Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Complete letter between Bishop Fellay and Pope Benedict in Cor Unum leaked  (Read 4135 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline vidi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Reputation: +30/-0
  • Gender: Male
It is only in french right now, anyone care to translate?

Lettre de Mgr Fellay au Pape Benoît XVI, 17 juin 2012

Fraternité Sacerdotale

        Saint-Pie X

A sa Sainteté le Pape Benoît XVI

                Très Saint-Père,

                Vous me voyez confus, au moment où de rudes épreuves vous touchent et au sujet desquelles je vous assure de mes pauvres prières, de vous présenter un problème supplémentaire plutôt que des consolations.

                En effet, mercredi soir 13 juin, le cardinal Levada m’a remis au cours d’une rencontre qui fut cordiale, une déclaration doctrinale que je ne pourrai pas signer. Ne tenant pas compte de la supplique de ne pas retoucher la proposition que j’avais remise, à cause des conséquences que cela entraînerait, le nouveau texte reprend à peu prés tous les points du Préambule de septembre 2011 qui faisait difficulté et que je m’étais efforcé d’écarter.

                Malheureusement dans le contexte actuel de la Fraternité, la nouvelle déclaration ne passera pas.

                J’avoue ne plus savoir quoi penser. J’avais cru comprendre que vous étiez disposé à remettre à plus tard la résolution des différends encore en cours sur certains points du Concile et de la réforme liturgique, un peu comme au Concile de Florence on avait passé sous silence la question du divorce pour cause d’adultère chez les Grecs pour arriver néanmoins à l’union, et je me suis engagé dans cette perspective malgré l’opposition assez forte dans les rangs de la Fraternité et au prix de troubles importants. Et j’ai bien l’intention de continuer à faire tous mes efforts pour poursuivre sur ce chemin afin d’arriver aux clarifications nécessaires.

                Maintenant il semble que je me sois trompé et qu’est vraiment demandée l’acceptation totale des points litigieux avant d’aller plus avant… Si quelques-uns de mes propos récents ajoutent un embarras nouveau, je le regrette, mais c’était aussi par souci de clarté.

                En plus, vu l’opposition massive qui se prépare dans certains milieux de l’Eglise qui entendent bien rendre impossible l’activité de la nouvelle prélature, vu la pression même de certains Etats, je me demande bien comment le projet pourrait être réalisé dans ces circonstances.

                Il me semble que vous seul pouvez encore changer le cours des événements qui se dessine. Il ne s’agit bien évidemment pas pour moi de faire une quelconque pression, mais simplement de vous exposer les faits et de savoir si je me trompe quant à vos intentions sur notre situation. Si vous le jugiez opportun, en ce moment bien délicat, j’ose demander de votre bonté une audience (la plus discrète possible) afin d’entendre de votre bouche votre appréciation à notre sujet.

                Daigne Votre Sainteté croire à mon dévouement filial et à mon désir le plus cher de servir la sainte Eglise.

Menzingen, le dimanche 17 juin 2012

+Bernard Fellay


Offline vidi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Reputation: +30/-0
  • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Lettre du Pape Benoît XVI à Mgr Fellay, 30 juin 2012


    A Monseigneur Bernard Fellay

    Supérieur général de la Fraternité Sacerdotale Saint-Pie X

                    Dans la lettre du 17 juin 2012 vous m’avez fait part que vous ne pourrez pas signer la Déclaration doctrinale qui vous a été remise par son Eminence le cardinal Levada lors de votre rencontre du 13 juin 2012. Permettez-moi de vous faire part à mon tour de la déception qu’a suscité en moi une telle nouvelle. Par ailleurs, un docuмent interne de la Fraternité Sacerdotale Saint-Pie X, diffusé dans les médias le 26 juin 2012, laisse entendre que j’aurais été satisfait de la Déclaration doctrinale proposée par la Fraternité en avril dernier, mais que les modifications apportées à ce texte l’auraient rendu « clairement inacceptable » pour vous.

