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Author Topic: Bullet point list of changes  (Read 4714 times)

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Offline Nadir

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Re: Bullet point list of changes
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2019, 10:31:12 PM »
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  • I am trying again as more of my thread was deleted than I realised.

    I asked if you knew of  don F ra ces co Ri cos sa, superior  dell'Istitu to Mat er Boni Cons ilii https://www.so daliti um.biz (Remove the spaces)
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.


    Offline donkath

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #16 on: October 03, 2019, 12:59:57 AM »
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  • "In His wisdom," says St. Gregory, "almighty God preferred rather to bring good out of evil than never allow evil to occur."


    Offline ascanio1

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #17 on: October 03, 2019, 01:16:00 AM »
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  • Surprisingly, no, that idea never occurred to me.
    Truth is, beyond basic computer skills, I am not much of a techno geek, and because of that, I do not think I would be able to produce a very good video (graphics, splicing vids by subject within the video, music, etc.).  I know all that can be done, but I myself don’t know how to do it.
    I am a pragmatist, not an idealist.
    Another idea that comes to my mind to bring more hearts back to the Truth is to appreciate that we are all different in our interests, priorities and commitments.
    So rather than going all out to proselytize on complex and challenging topics, you could pick simple and clear issues and become the knight in shining armour that defends them. Keep fighting the more complex issues alive but with those who understand them.
    Create a double tier.
    A public tier with primary goal to proselytize Catholics who are not even aware of a traditionalist wing of the Church exists.
    A public tier that fights the consequences or the symptoms of Vatican II without mentioning it. The majority of Catholics do not even know what a Concile is.
    This tier should fight simple and evident challenges that a larger public can clearly see, understand and abhor: dilution of traditions in schools, destruction of the traditional family, society, etc. Papal behaviours that are clearly questionable, etc. Be the knights who fight against inclusion of alien religions in our schopls and society: (for example: the crucifix. Christmas trees, saying merry Christmas...). Expose how this Pope is in not fighting to save our traditions and welcoming who facts to destroy them to the point of drastically changing our everyday life.
    A technical tier with primary goal to fight modernism and, perhaps, also SSPX for those Catholics who are aware of what a Council is and its implications. A technical tier that fights the causes, not the symptoms.
    If you can win large numbers of lay and common Catholics, you will fight Rome with greater authority.

    I apologise if I come across as presumptuous, but I speak with the heart of an ignorant Catholic who has just awoken ...
    Tommaso
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    Offline ascanio1

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #18 on: October 03, 2019, 06:08:05 AM »
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  • I am trying again as more of my thread was deleted than I realised.

    I asked if you knew of  don F ra ces co Ri cos sa, superior dell'Istitu to Mat er Boni Cons ilii https://www.so daliti um.biz (Remove the spaces)
    Thank you for the reading reccomendation, for the link (repeated by <donkath> whom I thank) and for the Priest whom you cited.

    I have no idea why his name was deleted and I watched some interviews that he offered.

    I do not want to be cause for controversies on this Forum/community as I am here only to research, study, understand and learn.

    If that name was deleted I do not want the moderator to censor or sanction my profile as I value the opportunity to absorb ideas, information and opinions, here.

    Again, thank you for your time that I appreciate.


    Tommaso
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    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #19 on: October 03, 2019, 03:30:41 PM »
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  • Be assured, dear Tommaso, you have no worries with Matthew, our moderator. It's his "big brother" 8) who causes the problem. 
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.


    Offline ascanio1

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #20 on: October 03, 2019, 04:08:02 PM »
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  • Be assured, dear Tommaso, you have no worries with Matthew, our moderator. It's his "big brother" 8) who causes the problem.
    Who is his big brother that I must fear?

    I like to think that I am not such a bad character but, yes, I may have bad ideas. Usually one can corrected them if one can show me facts that I can probe with logic and decide according to my morality.

    I notice that in our Christian community we judge those who hold different beliefs or doctrines as bad characters. I for one, until recently, was ignorant of facts and held different beliefs and, even now, I am not yet certain what to make of this mess...

    I prefer to think (hope) that the majority of Christians who are involved in these conversations and who hold different sets of beliefs are good individuals who either may not even be aware of facts or simply hold different convictions and priorities.

    This may make them heretics to some but, I hold, it should not make them bad people. So I hope that even if the big brother categorizes me as a heretic he will withold judgement and offer me the benefit of the doubt that I may yet be a good person.

