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Author Topic: Clerical Association of St Gregory the Great  (Read 1986 times)

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Offline rlee

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Clerical Association of St Gregory the Great
« on: March 09, 2014, 03:25:37 PM »
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  • The Institute of Good Shepard, founded in 2006 by SSPX Priests who desired to "reconcile" with Rome has been rocked by Roman interference in their internal affairs, including overturning their elected SG who wanted to remain traditional and not be forced to celebrate the NO "Mass".

    Finally a group of these Priests has said "enough" and have formed a new traditional order, The Clerical Association of St Gregory the Great.

    This story is but another example of what Rome tries to do with any traditional group that places itself under them.

    Will the SSPX learn anything from this?

    http://eponymousflower.blogspot.se/2014/02/clerical-association-of-saint-gregory.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A%20TheEponymousFlower%20%28The%20Eponymous%20Flower%29


    Offline poche

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    Clerical Association of St Gregory the Great
    « Reply #1 on: March 10, 2014, 01:03:40 AM »
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  • Is this new groupin union with Rome?


    Offline Wessex

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    « Reply #2 on: March 10, 2014, 05:51:48 AM »
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  • A tendency to split off among SSPX and former SSPX priests must be because of a terrible lack of clarity inherent in the goals of wanting to be a priest on the fringes of the mainstream. Acts of dramatic Lefebvre-type defiance seem to fade into something messy where those original fluffy intentions often end up achieving the opposite. Does the practice of traditionalism in depth have the capacity to turn on itself or is it too strong a brew for modern humans with classical ideas. It was getting to be so obvious that traditional liturgiy, for example, could not in the long-term be served up in a doctrinal vacuum citing 'eternal Rome' or sacramental starvation as justification. Or could it develop into something that would 'stand alone' irrespective of a background of doctrinal revolution and subtlety? All these new bodies are finding that out now as they slip political and institutional shackles in pursuit of yet another experiment of tradition.  

       

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    « Reply #3 on: March 12, 2014, 08:58:39 AM »
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  • Quote from: rlee
    The Institute of Good Shepard, founded in 2006 by SSPX Priests who desired to "reconcile" with Rome has been rocked by Roman interference in their internal affairs, including overturning their elected SG who wanted to remain traditional and not be forced to celebrate the NO "Mass".

    Finally a group of these Priests has said "enough" and have formed a new traditional order, The Clerical Association of St Gregory the Great.

    This story is but another example of what Rome tries to do with any traditional group that places itself under them.

    Will the SSPX learn anything from this?

    http://eponymousflower.blogspot.se/2014/02/clerical-association-of-saint-gregory.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A%20TheEponymousFlower%20%28The%20Eponymous%20Flower%29


    Today, Ember Wednesday in Lent, 2014, is the Feast of St. Gregory the Great.

    From another thread:  


    .

    Post
    Quote from: holysoulsacademy

    +AMDG+

    EMBER WEDNESDAY IN LENT (2014 A.D.)

    Feast Of SAINT GREGORY THE GREAT


    Truth is not a question, neither is goodness or beauty.

    By the same token, Evil is not a question;  it is always apparent.
    Ugly is not a question;  it is always apparent.
     
    The Father of Lies would like us to think otherwise.

    Explaining Vatican II in light of Tradition is explaining evil and ugly in light of goodness and beauty.

    "N'er the twain shall meet" ~ and that's the TRUTH!



    .
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline holysoulsacademy

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    « Reply #4 on: March 12, 2014, 10:07:22 AM »
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  • I think the parochial spirit versus the missionary spirit is what killed/is killing the traditionalists.

    People thought the lines were drawn at the onset of Vatican II, yes they were, but, because traditionalists were primarily concerned in their personal salvation and "hooking themselves up" by making sure they and only they got the Sacraments, they lost momentum to gain ground.