         La Déclaration doctrinale en question, préparée par la Congrégation pour la Doctrine de la Foi ainsi que par la Commission Pontificale Ecclesia Dei, et approuvée explicitement par moi avant de vous être remise, intègre les éléments jugés  indispensables  pour être à même de prononcer la Profession de foi et le Serment de fidélité pour assumer une charge exercée au nom de l’Eglise, garants de la pleine communion ecclésiale. Ces éléments sont essentiellement l’acceptation:

          du Magistère comme interprète authentique de la Tradition apostolique

        du concile Vatican II comme partie intégrante de ladite Tradition, restant sauve la possibilité d’une discussion légitime sur la formulation des points particuliers des docuмents conciliaires;

          de la validité et de la licéité du Novus Ordo Missae.

                    Au moment où s’ouvre le Chapitre général de votre Fraternité, je ne puis qu’encourager cette assemblée à accepter ces points comme étant nécessaire pour une réconciliation au sein de la communion de l’Eglise une, sainte, catholique et apostolique.

                    En élevant des prières à Dieu dans ce sens, je vous prie d’agréer,  Monseigneur, l’assurance de mes sentiments respectueux et dévoués.

    Du Vatican, le 30 juin 2012

    Benoît XVI


    Offline tmw89

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 126
    • Reputation: +103/-0
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • The two letters auto-translated by Google:





    Bishop Fellay letter to Pope Benedict XVI, June 17, 2012

    Priestly Fraternity

    St. Pius X

    To His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI

    Holy Father,

    You see me confused at the time of hardships affect you and on which I assure you of my poor prayers, you have an additional problem rather than consolation.

    Indeed, on Wednesday June 13, Cardinal Levada gave me during a meeting was cordial, a doctrinal statement that I can not sign. Ignoring the plea not to touch the proposal I surrender, because of the consequences that would result, the new text takes just near all points of the Preamble of September 2011 which was difficult and I 'm had tried to dismiss.

    Unfortunately, in the current context of the Brotherhood, the new statement will not pass.

    I admit not knowing what to think. I understand that you were willing to postpone the resolution of disputes still pending on some points of the Council and of the liturgical reform, just as the Council of Florence had ignored the issue of divorce because adultery among the Greeks to get nevertheless the union, and I am committed to this perspective, despite the relatively strong opposition in the ranks of the Brotherhood and the price of major disorders. And I intend to continue to make every effort to continue on this path to reach the necessary clarifications.

    Now it seems that I am mistaken and that is really required full acceptance of the issues before moving forward ... If some of my recent comments add a new embarrassment, I regret it, but it was also for clarity.

    In addition, given the massive opposition that is prepared in some quarters of the Church along well make it impossible to work the new prelature, saw the same pressure from some states, I wonder how the project could be done in these circuмstances.

    It seems to me that only you can still change the course of events that emerges. It is obviously not for me to make any pressure, but simply to expose you to know the facts and if I'm wrong about your intentions on our situation. If you jugiez appropriate in this very delicate moment, I would ask for your kindness hearing (as discreet as possible) to hear your appreciation of your mouth about us.

    Your Holiness deign to believe my filial devotion and my dearest wish to serve the Holy Church.

    Menzingen, Sunday, June 17, 2012

    + Bernard Fellay




    ***





    Letter of Pope Benedict XVI to Bishop Fellay, June 30, 2012


    A Monsignor Bernard Fellay

    Superior General of the Priestly Fraternity of St. Pius X

    In the letter of 17 June 2012 you have told me that you can not sign the doctrinal statement that was delivered by His Eminence Cardinal Levada at your meeting of 13 June 2012. Allow me to share with you my turn to disappointment here that aroused in me such news. In addition, an internal docuмent of the Priestly Society of Saint Pius X, released in the media June 26, 2012, suggests that I would have been satisfied with the doctrinal statement proposed by the Society in April, but the changes this text would have made "clearly unacceptable" for you.

