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Author Topic: Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise  (Read 11602 times)

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Offline Pax Vobis

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Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2016, 03:19:09 PM »
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    • Quote
    This issue is A LOT more complicated and dense than just an order "joining" the "resistance," whatever that means. From what my family in France told me this order has had issues with all 3 of the remaining SSPX bishops.


    RogerThat, could you elaborate?  I assume this community leaving the sspx is a good thing, but you're saying it's not because of the negotiations?
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    Offline RogerThat

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #16 on: August 04, 2016, 03:55:36 PM »
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    • Quote from: Pax Vobis
    Quote
    This issue is A LOT more complicated and dense than just an order "joining" the "resistance," whatever that means. From what my family in France told me this order has had issues with all 3 of the remaining SSPX bishops.


    RogerThat, could you elaborate?  I assume this community leaving the sspx is a good thing, but you're saying it's not because of the negotiations?


    Just think about it critically. IF they were going to leave for the intention of protesting agaianst the negotiations, they would have left months ago, when it was clear and obvious that the negotiations were going to take place. NOT right after one of the strongly worded statements by Bishop Fellay against the negotiations and against Pope Francis.

    I don't live in France but I have family that does and they told me that this is a group that has been causing trouble for years. I think Bishop Fellay and Menzigen were exercising prudence by not ordaining some candidates or something like that that eventually caused them to just flip and join the resistance. Why didn't Bishop Fellay OR Tissier not ordain their candidates? Why is there such animostity between the group and the SSPX? I don't know. All I know is that there has been issues with this group for a while  
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    Offline Franciscan Solitary

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #17 on: August 04, 2016, 09:26:30 PM »
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    • Quote from: snowball
    Quote from: Franciscan Solitary

    Mr. Snowball's opinion given above is nothing if not reasonable.  The problem is that our Catholic religion denies that objective reality is reasonable.  If it were, then the Fall of the human race could never have occurred in the first place and our actual human history would not consist of the innumerable spills and thrills of our history in which in each and every generation good and evil have had it out much like two scorpions fighting to the bitter end in a bottle.  Sorry, but such is the actual reality of this our own dramatic and severely epic space-time continuum.

    The way things are is the most noble and aristocratic possibility.
     


    The Catholic church and its proper theology has always maintained
    that objective reality is reasonable. Aquinas ?
    I don't follow your logic at all.
    The "way things are" are not noble at all; although they are
    not yet to the point of full schism, in the sense that every
    Catholic in the world would know of the schism and be required
    to choose which Pope to recognize.

    No doubt objective reality is reasonable according to the Divine Reason, but in terms of our own human reason it isn't reasonable at all.  Human reason is capable of knowing every natural truth, but only faith can guide us on the road of morality and right living.  Only living faith (enlivened by works) can allow God to save us.  So our reason can know the natural world, yet that is not enough for us.  And the way things truly are is the vision of the mystics, where what by far outshines everything else on earth in glory and bliss are the holy graves of the Roman Catholic Blessed Dead.  The way things truly are is so divinely magnificent it can't be improved on and that is a hard truth to accept for every sinner including myself.

    And Aquinas knew this.
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    Offline Wessex

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #18 on: August 05, 2016, 04:57:34 AM »
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    • The one thing that will put the break on things will be if the Society does not achieve material enhancement as a result of any merger. It likes to think of itself as some traditional power base and would want this to be recognised in Rome. The burser-bishop in Menzingen apparently rates the benefits from a canonical arrangement more highly than questions of doctrine and is willing to be a party to an acceptable trade-off. But I understand the point about Rome continuing to realise her conciliar plans and making an accord more and more pointless. Unfortunately, the Society's constitution which embraces R & R still inclines it to keeping talks going whatever is or is not achieved. When the Society does enter Rome, there may be a female 'pope' there to welcome it!          
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    Offline hollingsworth

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #19 on: August 05, 2016, 11:06:05 AM »
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    • snowball:
    Quote
    SSPX has the ability to absorb, and the precedence to
    inherit the Catholic Church in all its fullness when the
    real schism happens, and Cardinals, then a Pope from
    her ranks whom millions of Catholics will recognize could
    be the Society's destiny.


    I accept the possibility that I totally misunderstand snowball's point.  But I think he's saying that the SSPX could become (i.e. inherit) the Catholic Church, and eventually reflect all her fullness and ancient glory.  That the SSPX 'phoenix' will arise out of the ashes of a fallen and destroyed church?

