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Author Topic: BREAKING: Archbishop Viganò Summoned to Vatican Tribunal on Charge of Schism  (Read 28642 times)

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Offline Catholic Knight

Re: BREAKING: Archbishop Viganò Summoned to Vatican Tribunal on Charge of Schism
« Reply #130 on: June 29, 2024, 10:54:53 AM »
Quote from: Pax Vobis on June 27, 2024, 09:50:10 AM
Catholic Knight and Fr Kramer say that they can deduce/decide the sin, if the heresy is manifest/obvious.  The crime comes first, then the sin.

No.  The crime is based on the sin.  The crime is contingent upon the sin.  But once again, the sin exists REGARDLESS of whether the Church has made it a crime.  If there was no Canon Law, the sin doesn't disappear.

Sin is based upon Divine Law.  Crime is based upon human law.  Divine Law doesn't cease to exist.  Human law comes and goes.

Do you get it?   
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Offline Ladislaus

  • Supporter
Re: BREAKING: Archbishop Viganò Summoned to Vatican Tribunal on Charge of Schism
« Reply #131 on: June 29, 2024, 11:04:49 AM »
Quote from: andy on June 28, 2024, 08:10:05 PM
"Explosive: VIGANO says FRANCIS IS NOT POPE! 🚫 Antipope?:" new Marshall's video. He does not seem to provide the actual docuмent. Anybody got the full content?

We have an entire thread about it here that beat Marshall to it by a day ...
https://www.cathinfo.com/crisis-in-the-church/jaccuse/msg941376/

Not sure why it's explosive.  +Vigano has already said Bergoglio is not the pope, arguing before from vitium consensus.  What's different this time is that +Vigano also articulates the principle that heretics cannot become popes and that Bergoglio is not a pope on those grounds as well, even citing cuм ex Apostolatus.  Why that's important is that it puts him just a baby step away from holding Montini-Ratizinger to also be non-popes ... and in fact implicitly does so.

+Vigano affirms that the Church cannot teach error and then states that Vatican II taught error and is not Catholic Magisterium.
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Offline Catholic Knight

Re: BREAKING: Archbishop Viganò Summoned to Vatican Tribunal on Charge of Schism
« Reply #132 on: June 29, 2024, 11:05:04 AM »
Quote
"Before my Brothers in the Episcopate and the entire ecclesial body, I accuse Jorge Mario Bergoglio of heresy and schism, and I ask that he be judged as a heretic and schismatic and removed from the Throne which he has unworthily occupied for over eleven years. This in no way contradicts the adage Prima Sedes a nemine judicatur, because it is evident that, since a heretic is unable to assume the Papacy, he is not above the Prelates who judge him."
(Archbishop Vigano)

Pax Vobis, you should be enraged by Archbishop Vigano's statement above.  How dare he accuse Jorge Bergoglio of the sin of heresy?  How dare he usurp the authority of the Church because only she can judge that one has committed the sin of heresy?  Any other judgment other than the judgment of the Church of one being guilty of the sin of heresy is RASH JUDGMENT!

And yet you still have not provided one shred of evidence that only the Church can judge that one has committed the sin of heresy.
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Offline Ladislaus

  • Supporter
Re: BREAKING: Archbishop Viganò Summoned to Vatican Tribunal on Charge of Schism
« Reply #133 on: June 29, 2024, 11:06:37 AM »
Pax is right.  Catholic Knight and Father Kramer resort to a judgment about the internal forum to try claiming that Jorge is a heretic but Ratzinger is not ... for publicly declaring the exact same heresy.  See, Jorge really means it but Ratzinger didn't.  I hold that, if anything, Ratzinger is more likely to know the history of Catholic doctrine (he's a brilliant man) and Jorge more likely to just be a fumbling / bumbling / stumbling buffoon who barely knows his basic catechism.
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Offline Catholic Knight

Re: BREAKING: Archbishop Viganò Summoned to Vatican Tribunal on Charge of Schism
« Reply #134 on: June 29, 2024, 11:15:07 AM »
Quote from: Ladislaus on June 29, 2024, 11:06:37 AM
Pax is right.  Catholic Knight and Father Kramer resort to a judgment about the internal forum to try claiming that Jorge is a heretic but Ratzinger is not ... for publicly declaring the exact same heresy.  See, Jorge really means it but Ratzinger didn't.  I hold that, if anything, Ratzinger is more likely to know the history of Catholic doctrine (he's a brilliant man) and Jorge more likely to just be a fumbling / bumbling / stumbling buffoon who barely knows his basic catechism.

A judgment of the internal forum is required in order to conclude that one has committed the public sin of formal heresy.
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