their Rites!

    The author of Liturgical Principles and Notions makes the case that as the
    laity have always been permitted to sing the High Mass, it is logical that
    they should be allowed to make the responses at Low Mass. As this seems
    reasonable, we may well wonder why, until the twentieth century, this was
    never done or even encouraged anywhere. The idea that it was the result
    of persecution in anti-Catholic countries is a fallacy. Dialogue Mass was
    quite as unknown in the Papal States as in the Ireland of penal times!
    Indeed, the fact that Sung Mass (Missa Cantata) only appeared in the
    eighteenth century and bilingual missals for laity in the nineteenth
    suggests that the idea of active lay participation – if such an idea existed
    at the time – was, in fact, discouraged. That this state of affairs existed for
    more than 1000 years must surely mean that it cannot be considered
    merely as an abuse [and] as the result of neglect of the laity by the popes
    and ecclesiastical authorities. This being so, I submit that it stemmed from
    the fact that it is never necessary to state the obvious. It is only when
    things become obscured that it is necessary to explain their meaning. The
    liturgy of the Church had always been understood as a common act, [that
    is], the physical presence of the ritualised sacrifice of Calvary rather than
    an exercise of Common prayer.

    No doubt Christ’s sacrifice is indeed a prayer – even the highest prayer
    which exists – but a distinction must be made. This is quite well summed
    up in a nineteenth-century polemical writing against Protestant notions of
    worship which I quote in extenso as it gives a view entirely opposite to
    that of Mr Tofari; [that is], that rather it is active participation in the sense
    in which he understands it that is influenced by Protestant notions – not
    the reverse!

        The main difficulty experienced by Protestants in witnessing Catholic
    worship arises from their not understanding the difference between a
    common act and a common prayer. The acts of the Church, such as
    processions, expositions of the Blessed Sacrament, the administration of
    the Sacraments, and above all the Holy Sacrifice, are indeed always
    accompanied by prayer, and generally by prayers of priest and people,
    though not necessarily by united or common prayer. In any case, the act
    must be distinguished from the prayers.

        A Protestant may easily understand what is meant by this distinction by
    aid of a few illustrations: Suppose a ship, filled with a mixed crew of
    [English,] French, Spanish and Portuguese is being wrecked off the coast
    of England. A crowd is assembled on the cliff, watching with intense
    earnestness the efforts being made by the captain and crew on the one
    hand, and by life boats from the coast on the other, to save the lives of the
    passengers. A great act is being performed, in which all are taking part,
    some as immediate actors; others as eager assistants. We may suppose
    this act carried out in the midst of united prayers. English, French, Spanish,
    Portuguese, each in their own tongues and many without spoken words at
    all, are sending up petitions to Almighty God for the safety of the
    passengers. It is a common act at which they assist; it is accompanied by
    the prayers of all; but they are not common prayers, in the sense of all
    joining either vocally or mentally in the same form of words.


        When the priest Zacharias had gone into the temple of the Lord to offer
    incense, and ‘all the multitude of the people was praying without’ (Luke
    1:9), there was a common act performed by priest and people – by the
    priest as actor, by the people as assistants – and the act was accompanied
    by united prayers. But it mattered not to the people what language was
    spoken by the priest or what sacred formulae were used. Their intentions
    were joined with his. Their individual and varied petitions were one great
    Amen said to his sacerdotal invocations; and all ascended together in a
    sweet-smelling cloud of incense to Heaven.

        Or to come still nearer to Catholic worship, let the reader represent to
    himself the great act of Calvary. Our Lord Jesus


        ‘Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?’

        Christ is Priest and Victim. He accompanies His oblation of Himself with
    mysterious and most sacred prayer. Two of His seven words are from the
    Psalms; and it has therefore been conjectured that He continued to recite
    secretly the Psalm, after giving us the clue to it, by pronouncing the words,
    ‘Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? – My God, my God , why hast Thou forsaken
    Me?’ Or again, ‘Father, into Thy hands I commend My Spirit.’ There were
    many assistants at that act and among those who assisted piously – the
    Blessed Mother of Jesus, the Apostle St John, the holy women, the
    centurion, the multitude ‘who returned striking their breasts’ – there was a
    certain unity in variety, not a uniform prayer, yet a great act of harmonious
    worship.