    The doctrinal statement in question, prepared by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith and the Pontifical Commission Ecclesia Dei, and explicitly approved by me before you be called, includes the elements considered essential to be able to pronounce the profession of Faith and Oath of Fidelity to take a load exerted on behalf of the Church, which guarantee full ecclesial communion. These elements are essentially acceptance:

    the Magisterium as authentic interpreter of the Apostolic Tradition

    Vatican II as part of that tradition, without prejudice to the possibility of a legitimate discussion on the formulation of specific points of the conciliar docuмents;

    the validity and legality of the Novus Ordo Missae.

    Opens when the General Chapter of your fraternity, I can only encourage the assembly to accept these points as necessary for reconciliation within the communion of the one, holy, catholic and apostolic.

    Raising prayers to God in this way, please accept, Excellency, the assurance of my respectful and devoted sentiments.

    From the Vatican, 30 June 2012

    Benedict XVI




    ***





    Hopefully either a French translator or native-speaker will come along and provide us with something far less clunky!
    "The 'promise to respect' as Church law the New Code of Canon Law is to respect a number of supposed laws directly contrary to Church doctrine." --Bishop Williamson

    Offline MaterDominici

    • Mod
    • *****
    • Posts: 5438
    • Reputation: +4152/-96
    • Gender: Female
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • English translation by a human of letter from Bp Fellay to Pope Benedict.

    It is with consternation that I present to you, who are now beset with difficult trials during which you have my poor prayers, yet another problem, instead of consolation.

    Indeed on Wednesday evening, June 13, Cardinal Levada delivered to me, during a cordial meeting, a doctrinal declaration that I will not be able to sign.

    Disregarding my request not to revise the proposal that l had sent, because of the consequences that would entail, the new text repeats almost all the points of the Preamble of September 2011 that caused difficulties and that l had endeavoured to avoid.

    Unfortunately, in the present situation of the Society, the new declaration will not be accepted.

    I admit that I no longer know what to think. I had believed that you were disposed to postpone until later the resolution of the disputes that still remain over certain points of the Council and of the liturgical reform, much as the Council of Florence had passed over in silence the question concerning divorce on account of adultery among the Greeks, so as to effect a union. With such a view in mind I committed myself, despite rather strong opposition within the ranks of the Society, and at the expense of significant troubles. And I do intend to continue to make every effort to pursue this path in order to arrive at the necessary clarifications.

    But now it seems to me that I was mistaken and that complete acceptance of the disputed points is in truth required before going further... If some of my recent statements add a new difficulty, I am sorry, but that too was out of concern for clarity.

    Moreover, given the massive opposition brewing in some circles of the Church, which fully intend to make the activity of the new prelature impossible, and given the pressure even of certain States, I do wonder how the plan could be carried out in these circuмstances.

    It seems to me that you alone can now change the course of events taking shape. It is obviously not a question of my exerting any pressure whatsoever, but simply of presenting the facts to you in order to know whether I am mistaken as to your intentions concerning our situation. Were you to deem it opportune, at this very delicate time, I make so bold as to ask you in your kindness to grant an audience (as discreet as possible) so that I may hear from your own lips your sentiments concerning our situation.

    May Your Holiness deign to believe in my filial devotion and dearest desire to serve Holy Church.
    "I think that Catholicism, that's as sane as people can get."  - Jordan Peterson

    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 8901
    • Reputation: +8675/-849
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Bishop Fellay's letter positions himself to almost be a sympathetic character.

    But, did anyone feel sorry for Judas when he tried to back-out of his deal with the high priests, after realizing they had duped him?

    As with the secret Pharisee meetings, Bp. Fellay's doctrinal talks breached the prudence in newChurch dealings set down by +ABL.

    He also breached the norms of SSPX governance, by ignoring the earnest advise of his fellow bishops.

