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Author Topic: Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1  (Read 5192 times)

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Offline SeanJohnson

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Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
« on: April 03, 2013, 11:31:35 PM »
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  • Bishop Williamson's Visit to St. Paul, MN (Day 1 Review):


    Initial Impressions:


    1) Bishop Williamson arrives in St. Paul/Minneapolis from his New Jersey venue, understandably looking a bit fatigued;

    2) He owns no liturgical supplies, save his episcopal cassock, white miter, and pectoral cross;

    3) His only luggage for his American tour is a small carry-on bag, and a very worn attaché case containing a beat-up Rituale Romanum, holy water bottle, sacred oils, and a couple other odds/ends;


    The Mass:


    1) His Lordship seems to gain strength and energy as Mass begins;

    2) The sermon is short, and asks us to pray for those at Immaculate Heart of Mary Chapel (SSPX, St. Paul, MN), that they slide not into liberalism

    3) 30 people attend this Mass, which took place mid-week during work hours;

    4) Representatives from resistance groups nearby in Winona and Long Prairie also attended;


    Agenda:


    1) Tomorrow's conference will be open to the public, whereas today's Mass and Q/A session was only for our resistance group, and representatives of those nearby resistance groups mentioned above;

    2) Tomorrow will feature Mass, Confirmations of 7-8 persons, and a full conference;

    3) So far, 90 persons have RSVP'd for the conference, which also takes place mid-week during work hours; a testament to the strength of the St. Paul/Minneapolis resistance (whose numbers match those in Post Falls, despite having 1/5th the total number of SSPX parishioners);


    Highlights of Tonight's Q/A Session:


    1) Red Light/Yellow Light:
    His Excellency acknowledged a difference of opinion on the matter; he said however that it is fair to say that both he and Fr. Pfeiffer are correct, since a yellow light is either going from red to green, or green to red, and in the case of the SSPX, it is clearly going from green to red.  Therefore, though believing Fr. Pfeiffer to be a bit premature, he sees thee red light being inevitable, but in the mean time, people must make up their own minds based on local conditions;

    2) Episcopal Consecrations:
    He acknowledged that some resistance priests are all over him to do consecrations, but for the time being, will refrain.  His reason was that it will repel other priests not yet in the resistance, while simultaneously alienating others who have joined it already, and so the timing is not yet right.

    3) GREC:
    His Lordship recounted how he had received a personal letter from Mrs Perol (wife of the late founder of GREC) asking him why His Lordship was so harsh on GREC.  He recounted how the late Mr. Perol was a diplomat, who naturally sought a diplomatic solution to the conflict between the SSPX and Rome; His Lordship observed that GREC's influence is to bee seen in Menzingen in the latter's having put unity before doctrine, as a diplomatic solution would naturally do.

    4) Slow Rot:
    His Excellency revealed that already back on 2000, when the SSPX went on pilgrimage to Rome, the bishops of the SSPX were allowed to speak in the Basilicas......except for him.  Already in 2000 the GREC plan was laid.

    5) Bishop Fellay: Liberal Yes/Infiltrator No:
    Bishop Williamson denied the account relayed by Max Barrett of Bishop Fellay being an infiltrator planted by a wealthy Swiss benefactor.  In actuality, Archbishop Lefebvre was petitioned by a group of Swiss to include a Swiss bishop, and did so, but discounted a nepharious motive, which would also have imputed moral fault to the Archbishop insofar as it would show him being bought off, which would be preposterous for a man of his high moral caliber.

    6) Very Few SSPX Priests Calling Him for Advice:
    His Lordship mentioned a few priests had called him seeking counsel on how to respond to the neo-liberalism.  He mentioned the muffled reaction was disappointing.

    7) There are currently 24 resistance chapels in the USA.

    8) His Excellency says there is no chance of his ever relocating to America.

    9) The three great lies of the modern world: 911, h0Ɩ0cαųst, and evolution.  These are all religious subjects because all facilitate, and set the stage, for the nєω ωσrℓ∂ σr∂єr and the advent of the Anti-Christ.

    10) The Doves:
    Menzingen crumbled because many were attracted to the charisma of Archbishop Lefebvre, and did not understand he was principally about doctrine.  This point was stressed in great detail.  He called these people "doves," since they are not fighters for doctrinal purity and integrity, but diplomats who want to get along.  This is how they became susceptible to GREC's plan.

    Note: Tonight's small conference was audio taped, but not recorded, since it was not a formal presentation.  Tomorrow's conference will be recorded, and most likely uploaded onto Youtube (though I have not yet heard that His Excellency has yet given permission).

    I will post an update same time tomorrow.

    Pax Tecuм,

    Seraphim
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Incredulous

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #1 on: April 03, 2013, 11:39:23 PM »
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  • Thank you for the thorough yet concise report Seraphim!