        There are, then, prayers used in Catholic churches in which the whole
    congregation joins, such as the singing of hymns, the recitation of the
    Rosary, performing the Stations of the Way of the Cross, especially the
    chanting of Vespers or Compline. Such prayers are either recited in the
    vernacular, or, when Latin is used, they require some little education in
    those who take a direct and vocal part in them. But the great act of
    Catholic worship is the Holy Mass, or the Unbloody Sacrifice. One alone
    stands forth and makes the awful offering; the rest kneel around, and join
    their intentions and devotions with his; but even were there not a solitary
    worshipper present, the sacrifice both for the living and dead would be
    efficacious and complete. To join in this act of sacrifice, and to participate in
    its effects, it is not necessary to follow the priest or to use the words he
    uses. Every Catholic knows what the priest is doing, though he may not
    know or understand what he is saying, and is consequently able to follow
    with his devotions every portion of the Holy Sacrifice. Hence, [it is] a
    wonderful union of sacrificial, of congregational and of individual devotion.
    The prayers of the priest are not substituted for those of the people. No
    one desires to force his brother against his will.

        It is the most marvellous unity of liberty and law which this earth can
    show. The beggar with his beads, the child with her pictures, the
    gentleman with his missal, the maiden meditating on each mystery of the
    Passion, or adoring her God in silent love too deep for words, and the
    grateful communicant, have but one intent, one meaning, and one heart,
    as they have one action, one object, before their mental vision. They bow
    themselves to the dust as sinners; they pray to be heard for Christ’s sake;
    they joyfully accept His words as the words of God;  they offer the bread
    and wine; they unite themselves with the celebrant in the Sacrifice of the
    Body and Blood of Christ, which he as their priest offers for them; they
    communicate spiritually; they give thanks for the ineffable gift which God
    has given them. Their words differ, their thoughts vary; but their hearts are
    united and their will is one. Therefore is their offering pure and acceptable
    in the sight of Him who knows their secret souls, and who accepts a man,
    not for the multitude or the fewness of his sayings, for his book or for his
    beads, but for the intention with which he has, according to his sphere and
    capacities, fulfilled His sacred will, through the merits of the Adorable Victim
    who is offered for him. (Ritual of the New Testament by Rev. T. G. Bridgett)




    Father William Doyle preaches his last homily in 1917 from a pulpit in the nave of the church.

    One may also suppose that Dialogue Mass was never considered an option
    until modern times as it would have been simply impractical. It is impossible
    for a priest at a distant altar to dialogue with a large congregation without
    the use of a microphone as otherwise he could not be heard and, in any
    case, in many churches the priest was separated from the congregation by
    the rood screen which divided the sanctuary from the nave. We are all
    familiar with the fact that in large churches the pulpit was placed in the
    nave quite far from the altar and raised up on high so that the sermon
    could be heard. Similarly, churches would have had to be completely
    reorganised in order for Mass to be heard, thus destroying all of the
    mystical symbolism of the cruciform plan. Interestingly enough, the new
    emphasis on vocal participation even before the Council, or any thought of
    a new Mass in the minds of most people, had already produced the
    beginnings of the new church architecture:

        Reconceiving liturgical space had begun; especially with St Michael’s in
    Burlington, Vermont in 1944. A more radical step was Blessed Sacrament
    Church in Holyoke, Massachusetts, built in 1953. Here the altar was dead
    centre in an octagonal church and surrounded by eight rows of pews. This
    soon turned out not to be the answer, but it did herald the movement to
    reconceiving the relationship of congregational space to the sanctuary. All
    was still in flux when events after Vatican II soon gave new directions to
    church building.’ (Roman Catholic Worship: Trent to Today by James White)


    These churches were built for the old Mass – not the new – but a Mass in
    which obviously active vocal participation was very strong in influencing the
    design!