    He risked endangering the Faith and the peace of the Society for nothing.
    This is the hallmark of failed leadership.
    In good conscience, we can't trust his judgment in the future



    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi


    Offline SeanJohnson

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15064
    • Reputation: +9980/-3161
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • "Unfortunately, in the present situation of the Society, the new declaration will not be accepted.

    I admit that I no longer know what to think. I had believed that you were disposed to postpone until later the resolution of the disputes that still remain over certain points of the Council and of the liturgical reform, much as the Council of Florence had passed over in silence the question concerning divorce on account of adultery among the Greeks, so as to effect a union. With such a view in mind I committed myself, despite rather strong opposition within the ranks of the Society, and at the expense of significant troubles. And I do intend to continue to make every effort to pursue this path in order to arrive at the necessary clarifications."



    Commentary:



    1) He regrets the deal will not go through because of resistance within the SSPX ("Unfortunately...")



    2) He admits to having desired reaching a practical accord before the doctrinal issues were resolved.



    3) He admits that, because he thought the Pope would do this, Bishop Fellay had likewise committed himself to the practical accord, despite the strong opposition from within the SSPX, and significant trouble for doing so.



    4) He admits his intent to remain committed to this path.


    Question:

    Can anyone offer an alternative reading of this passage in which Bishop Fellay was merely stating his commitment to understanding the mind of the Pope in these matters, rather than commitment to a practical accord (as one person has suggested to me)?
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline hollingsworth

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2786
    • Reputation: +2888/-512
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote
    SJ: Commentary:



    1) He regrets the deal will not go through because of resistance within the SSPX ("Unfortunately...")



    2) He admits to having desired reaching a practical accord before the doctrinal issues were resolved.



    3) He admits that, because he thought the Pope would do this, Bishop Fellay had likewise committed himself to the practical accord, despite the strong opposition from within the SSPX, and significant trouble for doing so.



    4) He admits his intent to remain committed to this path.


    Question:

    Can anyone offer an alternative reading of this passage in which Bishop Fellay was merely stating his commitment to understanding the mind of the Pope in these matters, rather than commitment to a practical accord (as one person has suggested to me)?
     
    .........................


    I cant.  I think you've about covered it.
     

    Offline bowler

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3299
    • Reputation: +15/-1
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote
    In addition, given the massive opposition that is prepared in some quarters of the Church along well make it impossible to work the new prelature, saw the same pressure from some states, I wonder how the project could be done in these circuмstances.


    This is another opposition, the opposition of the "radical" progressivists clergy, and others.

    What does he mean by "states"?


    Offline SeanJohnson

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15064
    • Reputation: +9980/-3161
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Another Translation From "Shamus" at IA:


    "This is my translation of Bp Fellay's 17th June 2012 letter to Benedict XVI. It was published in March 2013 in Cor Unum (no. 108) and appeared in French in La Sapinière . Emphasis are mine. In anticipation of objections that my translation is probably erroneous, I invite sceptics to ask their local SSPX priest to compare it to the official translation in the English edition of their corresponding Cor Unum.

    QUOTE  

    To His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI


    Most Holy Father,

    I am ever so sorry, at a time you are afflicted with such trying difficulties for which I assure you of  my poor prayers, to present you with yet another problem rather than some consolation.

    Indeed, Wednesday evening, 13th June, during a cordial meeting, Cardinal Levada presented me with a doctrinal declaration which I could not sign. Not heeding the request not to modify the proposition I had submitted, because of the consequences that would lead to, the new text resumes almost all the points that caused difficulty in the September 2011 Preamble and which I had endeavored to set aside.

    Unfortunately, in the current context of the Society, the new declaration will not be accepted.

    I must admit to no longer knowing what to think. I had believed that you were disposed to leave till a later date the resolution of outstanding disagreements over certain points of the Council and liturgical reform, rather like when the Council of Florence, in order to achieve union, overlooked the question of the Greeks allowing divorce following adultery, and I committed myself in this perspective despite the fairly strong opposition in the ranks of the Society and at the price of substantial disruption. And I fully intend to continue to do my best to pursue this path to reach the necessary clarifications.