    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi


    Offline wallflower

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #2 on: April 03, 2013, 11:47:42 PM »
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  • Yes thank you! I hope those 90 RSVP's are all of good will!

    But also where is the general notice of his schedule? Had I known he would be in MN I could have alerted a couple of people nearby. Last I saw was a NJ stop, I must not be keeping close enough track.

    How long will he by in MN?

    Offline 1st Mansion Tenant

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #3 on: April 03, 2013, 11:48:15 PM »
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  •  There are currently 24 resistance chapels in the USA. I didn't know that. Sounds as if we are off to a good start for such a short time.

    Offline Mithrandylan

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #4 on: April 03, 2013, 11:49:47 PM »
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  • Woot woot Twin Cities!
    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #5 on: April 03, 2013, 11:51:25 PM »
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  • Quote from: wallflower
    Yes thank you! I hope those 90 RSVP's are all of good will!

    But also where is the general notice of his schedule? Had I known he would be in MN I could have alerted a couple of people nearby. Last I saw was a NJ stop, I must not be keeping close enough track.

    How long will he by in MN?


    Yes, these are all respondents to selectively mailed invitations.

    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #6 on: April 04, 2013, 01:25:47 AM »
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  • Incidentally, Mass was said using a 1951 Missale Romanum.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Nemmersdorf

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #7 on: April 04, 2013, 07:18:11 AM »
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  • Quote from: Seraphim
    Bishop Williamson's Visit to St. Paul, MN (Day 1 Review):



    3) GREC:
    His Lordship recounted how he had received a personal letter from Mrs Perol (wife of the late founder of GREC) asking him why His Lordship was so harsh on GREC.  He recounted how the late Mr. Perol was a diplomat, who naturally sought a diplomatic solution to the conflict between the SSPX and Rome; His Lordship observed that GREC's influence is to bee seen in Menzingen in the latter's having put unity before doctrine, as a diplomatic solution would naturally do.



    Rectifying a slight misunderstanding:

    Ambassador Gilbert Pérol died in 1995, long before the founding of the G.R.E.C.

     Mrs Pérol was one of the founders of the G.R.E.C. in 2000.


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #8 on: April 04, 2013, 07:44:30 AM »
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  • Quote from: Nemmersdorf
    Quote from: Seraphim
    Bishop Williamson's Visit to St. Paul, MN (Day 1 Review):



    3) GREC:
    His Lordship recounted how he had received a personal letter from Mrs Perol (wife of the late founder of GREC) asking him why His Lordship was so harsh on GREC.  He recounted how the late Mr. Perol was a diplomat, who naturally sought a diplomatic solution to the conflict between the SSPX and Rome; His Lordship observed that GREC's influence is to bee seen in Menzingen in the latter's having put unity before doctrine, as a diplomatic solution would naturally do.



    Rectifying a slight misunderstanding:

    Ambassador Gilbert Pérol died in 1995, long before the founding of the G.R.E.C.

     Mrs Pérol was one of the founders of the G.R.E.C. in 2000.



    Grec was founded in 1997, not 2000.

    You are correct it came into being after the death of Gilbert.

    However, Mr Perol was actively pursuing his diplomatic strategy before his death, as proven by his pics with bishop Fellay in the book by fr Michel Lelong.

    The 1997 formation of Grec was just a formalization for the continuation of Mr Perol's work.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline John Grace

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #9 on: April 04, 2013, 07:59:37 AM »
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  • Many are far too occupied with GREC. Let us oppose an agreement based on doctrine.

    Offline Ethelred

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #10 on: April 04, 2013, 08:27:55 AM »
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  • Quote from: John Grace
    Many are far too occupied with GREC. Let us oppose an agreement based on doctrine.

    However, in order to win this battle ("oppose an agreement") we need to know the errors of our opponents very well. Or put in a more military way: know your enemy!

    This however also means we must understand the GREC conspiracy, because Menzingen's double-thinking is the GREC's double-thinking. I think we're going see an Eleison Comment "GREC III" and probably also IV...

    Well, the good bishop wrote (in EC 295, GREC II) :
    Quote
    Before we continue with the story of GREC, namely the Parisian group of laity and clergy meeting from the late 1990’s onwards in pursuit of reconciliation between Vatican II and Catholic Tradition, we must consider the basic attitude of GREC participants. The Church’s future depends on those Catholics who will understand GREC’s error, i.e. how modern minds lose their grip on truth. To illustrate that attitude let us take at random four quotes, typical of dozens and dozens in the book For the Necessary Reconciliation by the Newchurch priest, Fr Michel Lelong, one of the founders of GREC.



    God bless Bishop Williamson. And thanks to Seraphim for his nice summary.