    I was raised by a Jesuit who repeated ad nauseam that he knew many protestants who behaved as better Catholics than many who went to Church with us.




    Tommaso
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    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #21 on: October 03, 2019, 04:58:45 PM »
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  • I am sorry, Tommaso. I was being facetious.

    The expression Big Brother originates with George Orwell's book, 1984.

    From Urban Dictionary:
    big brother
    An omnipresent, seemingly benevolent figure representing the oppressive control over individual lives exerted by an authoritarian government. 
    The practical applications of Big Brother watching you today: surveillance cameras, wiretaps, tracking internet use, spychips, digital facial recognition, etc.

    My search for don Ricossa and my posting here on this thread was somehow cancelled. 

    Now back to the topic of this thread....
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    Offline ascanio1

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #22 on: October 03, 2019, 06:00:41 PM »
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  • Back to the topic. Well, I am a pragmatis rather than idealist.

    I reccomend this community to produce a video for the larger audiences of ignorant (as me) Catholics.

    As you gain popularity and followers, your authoritativeness and stature will grow hand in hand with concern and attention from Rome.

    1. Short. 5 minutes max, attention span of majority is short.
    2. Select few, important questions. Perhaps three or four maximum.
    3. Unbiased. Rome's errror is clear and traditionalists perspective need not be embellished to express all its truth. Unbiased presentation will help distribution and forwarding to both sides. Rather than asserting your position, ask questions and allow audiences to answer by themselves. If one has a strong case, then this is a very powerful tool to win consent as the audience will feel that they have come up with the truth or right answer and it will become conviction.
    4. Use very simple language. The concept too must be presented in a very easy way to understand. The majority of Catholics do not even know what a Council is!
    5. Vibrant presentation with up-tempo, beat and flair. Boring videos will not be forwarded.
    6. Hire professionals to produce the video. If the quality is on a par with the examples below, the ideas gain "credibility". The money you invest in this, may reward you many folds.
    7. Address the symptoms rather than the causes (*).
    Some video production houses are very good and I reccommend hiring the best.

    These are a few examples of well produced videos. Disregard the content and look at the packaging/presentation on youtube:
    > PragerU: Very clear and easy to understand.
    > Vox: (too long) but excellent production quality, dynamism and flair.
    > Ted-Ed: excellent digital animation and consequentiality

    (*) I would strongly consider a video where Vatican II is not even mentioned. A video that addresses the symptoms and all that is bad with Rome and how a Traditinalist resistance has grown. While the casuses (Vatican II) are complex, difficult and require in depth understanding of liturgy, canon, doctrine, etc., to understand, the symptoms are easy to understand and every one is affected personally. The symptoms cause discontent and disgust and are asy to appreciate (or deprecate) by every day Catholics: crucifixes removed from schools, store clerks being told not to say "Merry Christms", the Pontiff's recent apology of infanticide in South American communities (It's part of their culture), ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs being allowed to adopt children... etc., etc..
    The video voice over should introduce and describe the issue and then, simply, ask what is right? Who is to blame?
    The answer is obvious and inescapable and the viewer will think that he has come to an independent conslusion that will reinforce it as an opinion of personal conviction. A question will be more powerful than the video voce over attributing responsibilities.

    One should fight a bad ideology, not technology. Embrace technology to save traditions.

    Tommaso





    Tommaso
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    Offline ascanio1

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #23 on: October 03, 2019, 06:20:20 PM »
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  • I think that a bullet point video should not address the FSSPX vs resistance question (this forum) but the wider Traditionalist vs Rome question.

    If the video is catchy and widely forwarded, it will reach viewers who will investigate and study the traditionalist perspective and, like me, discover the FSSPX vs resistance question.

    I believe that it is more important to win consensus to fight Rome rather than to fight the FSSPX or other fraternities/associations.

    Whomever will fight the better battle against Rome, and obtain the greater audience will, inevitably, also win the resistance vs FSSPX question.

    A lesser (*) enemy can be beaten indirectly, by fighting and beating a greater enemy.

    (*) The FSSPX vs resistance question is lesser in audience not in importance. Today the majority of Catholics never heard of Cardinal Lefebvre and Vatican II. Even fewer heard of the resistance. If the resistance assumes its own identity (presentations) and becomes popular it will gain traction in public discourse... popularity = negotiating power with Rome, and FSSPX too.