    It seems now that I was mistaken, and what is really asked of us is the total acceptation of the litigated points before proceeding further … I regret it if any of my recent statements have added fresh difficulty, but it was for the sake of clarity.

    Moreover, given the enormous opposition brewing up in certain circles of the Church determined to render impossible the activity of the new prelature, given the pressure even of certain countries, I wonder how in such circuмstances the project could come to fruition.

    I believe you alone can still change the course of events to come. Of course it is not for me to apply any kind of pressure, but simply set out the facts and find out if I mistook your intentions concerning our situation. If you judge it opportune, at this rather delicate moment, I dare ask of your goodness an audience (the most discreet possible) in order to hear from your own lips your appreciation of us.

    May Your Holiness deign to believe my filial devotion and my dearest wish to serve the holy Church.

    Menzingen, Sunday 17th June 2012

    + Bernard Fellay"
     
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Machabees

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 826
    • Reputation: +0/-0
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Incredulous
    Bishop Fellay's letter positions himself to almost be a sympathetic character.

    But, did anyone feel sorry for Judas when he tried to back-out of his deal with the high priests, after realizing they had duped him?

    As with the secret Pharisee meetings, Bp. Fellay's doctrinal talks breached the prudence in newChurch dealings set down by +ABL.

    He also breached the norms of SSPX governance, by ignoring the earnest advise of his fellow bishops.

    He risked endangering the Faith and the peace of the Society for nothing.
    This is the hallmark of failed leadership.
    In good conscience, we can't trust his judgment in the future


    To add, as Bishop Fellay's own Letter to the Pope proves that he admitted to breach the norms of SSPX governance of the mandate set forth at the 2006 General Chapter -no practical accord without a doctrinal accord first- without the consent of the SSPX General Council, that the obligation of the General Council (who are made up of the Bishops, District Superiors, Heads of Seminaries, Autonomous houses, and Elders), must condemn Bishop Fellay's actions with a Canonical sanction (like they did to Bishop Williamson).  If they do not, then they are also an accomplice to the crime; whereby encouraging the disobedience to rules, mandates, law, and order.  Yet, they want to slam with punishment and expulsion any Priest(s) within the same Priestly congregation who want to follow the rules, mandates, law, and order.

    The cup of sins run over and become manifest...

    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 8901
    • Reputation: +8675/-849
    • Gender: Male
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Machabees
    Quote from: Incredulous
    Bishop Fellay's letter positions himself to almost be a sympathetic character.

    But, did anyone feel sorry for Judas when he tried to back-out of his deal with the high priests, after realizing they had duped him?

    As with the secret Pharisee meetings, Bp. Fellay's doctrinal talks breached the prudence in newChurch dealings set down by +ABL.

    He also breached the norms of SSPX governance, by ignoring the earnest advise of his fellow bishops.

    He risked endangering the Faith and the peace of the Society for nothing.
    This is the hallmark of failed leadership.
    In good conscience, we can't trust his judgment in the future


    To add, as Bishop Fellay's own Letter to the Pope proves that he admitted to breach the norms of SSPX governance of the mandate set forth at the 2006 General Chapter -no practical accord without a doctrinal accord first- without the consent of the SSPX General Council, that the obligation of the General Council (who are made up of the Bishops, District Superiors, Heads of Seminaries, Autonomous houses, and Elders), must condemn Bishop Fellay's actions with a Canonical sanction (like they did to Bishop Williamson).  If they do not, then they are also an accomplice to the crime; whereby encouraging the disobedience to rules, mandates, law, and order.  Yet, they want to slam with punishment and expulsion any Priest(s) within the same Priestly congregation who want to follow the rules, mandates, law, and order.

    The cup of sins run over and become manifest...



    Well spoken Machabees!



    Father Themann needs to read and understand this.




    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi