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Author Topic: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI  (Read 913 times)

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Offline cosmas

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Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
« on: November 04, 2018, 09:48:28 AM »
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    • Judging the Novus Ordo Missae in itself and in its official Latin form (printed in 1969)*, Cardinals Ottaviani and Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI:

    ...the Novus Ordo represents, both as a whole and in its details, a striking departure from the Catholic theology of the Mass as it was formulated in Session XXIII of the Council of Trent." (A Brief Critical Study of the Novus Ordo Missae, September 25, 1969)

    So is it really a Catholic Mass, it departed from the Catholic understanding of the Mass  .
    It departed from a dogmatic understanding of the Mass.
    So what is it and are Catholic's really obligated to go to it?
    I'm just throwing some questions out there.
    The above was quoted from two Cardinals that were in charge of the protection of the doctrine of the faith.
    Does the original intention of creating it make it invalid ?
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    Online Stubborn

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    Re: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
    « Reply #1 on: November 04, 2018, 10:23:12 AM »
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    • When it comes to the NOM, The Great Sacrilege by Fr. James Wathen, OSJ is recommended reading.
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    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
    « Reply #2 on: November 04, 2018, 12:06:10 PM »
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    • It could be valid or invalid but that’s not really important.  Since the theology is new, that means it’s immoral. 
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    Offline cosmas

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    Re: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
    « Reply #3 on: November 04, 2018, 06:49:55 PM »
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    • Thankyou Stubborn, 
    I own 3 copies. Excellent work, I wish Fr. Walthen was still around.
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    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
    « Reply #4 on: November 04, 2018, 07:00:21 PM »
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    • I’ve heard good things about the book “How Christ said the First Mass”.   I started reading it but never finished it.  It’s a VERY detailed account of how the liturgy of the Mass is very similar to the Jєωιѕн rite and it destroys the Modernist lie that the early Church’s liturgies were simple and unassuming (which lie they used to argue for the novus ordo and the gutting of the beautiful Latin rite).  It was written in the 20s so I found a PDF copy somewhere for free.  
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    Offline cosmas

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    Re: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
    « Reply #5 on: November 11, 2018, 11:42:48 PM »
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    • Archbishop Lefebvre
    “And we have the precise conviction that this new rite of Mass expresses a new faith, a faith which is not ours, a faith which is not the Catholic Faith. This New Mass is a symbol, is an expression, is an image of a new faith, of a Modernist faith. ….Now it is evident that the new rite, if I may say so, supposes another conception of the Catholic religion-another religion.”


    If its another religion how can it be a legitimate Mass, a Catholic Mass ?
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    Offline cosmas

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    Re: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
    « Reply #6 on: November 11, 2018, 11:47:10 PM »
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    • Archbishop Lefebvre
    That Conciliar Church is a schismatic Church, because it breaks with the Catholic Church that has always been. It has its new dogmas, its new priesthood, its new institutions, its new worship, all already condemned by the Church in many a docuмent, official and definitive.... The Church that affirms such errors is at once schismatic and heretical. This Conciliar Church is, therefore, not Catholic. To whatever extent Pope, Bishops, priests, or faithful adhere to this new Church, they separate themselves from the Catholic Church...

    Why does SSPX want to rejoin a schismatic Church ?
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    Offline cosmas

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    Re: Cardinal Ottavani and Cardinal Bacci wrote to Pope Paul VI
    « Reply #7 on: November 11, 2018, 11:54:56 PM »
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    • Archbishop Lefebvre
    “Well, we are not of this religion. We do not accept this new religion. We are of the religion of all time; we are of the Catholic religion. We are not of this 'universal religion' as they call it today-this is not the Catholic religion any more. We are not of this Liberal, Modernist religion which has its own worship, its own priests, its own faith, its own catechisms, its own Bible, the 'ecuмenical Bible'-these things we do not accept."


    OPEN YOUR EYES SSPX !!
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