    In the Indult, they have a greater sense of a missionary spirit albeit it died down after Ecclesia Dei, and more so after Summorum Pontificuм.  All these were meant to calm the tides, and appease the folks.  (As long as they accept Vat2).
    Which was easy to do because the love of the Mass could not be explained, only those who continuously seek will continuously find.

    Because traditionalists were more concerned with their own salvation and not having a missionary spirit and gathering more of the lost and scattered sheep and growing the Church by gathering more of those around back into the fold, the enemy was able to predict their future (ex. 10 families x 7 children average per family x 15 years, etc.).  Because they were not gathering they were focused on being internal, they became predictable to the enemy.  All  he had to do was wait, work slowly but surely, and once they got what they wanted they were willing to do anything to keep their chapels.

    This personal salvation theme is still a recurring thread.
    I noticed in all the SSPX chapels/missions I became exposed to.
    It was always very odd sounding when it was constantly drummed in to them that they need not bother with others that God would work with them, and that they should really worry about their own salvation - and citing out the famous passage of St. Paul.

    In one priory we found one day a whole stack (several thousand copies) of the pamphlet "50 Errors of Vatican II" translated in Spanish and Portuguese.
    They were donated by a parishioner who had purchased them and donated them to Fr. SSPXPrior for dissemination, as that priory was in a region that had Spanish and Portugese Catholics near them.
    We asked Fr. why they were just stacked in a corner and not being distributed, why parishioners were not being encouraged to take a few copies and give them to their neighbors, acquaintances, co-workers.
    He said that it wasn't necessary.  Saying something along the lines that it was pointless, that those who were interested in Tradition were already going to trad chapels. That everyone else out there was NO and was going to stay NO.
    Looking back the nagging voice inside me that disagreed with Fr. should not have acquiesced to Fr.'s statement.

    As my children quite aptly noticed yesterday when we were going over the Missal and it had the LESSON from Isa. 55:6-11 ~
    "In those days, the prophet Isaias spoke, saying:
    Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
    Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
    For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
    For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
    For as the rain cometh down and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, and giveth seed to the sower and bread to the eater; so shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it."

    They noted in our discussions that our Baptism - more than saving us from Hell - gave us the inheritance of Heaven
    And thus we were expected to - with His Word - "watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, and giveth seed to the sower and bread to the eater; so shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it."
    Instead we swallowed the Word, didn't share it with anyone - and still do not - and go about building a world all for ourselves.


    Offline Frances

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    « Reply #5 on: March 12, 2014, 11:47:05 AM »
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  •  :applause:to holysoulsacademy!
    The missionary aspect of tradition is generally weak; of the resistance, except for a very few, virtually nonexistent.  The Council hammered the final nails into the coffin that has become mainstream Catholicism.  Vat. II killed the missionary spirit.  Doesn't everyone know that,

     "Catholics don't proselytize?  That's for people who really believe their religion, Pentecostals, Baptists, Muslims, cultists like JWs or Mormons, 'the Moonies!' Religious nuts! Fanatics!"
     
    Why is it generally assumed that those who come to tradition from being Catholic-in-name-only, or from the novus ordo have become "real" Catholics, but those from no religion at all, or, worse, from Protestantism, are somehow "suspect," maybe not really Catholic?

    What would happen, I wonder, if traditional Catholics would begin proselytizing like Pentecostals?  If we acted as missionaries, as the Jesuits of old, starting right where we are currently located?  Why not hand out tracts to our neighbours and coworkers?  Or, at the very least, take the bushel off our candles?  (St. Mt. 5:16)  

    It will mean persecution in one form or another. Probably not torture and death, yet for us here in the spoilt West.  At present, it will probably take the form of being socially ostracised for homeschooling, having more than three kids, dressing modestly, not having a TV, depriving our children of the latest iPhone, forbidding evil music and media from entering our homes, being perceived as weird, and, horrors!  praying in public before and after meals, being seen with a Rosary, or scapular, or other sacramental...