    Tommaso
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    Offline Plenus Venter

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #24 on: October 05, 2019, 01:40:03 AM »
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  • Dear Tommaso,
    Read everything of Archbishop Lefebvre that you can get your hands on, starting here with Open Letter to Confused Catholics:
    http://www.sspxasia.com/Docuмents/Archbishop-Lefebvre/OpenLetterToConfusedCatholics/index.htm
    The Archbishop was the great man of the Church raised up by God to lead us through this unprecedented crisis.
    Once you know the Archbishop, please God you will see how his present day Society is now departing from his wisdom. 
    Unfaithful to what they preached for decades, they are now prepared to trust the modernist Roman authorities (once they would have said, you can trust a liberal to be a liberal) and place themselves in a situation of practical dependence upon these same authorities that are destroying the Church and crushing every remnant of Tradition they can get their hands on.
    So long as the devil gives them guarantees, they will trust him! As if they knew nothing about liberals, as if they had learned nothing from the past.
    The only enemies they have now, are those who resist this new direction, those who preach the old wisdom of Mgr Lefebvre.
    You know someone by the friends they keep and the enemies they make.
    And pray the daily Rosary!
    May Our Blessed Mother be your guide.
    God bless you.

    Offline ascanio1

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #25 on: October 05, 2019, 04:05:51 AM »
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  • Dear Tommaso,
    Read everything of Archbishop Lefebvre that you can get your hands on, starting here with Open Letter to Confused Catholics:
    http://www.sspxasia.com/Docuмents/Archbishop-Lefebvre/OpenLetterToConfusedCatholics/index.htm
    The Archbishop was the great man of the Church raised up by God to lead us through this unprecedented crisis.
    Once you know the Archbishop, please God you will see how his present day Society is now departing from his wisdom.
    Unfaithful to what they preached for decades, they are now prepared to trust the modernist Roman authorities (once they would have said, you can trust a liberal to be a liberal) and place themselves in a situation of practical dependence upon these same authorities that are destroying the Church and crushing every remnant of Tradition they can get their hands on.
    So long as the devil gives them guarantees, they will trust him! As if they knew nothing about liberals, as if they had learned nothing from the past.
    The only enemies they have now, are those who resist this new direction, those who preach the old wisdom of Mgr Lefebvre.
    You know someone by the friends they keep and the enemies they make.
    And pray the daily Rosary!
    May Our Blessed Mother be your guide.
    God bless you.
    The letter is interesting. Thank you.

    By researching also outside this forum, I did find some incongruencies and contradictions between this letter and some present postions of the FSSPX.

    I am mainly concerned with Rome's departure from: "Thou shalt have no other gods before me", its dilution of our liturgic traditons and doctrine, its pandering to relativist and postmodern theories and its surrender to the fight that islam is bringing to our Faith, culture, ways of life and traditions.

    I am ready, willing and able to fight the symptoms of Vatican II but I am not equipped to engage in cognoscenti debates on how to fight the causes. While I appreciate that it is futile to fight the symptoms of an illness, without addressing its causes, I hope and pray that more proficient, knowledgeable and authoritative souls than me, will do God's will.

    I believe that not all Catholics are similarly qualified to fight the causes but all should fight the symptoms.

    I appreciate your prayers for God's guidance of my research.







    Tommaso
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    Offline ascanio1

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #26 on: December 01, 2019, 03:12:44 PM »
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  • I finally finished reading all of the Second Council of Vatican. I wish I had not wasted my time because it contains only vague and difficult language.

    However, given my ignorance of 2000 years of infallible teachings, I could not find doctrine that conflicts with infallible tachings.

    I found plenty of vague or double meaning language but that is not what I was researching for.

    IIf anyone wants to invest time to point out infalllible teachings, with the quotes, please, that are directly violated by vatican II, I would very much appreciate it.



    Tommaso
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    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #27 on: December 01, 2019, 03:38:17 PM »
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  • Sloth

