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Author Topic: Bsp. Williamson: "Belief in N.O. Eucharistic Miracles Necessary for Holy Oils"  (Read 19831 times)

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Offline Deipara

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  • Why woud Williamson reconcile with the conciliar church?

    Also: Please provide a quote of Williamson describing the Novus Ordo rite as "good and holy."
    +Williamson CLEARLY implies the Novus Ordo is good and holy when he says,

    "Attending the New Mass can build your faith.

    "Not everyone needs to avoid the Novus Ordo Mass.


    "Attending the Novus Ordo may do more good than harm spiritually."

    All direct quotes taken from +Williamson's infamous Mahopac, NY talk.

    Or perhaps even worse, "Not every priest needs to leave the Conciliar church or stop saying the Novus Ordo Mass" - taken from a talk in 2014 in St. Catharine's Ontario. 

    Anyone can see he is talking out of both sides of his mouth. "Let your yes be yes and your no be no," Christ said.



    Offline SeanJohnson

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  • +Williamson CLEARLY implies the Novus Ordo is good and holy when he says,

    "Attending the New Mass can build your faith.

    "Not everyone needs to avoid the Novus Ordo Mass.


    "Attending the Novus Ordo may do more good than harm spiritually."

    All direct quotes taken from +Williamson's infamous Mahopac, NY talk.

    Or perhaps even worse, "Not every priest needs to leave the Conciliar church or stop saying the Novus Ordo Mass" - taken from a talk in 2014 in St. Catharine's Ontario.

    Anyone can see he is talking out of both sides of his mouth. "Let your yes be yes and your no be no," Christ said.

    All refuted here:

    https://ca-rc.com/a-catechetical-refutation
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Online Ladislaus

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  • And yet the same schizophrenic Loudestmouth said in post #47:

    "Maybe, but, as Sean suggested, he really wasn't "speaking his mind".  +Williamson had other reasons for not wanting to help out Father Hewko besides the stated reason of his not accepting NO Eucharistic miracles"

    This was BEFORE you posted the direct response he made to you, Johnson, where he reiterated the demand and explained why ... that it would be tantamount to a sin against the Holy Ghost.

    Offline Deipara

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  • How can valid miracles be generated in something so evil?

     :popcorn:



    Offline SeanJohnson

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  • This was BEFORE you posted the direct response he made to you, Johnson, where he reiterated the demand and explained why ... that it would be tantamount to a sin against the Holy Ghost.

    Refuted by Mr. G at post #104.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Online Ladislaus

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  • Everyone will note how Johnson is constantly changing the subject and attempting to distract from having to deal with the central problem here.

    Bishop Williamson responded to him directly, doubling down on his condition that Father Hewko accept the NOM "Eucharistic miracles", making statements along the lines of someone being required to do so in order to ...

    1) be in the same Church he is (i.e., in order to be a Catholic)
    2) avoid sinning against the Holy Ghost, and
    3) receive Holy Oils

    I know that you believe in the NOM "miracles", Johnson, but will you defend the above?  You've desperately avoided touching this subject with one distraction after another because you're always trying to shill for Bishop Williamson, and yet at the same time no thinking Catholic can possibly agree with the above assertions, since it's pretty basic knowledge that Catholics are not required to believe in any private revelations.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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  • How can valid miracles be generated in something so evil?

     :popcorn:

    The rite is intrinsically evil, the sacrament is not.

    Please quit posting such feeble arguments.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline SeanJohnson

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  • Everyone will note how Johnson is constantly changing the subject and attempting to distract from having to deal with the central problem here.

    Bishop Williamson responded to him directly, doubling down on his condition that Father Hewko accept the NOM "Eucharistic miracles", making statements along the lines of someone being required to do so in order to ...

    1) be in the same Church he is
    2) avoid sinning against the Holy Ghost, and
    3) receive Holy Oils

    I know that you believe in the NOM "miracles", Johnson, but will you defend the above?  You've desperately avoided touching this subject with one distraction after another because you're always trying to shill for Bishop Williamson, and yet at the same time no thinking Catholic can possibly agree with the above assertions, since it's pretty basic knowledge that Catholics are not required to believe in any private revelations.

    I think what “everyone will note” is how you keep getting refuted, and are starting to have another one of your typical hissy fits because of it.

    As mentioned above, your objection is refuted by Mr. G at post #104.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Deipara

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  • Everyone will note how Johnson is constantly changing the subject and attempting to distract from having to deal with the central problem here.

    Bishop Williamson responded to him directly, doubling down on his condition that Father Hewko accept the NOM "Eucharistic miracles", making statements along the lines of someone being required to do so in order to ...

    1) be in the same Church he is (i.e., in order to be a Catholic)
    2) avoid sinning against the Holy Ghost, and
    3) receive Holy Oils

    I know that you believe in the NOM "miracles", Johnson, but will you defend the above?  You've desperately avoided touching this subject with one distraction after another because you're always trying to shill for Bishop Williamson, and yet at the same time no thinking Catholic can possibly agree with the above assertions, since it's pretty basic knowledge that Catholics are not required to believe in any private revelations.

    This.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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  • Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Online Ladislaus

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  • Please quit posting such feeble arguments.

    Quit being such a toady to Bishop Williamson.  He'd be better served if people would disagree with him about some of his assertions than to be surrounded by a bunch of kiss-ups and brown-nosers.  Since you're in e-mail contact with him, be a man and question him regarding his statements to the effect that Catholics are required (as a condition of remaining in the Church) to believe in these miracles, and that it's tantamount to a sin against the Holy Ghost to not believe in them.  There's no precedent ever, anywhere, in Catholic theology backing these assertions.  Catholics are not required to believe in private revelations and miracles.  Period.  You can tell him that you understand that his problems with Father Hewko run deeper, but that those do not justify these false statements he's made.


    Online Ladislaus

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  • Actually, he said the sin against the Holy Ghost is the "repeated denial of true scientific evidence" and not the "acceptance of NO 'Eucharistic miracles.' " The qualifying condition is that the evidence must be both "scientific" and "true." If the evidence is speculative, falsified, or even disputed, then the condition the bishop states regarding the sinfulness of the denial will not apply.

    Since Johnson keeps bloviating about this post, he's CLEARLY applying that principles concretely to the case of NO "Eucharistic miracles," citing the latter as an example of this principle.  Pathetic that Johnson thinks this "refutes" anything.

    Offline Stubborn

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  • I think what “everyone will note” is how you keep getting refuted, and are starting to have another one of your typical hissy fits because of it.
    No Sean, you are not refuting anything. Lad is right, every time a worthy point is brought up, you ignore it, change the subject, and throw in an ad hominem or two. Either you're reading comprehension is in need of improvement or you're purposely ignoring / changing what is being said. Just FYI.
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline SeanJohnson

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  • Quit being such a toady to Bishop Williamson.  He'd be better served if people would disagree with him about some of his assertions than to be surrounded by a bunch of kiss-ups and brown-nosers.  Since you're in e-mail contact with him, be a man and question him regarding his statements to the effect that Catholics are required (as a condition of remaining in the Church) to believe in these miracles, and that it's tantamount to a sin against the Holy Ghost to not believe in them.  There's no precedent ever, anywhere, in Catholic theology backing these assertions.  Catholics are not required to believe in private revelations and miracles.  Period.  You can tell him that you understand that his problems with Father Hewko run deeper, but that those do not justify these false statements he's made.

    Yet another feeble argument:

    I understand the flat-earth Feeneyite pope-deposer wants Williamson to be wrong.  I really do.  But if you can't refute him, at least you can quit whining.

    You're refuted at post #104.

    Take it like a man, instead of being a public liar, and pretending Williamson requires belief in privatee revelations.

    I used to think you were just plain stupid, but now I see you are a malicious deceiver.

    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline SeanJohnson

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  • No Sean, you are not refuting anything. Lad is right, every time a worthy point is brought up, you ignore it, change the subject, and throw in an ad hominem or two. Either you're reading comprehension is in need of improvement or you're purposely ignoring / changing what is being said. Just FYI.

    Projection.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."