    If, for every hundred or so dirty looks, snide remarks, mental dismissal as nut-cases, what if ONE soul is lead to merely question whether there might be something more to his life of materialistic pursuit?  What if one in one-thousand were to approach and ask, "Why are you so weird?"

    Then, what if it were explained to him that God made him, sent His Son Jesus Christ, born of the Virgin Mary to die for him, rise from the dead, that he, too, might be happy with Him in Heaven FOREVER!  All he need do to have this is to be cleansed from his sins, be Baptized into God's One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church.  What if it told him that God REQUIRES it of him?

    Had Catholics been missionaries during the two world wars of the 20th century, had Catholic conversion been made prerequisite to the rebuilding of Europe instead of building churches, schools and religious houses in the U.S. during the post-WWII years, the disastrous Vat. II would have never happened.

    But it did.  So it's back to the question I asked on the E.C. #347 thread.  The Church is in disarray, the Shepherd and shepherds struck, the sheep scattered.  That the shepherds of tradition are now struck and their sheep rapidly scattering, is, as Bishop Williamson said, " the most natural thing in the world."

    As scattered sheep, what are we going to do about it?  What would Our Lord have us to do about it?  What does it mean to keep the Faith under these circuмstances?  Shall we huddle with our lambs in a corner of the sheepfold and hope the wolf overlooks us when he saunters in?   Exit the fold and search for another enclosure?  Go on as if all is well?  Elect a new shepherd?  Wander away?  Lay down and die?  Flee with your family to the wilderness and hope to ride it out?

    Comments?  Suggestions?  
    In the meantime,  :dancing-banana:  will be prayerfully studying (11th CH. of Hebrews) and being a weirdo to my family, colleagues, and neighbors.
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  

    Offline Cantarella

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    « Reply #6 on: March 12, 2014, 11:56:15 AM »
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  • Quote from: Frances

    What would happen, I wonder, if traditional Catholics would begin proselytizing like Pentecostals?  If we acted as missionaries, as the Jesuits of old, starting right where we are currently located?  Why not hand out tracts to our neighbours and coworkers?  Or, at the very least, take the bushel off our candles?  (St. Mt. 5:16)  

    It will mean persecution in one form or another. Probably not torture and death, yet for us here in the spoilt West.  At present, it will probably take the form of being socially ostracised for homeschooling, having more than three kids, dressing modestly, not having a TV, depriving our children of the latest iPhone, forbidding evil music and media from entering our homes, being perceived as weird, and, horrors!  praying in public before and after meals, being seen with a Rosary, or scapular, or other sacramental...

    If, for every hundred or so dirty looks, snide remarks, mental dismissal as nut-cases, what if ONE soul is lead to merely question whether there might be something more to his life of materialistic pursuit?  What if one in one-thousand were to approach and ask, "Why are you so weird?"

    Then, what if it were explained to him that God made him, sent His Son Jesus Christ, born of the Virgin Mary to die for him, rise from the dead, that he, too, might be happy with Him in Heaven FOREVER!  All he need do to have this is to be cleansed from his sins, be Baptized into God's One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church.  What if it told him that God REQUIRES it of him?



    Even if one soul alone converts, would be worthy the whole effort.  

    The Parable of the Lost Sheep
    (Matthew 18:10-14)

    1.NOW the publicans and sinners drew near unto him to hear him. 2And the Pharisees and the scribes murmured, saying: This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them.

    3And he spoke to them this parable, saying: 4What man of you that hath an hundred sheep: and if he shall lose one of them, doth he not leave the ninety-nine in the desert, and go after that which was lost, until he find it? 5And when he hath found it, lay it upon his shoulders, rejoicing: 6And coming home, call together his friends and neighbours, saying to them: Rejoice with me, because I have found my sheep that was lost? 7I say to you, that even so there shall be joy in heaven upon one sinner that doth penance, more than upon ninety-nine just who need not penance.
    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.