    One of the seven capital sins. In general it means disinclination to labour or exertion. As a capital or deadly vice St. Thomas (II-II:35) calls it sadness in the face of some spiritual good which one has to achieve (Tristitia de bono spirituali). Father Rickaby aptly translates its Latin equivalent acedia (Gr. akedia) by saying that it means the don't-care feeling. A man apprehends the practice of virtue to be beset with difficulties and chafes under the restraints imposed by the service of God. The narrow way stretches wearily before him and his soul grows sluggish and torpid at the thought of the painful life journey. The idea of right living inspires not joy but disgust, because of its laboriousness. This is the notion commonly obtaining, and in this sense sloth is not a specific vice according to the teaching of St. Thomas, but rather a circuмstance of all vices. Ordinarily it will not have the malice of mortal sin unless, of course, we conceive it to be so utter that because of it one is willing to bid defiance to some serious obligation. St. Thomas completes his definition of sloth by saying that it is torpor in the presence of spiritual good which is Divine good. In other words, a man is then formally distressed at the prospect of what he must do for God to bring about or keep intact his friendship with God. In this sense sloth is directly opposed to charity. It is then a mortal sin unless the act be lacking in entire advertence or full consent of the will. The trouble attached to maintenance of the inhabiting of God by charity arouses tedium in such a person. He violates, therefore, expressly the first and the greatest of the commandments: "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with thy whole heart, and with thy whole soul, and with thy whole mind, and with thy whole strength." (Mark 12:30).

    http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14057c.htm

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #28 on: December 01, 2019, 04:08:17 PM »
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  • I finally finished reading all of the Second Council of Vatican. I wish I had not wasted my time because it contains only vague and difficult language.

    However, given my ignorance of 2000 years of infallible teachings, I could not find doctrine that conflicts with infallible tachings.

    I found plenty of vague or double meaning language but that is not what I was researching for.

    IIf anyone wants to invest time to point out infalllible teachings, with the quotes, please, that are directly violated by vatican II, I would very much appreciate it.
    Tommaso, on another thread I recommended No Crisis in the Church - a rigorous comparison of Catholic Church teachings before and after the Second Vatican Council, by Simon Galloway isbn 0-9553745-0-2


    It is a side-by-side comparison (like your missal set-up) organised in chapters whose titles are questions, such as "Is man free to follow whatever religion he chooses?" and "Is man to be praised? " and "Who is the way - Christ or man?"
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Bullet point list of changes
    « Reply #29 on: December 01, 2019, 04:54:54 PM »
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  • Ascanio has professed his ignorance, requested help, been spoonfed Magisterium, and then plays "Cafeteria Catholic," rejecting the inconveniences of the Faith while begging for more spoonfeeding. He spends much time posting here while professing he is too short of time to read what has already been recommended, especially sources that oppose his strong and poorly-formed opinions.

    Sloth

    One of the seven capital sins. In general it means disinclination to labour or exertion. As a capital or deadly vice St. Thomas (II-II:35) calls it sadness in the face of some spiritual good which one has to achieve (Tristitia de bono spirituali). Father Rickaby aptly translates its Latin equivalent acedia (Gr. akedia) by saying that it means the don't-care feeling. A man apprehends the practice of virtue to be beset with difficulties and chafes under the restraints imposed by the service of God. The narrow way stretches wearily before him and his soul grows sluggish and torpid at the thought of the painful life journey. The idea of right living inspires not joy but disgust, because of its laboriousness. This is the notion commonly obtaining, and in this sense sloth is not a specific vice according to the teaching of St. Thomas, but rather a circuмstance of all vices. Ordinarily it will not have the malice of mortal sin unless, of course, we conceive it to be so utter that because of it one is willing to bid defiance to some serious obligation. St. Thomas completes his definition of sloth by saying that it is torpor in the presence of spiritual good which is Divine good. In other words, a man is then formally distressed at the prospect of what he must do for God to bring about or keep intact his friendship with God. In this sense sloth is directly opposed to charity. It is then a mortal sin unless the act be lacking in entire advertence or full consent of the will. The trouble attached to maintenance of the inhabiting of God by charity arouses tedium in such a person. He violates, therefore, expressly the first and the greatest of the commandments: "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with thy whole heart, and with thy whole soul, and with thy whole mind, and with thy whole strength." (Mark 12:30). http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14057c.htm

    Pride

    Pride is the excessive love of one's own excellence. It is ordinarily accounted one of the seven capital sins. St. Thomas, however, endorsing the appreciation of St. Gregory, considers it the queen of all vices, and puts vainglory in its place as one of the deadly sins. In giving it this pre-eminence he takes it in a most formal and complete signification. He understands it to be that frame of mind in which a man, through the love of his own worth, aims to withdraw himself from subjection to Almighty God, and sets at naught the commands of superiors. It is a species of contempt of God and of those who bear his commission. Regarded in this way, it is of course mortal sin of a most heinous sort. Indeed St. Thomas rates it in this sense as one of the blackest of sins. By it the creature refuses to stay within his essential orbit; he turns his back upon God, not through weakness or ignorance, but solely because in his self-exaltation he is minded not to submit. His attitude has something Satanic in it… http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12405a.htm