    There is a very significant difference between singing and speaking in a
    language which one does not understand. The music itself is a profound
    expression of the soul and the meaning of the individual words which are
    sung is often secondary. It is sufficient to consider that a person ignorant
    of the Italian language might happily listen to an opera in that language
    but would certainly hesitate to listen to a play. Indeed, raising the mind
    and heart to God is the very essence and definition of prayer which need
    not be synonymous with an exercise of the vocal chords.

    A final reason why vocal participation was never encouraged, particularly
    after the Tridentine missal was promulgated, was the danger that such
    participation would demonstrate similarities to Protestant worship and the
    likely conclusion that intelligent spoken participation would produce a
    demand for vernacular liturgy. It was also this concern which motivated the
    prohibition against translating the Missal mentioned below.

    Later history was to prove that these concerns were entirely justified.
    Finally, we come to the ultimate argument – that of authority – and indeed
    Mr Tofari devotes almost the entire second part of his article to the 1958
    Instruction ‘On Sacred Music And Liturgy’ with its unambiguous assertion
    that ‘a final method of participation, and the most perfect form, is for the
    congregation to make the liturgical responses to the prayers of the priest,
    thus affording a sort of dialogue with him, and reciting aloud the parts
    which properly belong to them.’ Obviously, this is intended to be the fatal
    blow to all opposition!



    Pope Alexander VII

    It must be noted, however, that this ‘most perfect’ form of participation is
    at odds with the Church’s traditional practice. The contemporary ideal of
    placing the Roman missal in the hands of the faithful in such a way that
    united to the priest, they may pray with the same words and sentiment of
    the Church – whether the Mass be silent or dialogue – was impossible of
    achievement for the far greater part of the Church’s history as the vast
    majority of any congregation would have been unable to read, the printing
    press not yet invented, or books too expensive. It is really only towards
    the end of the nineteenth century that cheap books became available to
    the average person so it is perfectly clear that the liturgy was never
    designed with this type of participation in mind. In this connection Mr Tofari
    observes ‘this individualist Protestant spirit began to gradually seep in
    amongst the Catholic clergy and laity alike. It contributed to Catholics
    following private devotions during their attendance at Mass, rather than
    communally uniting themselves to the liturgical actions. Meanwhile, the age
    of the printing press was on hand to deliver a prolific number of “Mass
    prayer books” whose contents were usually devotions far removed from
    the sacrificial action taking place at the altar.’ Of course, the true reason for
    this state of affairs has nothing whatsoever to do with Protestantism but
    the simple fact that it was forbidden by the Church authorities to translate
    the missal, e.g., 1661 Pope Alexander VII condemned a missal translated
    into French and forbade any further translations under pain of
    excommunication. This prohibition was renewed by Pius IX as late as 1857
    and only in 1897 was it no longer enforced.

    Dismissing all objections against the Dialogue Mass, Mr Tofari generously
    asserts that nevertheless, ‘…some Catholics still remain adamant in
    following their own desires rather than the Church’s will. However, it must
    be assumed that they act in good, but ill-informed faith.’ On the contrary,
    however, we are rather too well informed! By 1958, Annibale Bugnini
    (whose name is synonymous with the New Mass and [was] the key figure
    in the pre- and post-Conciliar changes) had been secretary of the
    Commission for Liturgical Reform for already ten years and much progress
    had already been achieved, including limited use of the vernacular in
    certain rites. Pius XII died only a few weeks later and things were set in
    motion for the Council. As the Dialogue Mass was the spearhead of the
    Liturgical Movement’s desire for active lay participation, it is not surprising
    that it should be praised as the ‘most perfect form’ of assistance in this
    docuмent. Nevertheless, this same Instruction of 1958 does not make this
    method of participation in any sense obligatory but rather recognises that
    ‘…all are not equally capable of correctly understanding the rites and
    liturgical formulas; nor does everyone possess the same spiritual needs;
    nor do the needs remain constant in the same individual. Therefore, these
    people may find a more suitable or easier method of participation in the
    Mass when they meditate devotedly on the mysteries of Jesus Christ, or
    perform other devotional exercises and offer prayers which, although
    different in form from those of the sacred rites, are in essential harmony
    with them.’

    It is therefore obvious that to insist that this one manner of assisting at
    Mass is more in conformity with ‘the mind of the Church’ is something of an
    exaggeration.


    Pope St Pius X

    It is necessary to be clear in one’s mind that the Dialogue Mass is a novelty
     in the history of the Church. Even those who approve of it and feel that it
    is an improvement on what went before must, in all honesty, admit this for
    it does nothing for their case to pretend otherwise. It was quite unknown
    before the twentieth century. St Pius X did not envisage Dialogue Mass but
    rather congregational singing when he advocated ‘active participation’ for,
    although the Dialogue Mass simply did not exist in his day, he could easily
    have introduced it. This is proved by his radical reform of the Roman
    Breviary which clearly demonstrates that he did not hesitate to implement
    liturgical change which he considered necessary. His successor Benedict XV
    is credited with having done so and of having personally celebrated
    Dialogue Mass once in his priesthood which lasted 44 years. It seems that
    Pius XI celebrated it twice. This does not indicate that they considered it a
    high priority but it was enthusiastically adopted in latter years by bishops
    and clergy who were very progressive at the time, especially in France and
    Germany.

    Also it is not, and has never been, obligatory although, inevitably,
    wherever it was introduced there would always be found someone who
    would exercise their ‘right’ (!) to make the responses so that over a period
    of time in the countries mentioned above where it was encouraged and
    introduced early on, it eventually became the exclusive practice. The result
    is that in these places the ‘silent’ Mass on public occasions has passed out
    of living memory and consequently the average Traditional Catholic there
    who understandably has little knowledge of liturgical history believes that
    it has been practiced in every era since the early Church. Paradoxically, or
    providentially, it was not adopted in English-speaking lands as their
    bishops in the 1940s and 50s were generally very conservative and
    therefore not particularly interested in the Liturgical Movement and its
    ideas. The fact that the former countries are ‘Catholic’ while the latter are
    ‘Protestant’ has given rise to the misconception that reluctance to embrace
    the Dialogue Mass is the result of unconscious Protestant influences but
    nothing is further from the truth.

    The Dialogue Mass, being less than 90 years old in comparison with the
    2000 year old history of Church’s worship, must be seen in the context of
    the unprecedented and constant changes in the liturgy which took place in
    the twentieth century. Most of these were of very short duration. A striking
    case is that of the Breviary. Even before the Council, the Roman Breviary –
    the most important book after the Mass – suffered very important and
    short-lived changes. In 1911 Pius X drastically altered the immemorial
    breviary codified by Pius V in 1567. Only 34 years later Pius XII introduced
    a completely new Latin Psalter to replace the one which had been in
    constant use since the earliest days of the Church. Although in theory
    optional, breviaries were no longer printed with the old Psalter. This was
    reversed by John XXIII who made further alterations in 1960 and restored
    the old Psalter. Almost everyone then abandoned that of Pius XII. This is
    only one example of the numerous liturgical changes which took place
    without ceasing throughout the period from the reign of Pius X to that of
    John XXIII before the traditional liturgy was finally abandoned. Nothing like
    it had ever been known in the entire history of the Church. It is therefore
    obvious that liturgical directives do not remain binding for all time! If this is
    true of Papal Bulls it is all the more so in the case of an instruction on
    Sacred Music which seems to form the ultimate basis of Mr Tofari’s
    argument from authority.

    Most of these changes, unprecedented and far-reaching as they were,
    passed unnoticed by the average layman. However, papal-approved
    liturgical change was the daily bread of the priests for half a century before
    the Council (being equal in length to the entire priestly life of many of
    them) and had become all too familiar. This surely explains why the
    post-Conciliar reforms met with little clerical resistance but indeed were
    largely received with enthusiasm or equanimity much to the bewilderment
    of the Faithful. The survival of the traditional liturgy was due largely to the
    efforts of laymen to whom the New Mass and the notion of radical change
    to the sacred liturgy was a tremendous shock. They had the very greatest
    difficulty in finding priests prepared or interested in celebrating the
    Traditional Mass for them since the direction in which things were moving
    had been clear for years:

        In 1956 Gerald Ellard published The Mass in Transition. He began by
    acknowledging that his 1948 book The Mass of the Future was already out
    of date, so rapidly had liturgical practice progressed. People were
    beginning to grasp the difference between praying at Mass and praying
    the Mass itself. Various practices were becoming common. Vernacular
    missals were now in the hands of millions of lay people. In a few places the
    altars had already been prised loose from walls and priests were
    celebrating facing the people albeit it with a tabernacle in the way. The so
    called Dialogue Mass was well on the way to being no longer a rarity in the
    United States and was prevalent in Germany. (Roman Catholic Worship:
    Trent to Today by James White)

    Towards the end of his lengthy article, after having wistfully considered the
    possibility of an authentic liturgical reform if the pre-Conciliar popes had
    been heeded and the ‘intransigency of the pietists’ had not been a
    contributing factor to frustrating this, Mr Tofari states:


        Many may not prefer the Dialogue Mass and that is their prerogative.
    Nonetheless, one must avoid equating the legitimate practice of the
    Dialogue Mass with the illegitimate child which is the Novus Ordo Missae.
    The illogical post hoc ergo propter hoc must stop in the assertion that the
    Dialogue Mass was ‘the beginning of the end’ for the liturgical revolution
    imposed in the wake of the Second Vatican Council.


    Low Mass

    Then finally, with amazing self confidence, he asserts that ‘both claims are
    faulty, having liturgical misconceptions or improper context as their basis’.
    However, it is perhaps rather Mr Tofari’s claims that are based on liturgical
    misconceptions and improper context and dispel his assertion that the
    ‘silent’ Mass is in any way influenced by pietism. If the faithful were ‘mute
    spectators’ before the twentieth century, it was the result of deliberate
    policy by the Popes and the highest authorities of the Church for 1000
    years and not the result of any ill-will or preference of their own. The mildly
    derogatory expression of ‘mute spectators’ in a pontifical docuмent was
    surely the indication of a radical change of policy and was understood as
    such. This is surely why it is not possible to find pontifical docuмents in
    praise of the ‘silent’ Mass for it was simply a fact of life in the Church and
    required no praise or justification unlike the new form of participation which
    required to be promoted.

    Furthermore, these changes were all promoted by the very same people
    who established the New Mass and the new liturgy, [and] so when Mr
    Tofari poses the question, ‘What kind of liturgical reform would have
    occurred in the wake of the Second Vatican Council if the pre-Conciliar
    popes had been heeded?’, it is not too difficult to find an answer. What
    indeed does Mr Tofari imagine himself? For after Dialogue Mass there is
    nothing left to reform except the rite itself and/or render it in the
    vernacular. This was, in fact, the direction of liturgical scholarship before
    the Council. The most authoritative work on the Mass produced during
    these years is Joseph Jungmann’s epic work ‘Missarum Solemnia’,
    published in 1949 with several later additions. Much of Mr Tofari’s article
    seems to be based on this book with which he appears to be familiar.

    Here is what Jungmann has to say about the Tridentine form of Mass:

        After fifteen hundred years of unbroken development in the rite of the
    Roman Mass, after the rushing and the streaming from every height and
    out of every valley, the Missal of Pius V was indeed a powerful dam holding
    back the waters or permitting them to flow through only in firm, well-built
    canals. At one blow all arbitrary meandering to one side or another was
    cut off, all floods prevented, and a safe, regular and useful flow assured.
    But the price paid was this, that the beautiful river valley now lay barren
    and the forces of further evolution were often channelled into the narrow
    bed of a very inadequate devotional life instead of gathering strength for
    new forms of liturgical expression… In fact someone has styled this period
    of Church history as the epoch of inactivity or of rubrics.

    With regard to the vernacular he is much more cautious (after all this is written in 1949!):

        The monumental greatness of the Roman Mass lies in its antiquity which
    reaches back to the Church of the martyrs, and in its spread which, with its
    Latin language, spans so many nations. Nowhere else is it so plain that
    the Church is both apostolic and catholic. But this double advantage of the
    Roman Mass also involves weaknesses. The Latin tongue is nowadays
    become more and more unfamiliar even to cultured people. Will there ever
    be any relaxing in this matter in the setting of the Mass? …

        The Latin language is only one of the peculiarities of the Roman liturgy
    that, due to its venerable age, has to some extent become a problem… In
    the present shape of the Roman Mass, forms and practices have been
    retained which are no longer comprehensible to the ordinary onlooker.

    As the New Mass provides for nothing other than active lay participation, it
    is surely not unreasonable to believe that the Dialogue Mass was a
    significant step towards the introduction of the new liturgy. Although the
    adage post hoc ergo propter hoc is certainly a logical fallacy if applied in
    every circuмstance, it does not alter the fact that effect most surely follows
    cause and we can now see with hindsight where all these changes were
    leading. It is now no longer possible to maintain with objectivity that
    liturgical changes such as the Dialogue Mass were completely unrelated to
    what was to follow.

    We conclude this article at the point where we began. The Dialogue Mass
    is nothing more than a liturgical praxis. Although it may not be Modernist, it
    is undoubtedly modern and imbued with the spirit of the age which
    produced it as Joseph Jungmann in Missarum Solmenia frankly admits,

        … from the Dialogue Mass the Faithful gain a living knowledge of the
    actual course of the Mass and so they can follow the Low Mass as well as
    the Solemn Mass with an entirely new understanding. To have been
    deprived of such an understanding much longer would not have been
    tolerable even to the masses in this age of advanced education and
    enhanced self consciousness. But what is even more important, now that
    the Faithful answer the priest and concur in his prayers, sacrifice with him
    and communicate with him, they become properly conscious for the first
    time of their dignity as Christians. (!)

    Even if it is readily conceded that Dialogue Mass is neither Modernist nor
    heretical, this is not to say that it is desirable. Many practices of the Church
    in previous centuries were abandoned for good reasons and it is most
    unwise to revive them now. Even if there was a liturgy in the early Church
    which approximated to the Dialogue Mass it is well known that there was
    also Mass in the vernacular, Communion under two kinds and in the hand,
    Mass sometimes celebrated facing the people and a married priesthood
    (even the first Pope was married!). None of these practices are in
    themselves against the Faith and were quite legitimate but recent history
    has proved what dire consequences have ensued when many of them
    were revived after the Second Vatican Council.



    Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre

    Neither is it in any sense desirable to introduce Dialogue Mass in places
    where it has never been the established practice before the Council. The
    faith of most Catholics was nurtured by the liturgical forms of their youth
    and there is no excuse to disturb this now and renew the bitter
    experiences of the pre- and post-Conciliar years. This was the praxis
    adopted by Archbishop Lefebvre in the Society of St Pius X during the years
    when this Society was effectively the sole guardian of the traditional rites
    and this is surely the most wise and considerate position to continue to
    adopt at the present time. One day the Liturgical Movement with its
    twentieth century ideas and assumptions will be judged in the light of
    history. To some extent this has already begun. Until then, may all
    reforming zeal according to its questionable principles, such as is
    expressed by Mr. Tofari’s article, cease! As St. Paul says, ‘all things are
    lawful to me; but all things are not expedient’ (I Cor.VI.12).

    Let us, therefore, treasure the traditional form of ‘silent’ Low Mass as one
    of our greatest treasures. This is the form of Mass developed at a high
    point of Catholic culture and devotion in an era which we love to call the
    ‘Age of Faith’. This is the form of Mass which nurtured the spiritual life of the
    saints who were the greatest of the true reformers of the Church, Sts.
    Francis, Dominic, Bernard, Ignatius, Catherine of Sienna, Teresa of Avila,
    etc. None of them were dissatisfied with the ‘silent’ Mass, as known by
    them and us, but rather they loved it and there is no evidence that they
    felt that they suffered any deprivation from their lack of ‘active
    participation’ in the worship of Christ’s Mystical Body. Let us also love and
    be thankful for this grace and ‘be zealous for the better gifts’ (I Cor. XII.31).

    Offline magdalena

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    District Letter of Fr. Edward Black
    « Reply #10 on: January 02, 2013, 05:55:08 PM »
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  • I do remember Fr. Black's excellent article on the dialogue Mass.  Didn't he have something to say with regards to the changes in Holy Week under Pope Pius XII as well?  I thought I read it here on CathInfo.  If that's true, does anyone remember where?  Thank you.  
    But one thing is necessary. Mary hath chosen the best part, which shall not be taken away from her.
    Luke 10:42


    Offline bowler

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    « Reply #11 on: January 02, 2013, 06:41:26 PM »
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  • Quote from: magdalena
    I do remember Fr. Black's excellent article on the dialogue Mass.  Didn't he have something to say with regards to the changes in Holy Week under Pope Pius XII as well?  I thought I read it here on CathInfo.  If that's true, does anyone remember where?  Thank you.  


    The comments about Pius XII about the Holy Week changes are from Fr. Patrick Perez in the thread Dialogue Mass, Part of the SSPX Agenda :

    Quote from: bowler

    (excerpted from :http://www.traditioninaction.org/Questions/F027_DialogueMass.html)

    Dialogue Mass and Mass in Vernacular,
    Part of the SSPX Agenda

    Dear Fr. Patrick Perez,

    I read your recent article The Missal Crisis of '62 on the TIA website with your concerns about the motu proprios of recent years and I am curious for you to comment on a couple things.

    I attend an SSPX chapel in northern NY and the “dialogue Mass” is said there. One of the former pastors wanted to “kill it” from the chapel, and to my and my wife’s minds always reminded us of the Novus Ordo. I told Father at the time of our conversation that I would back him up in the chapel if he tried to kill it, but it never happened and I don’t know why.

    Also, lately our present pastor has introduced and/or allowed the “new” practice of having the congregation say aloud the triple Domine non sum dignus… before Communion, which I had not heard done in any Traditional chapel before now… also, reminding one of the Novus Ordo.

    Comments, directions?...........


    Fr. Perez responds:

    Dear Mr. B.L.,

    .....I am greatly disturbed and saddened that the Society is pushing ahead with its plan to make the "dialogue Mass" the norm in all its chapels. It is a precursor of the Novus Ordo, but remember who controls the Society: the French, and, to some extent, the Germans, and they have a virtual obsession with both the dialogue Mass and this notion of "full and active participation."

    You would not believe what the typical SSPX Mass in Europe looks like! In some places, such as Germany, I have seen Society Masses done mostly in the vernacular, with the laity answering everything. Quite the mess.

    By the way, if you question the dialogue Mass or this audience participation thing, they will usually give you a reprint of an Angelus article written some years ago which quotes three papal docuмents, although I use the word "quotes" loosely here. When you read these citations you are, indeed, left with the impression that Pope St. Pius X, and Pope Pius XII were in favor of such things, until you look up the docuмents quoted for yourself, and find that the author of the Angelus article, an SSPX priest and a Frenchman (Fr. de la Place), has conveniently grossly mistranslated or misquoted the original docuмents, and those Popes do not say or imply anything like what the article says they do. In my opinion this was quite unscholarly, if not downright deceptive.

    I hope that I have sufficiently addressed your questions. If not, feel free to contact me again.

         In Cordibus Iesu et Mariae,

         Fr. Patrick J. Perez


    If you go to the link on The 1962 Missal Crisis within the above article, you will find everything on Pius XII that I think you are refering to. Here's the direct link to the 1962 articlenull

    Offline bowler

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    « Reply #12 on: January 02, 2013, 06:48:40 PM »
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  • Offline magdalena

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    « Reply #13 on: January 02, 2013, 09:04:03 PM »
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  • Thank you, bowler.  And here is the link from CathInfo:

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php?a=topic&t=21603&min=70&num=5

    It was posted by ultrarigorist.  
    But one thing is necessary. Mary hath chosen the best part, which shall not be taken away from her.
    Luke 10:42

    Offline magdalena

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    « Reply #14 on: January 02, 2013, 09:33:48 PM »
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  • My apologies.  Credit also goes to Ferdinand, Neil Obstat and Kephapaulos on the same thread.  Hopefully, I didn't miss someone else.  
    But one thing is necessary. Mary hath chosen the best part, which shall not be taken away from her.
    Luke 10:42