    Is this what I'm hearing?  If so, then I wonder how a 'secretive society,' led by a furtive and secretive hierarchy, overseen and directed from above by the sinister and invisible agents of an alien race, could possibly fulfill such a destiny.  Because I see the SSPX as a spent force, (certainly morally anyway),a  groveling, servile organization, pretending to be conservative and traditional, but whose heart and soul has become gradually darkened and corrupted by the larger religious  entity which seeks to absorb it.
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    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #20 on: August 05, 2016, 12:44:08 PM »
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    • SSPX to the rescue!  Saving the church from heresy!  God will protect us from the subtle poison of modernism because "it is His will"!

    "Pride goeth before the fall"...
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    Offline AJNC

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #21 on: August 12, 2016, 08:30:14 AM »
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    • So are these Capuchins now really a part of the Resistance or not?
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    Offline RogerThat

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #22 on: August 12, 2016, 05:30:16 PM »
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    • They're officially separated from the SSPX because the 3 remaining bishops refuse to ordain their new candidates. I think the Non Possumus blog stated first that they are not part of the Resistance.
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    Offline AJNC

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #23 on: August 14, 2016, 03:39:03 AM »
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    • Quote from: RogerThat
    They're officially separated from the SSPX because the 3 remaining bishops refuse to ordain their new candidates. I think the Non Possumus blog stated first that they are not part of the Resistance.

    Thank you for this information. Would you know how Bishop Faure has reacted to this development?
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    Offline Fidelis servus

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #24 on: August 14, 2016, 08:28:00 AM »
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    • I think that there is Nothing about an oficial separation.
    living in France and knowing a good number of tertiaries, Nothing like that was published... I think Non Possumus was too fast in publishing that...
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    Ut In Omnibus Glorificetur Deus

    Administrator of Reconquista blog and an worldwide directory of the resistance mass centers (Ordo de la resisatance)

    Offline Cristera

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #25 on: August 14, 2016, 08:39:41 PM »
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    • Quote from: AJNC
    Would you know how Bishop Faure has reacted to this development?


    Bp. Faure is now in Mexico. I asked him and told me he doesn't know anything about what is happening in Morgon.

    Quote from: Fidelis servus
    I think Non Possumus was too fast in publishing that...


    NP based its post on this thread: Powerful allies join the Resistance
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    Offline AJNC

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    Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #26 on: August 15, 2016, 01:13:14 AM »
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    • Quote from: Cristera
    Quote from: AJNC
    Would you know how Bishop Faure has reacted to this development?


    Bp. Faure is now in Mexico. I asked him and told me he doesn't know anything about what is happening in Morgon.

    Quote from: Fidelis servus
    I think Non Possumus was too fast in publishing that...


    NP based its post on this thread: Powerful allies join the Resistance


    Thank you Cristera. I saw Bishop Faure almost a year ago at Kandigai, India. At a distance there is some resemblance to Archbishop Lefebvre - at least that's what I thought. I wonder if the Bishop thinks that Kandigai is hotter than Mexico? Its certainly hotter than my part of India, which is very hot. I must have drunk all the water in the priory on that day.
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #27 on: October 26, 2017, 12:56:16 PM »
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    • Quote from: Wessex on August 05, 2016, 04:57:34 AM
    The one thing that will put the break on things will be if the Society does not achieve material enhancement as a result of any merger. 

     The [bursar-bishop] in Menzingen apparently rates the [material enhancement] benefits from a canonical arrangement more highly than questions of doctrine and is willing to be a party to an acceptable trade-off.

    Unfortunately, the Society's constitution which embraces R & R still inclines it to keeping talks going whatever is or is not achieved.

    When the Society does enter Rome, there may be a female 'pope' there to welcome it!
    .
    That was a year ago ........ are we any closer today, a year later?
    .
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    Offline Franciscan Solitary

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    Re: Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #28 on: October 26, 2017, 02:34:22 PM »
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    • Quote from: BrJoseph on July 30, 2016, 12:24:45 PM
    Finally!

    This is also excellent news for the Resistance TOSF members!
    The absolute best of news, Brother Joseph.

    Deo gratias....  ALLELUIA!!!
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: Capuchins of Morgon join the Resistance - write 200 page treatise
    « Reply #29 on: October 26, 2017, 03:30:32 PM »
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    • Quote from: Franciscan Solitary on October 26, 2017, 02:34:22 PM
    The absolute best of news, Brother Joseph.

    Deo gratias....  ALLELUIA!!!
    .
    Aren't you going to continue your previous conversation (from 13 months ago)?
    .
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