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #11 on: April 04, 2013, 08:28:31 AM »
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  • Quote from: Seraphim
    Bishop Williamson's Visit to St. Paul, MN (Day 1 Review):


    Initial Impressions:


    1) Bishop Williamson arrives in St. Paul/Minneapolis from his New Jersey venue, understandably looking a bit fatigued;

    2) He owns no liturgical supplies, save his episcopal cassock, white miter, and pectoral cross;

    3) His only luggage for his American tour is a small carry-on bag, and a very worn attaché case containing a beat-up Rituale Romanum, holy water bottle, sacred oils, and a couple other odds/ends;


    The Mass:


    1) His Lordship seems to gain strength and energy as Mass begins;

    2) The sermon is short, and asks us to pray for those at Immaculate Heart of Mary Chapel (SSPX, St. Paul, MN), that they slide not into liberalism

    3) 30 people attend this Mass, which took place mid-week during work hours;

    4) Representatives from resistance groups nearby in Winona and Long Prairie also attended;


    Agenda:


    1) Tomorrow's conference will be open to the public, whereas today's Mass and Q/A session was only for our resistance group, and representatives of those nearby resistance groups mentioned above;

    2) Tomorrow will feature Mass, Confirmations of 7-8 persons, and a full conference;

    3) So far, 90 persons have RSVP'd for the conference, which also takes place mid-week during work hours; a testament to the strength of the St. Paul/Minneapolis resistance (whose numbers match those in Post Falls, despite having 1/5th the total number of SSPX parishioners);


    Highlights of Tonight's Q/A Session:


    1) Red Light/Yellow Light:
    His Excellency acknowledged a difference of opinion on the matter; he said however that it is fair to say that both he and Fr. Pfeiffer are correct, since a yellow light is either going from red to green, or green to red, and in the case of the SSPX, it is clearly going from green to red.  Therefore, though believing Fr. Pfeiffer to be a bit premature, he sees thee red light being inevitable, but in the mean time, people must make up their own minds based on local conditions;

    2) Episcopal Consecrations:
    He acknowledged that some resistance priests are all over him to do consecrations, but for the time being, will refrain.  His reason was that it will repel other priests not yet in the resistance, while simultaneously alienating others who have joined it already, and so the timing is not yet right.

    3) GREC:
    His Lordship recounted how he had received a personal letter from Mrs Perol (wife of the late founder of GREC) asking him why His Lordship was so harsh on GREC.  He recounted how the late Mr. Perol was a diplomat, who naturally sought a diplomatic solution to the conflict between the SSPX and Rome; His Lordship observed that GREC's influence is to bee seen in Menzingen in the latter's having put unity before doctrine, as a diplomatic solution would naturally do.

    4) Slow Rot:
    His Excellency revealed that already back on 2000, when the SSPX went on pilgrimage to Rome, the bishops of the SSPX were allowed to speak in the Basilicas......except for him.  Already in 2000 the GREC plan was laid.

    5) Bishop Fellay: Liberal Yes/Infiltrator No:
    Bishop Williamson denied the account relayed by Max Barrett of Bishop Fellay being an infiltrator planted by a wealthy Swiss benefactor.  In actuality, Archbishop Lefebvre was petitioned by a group of Swiss to include a Swiss bishop, and did so, but discounted a nepharious motive, which would also have imputed moral fault to the Archbishop insofar as it would show him being bought off, which would be preposterous for a man of his high moral caliber.

    6) Very Few SSPX Priests Calling Him for Advice:
    His Lordship mentioned a few priests had called him seeking counsel on how to respond to the neo-liberalism.  He mentioned the muffled reaction was disappointing.

    7) There are currently 24 resistance chapels in the USA.

    8) His Excellency says there is no chance of his ever relocating to America.

    9) The three great lies of the modern world: 911, h0Ɩ0cαųst, and evolution.  These are all religious subjects because all facilitate, and set the stage, for the nєω ωσrℓ∂ σr∂єr and the advent of the Anti-Christ.

    10) The Doves:
    Menzingen crumbled because many were attracted to the charisma of Archbishop Lefebvre, and did not understand he was principally about doctrine.  This point was stressed in great detail.  He called these people "doves," since they are not fighters for doctrinal purity and integrity, but diplomats who want to get along.  This is how they became susceptible to GREC's plan.

    Note: Tonight's small conference was audio taped, but not recorded, since it was not a formal presentation.  Tomorrow's conference will be recorded, and most likely uploaded onto Youtube (though I have not yet heard that His Excellency has yet given permission).

    I will post an update same time tomorrow.

    Pax Tecuм,

    Seraphim



    11) Forgot to mention that His Excellency also clarified that the recent docuмent leaked last week illustrating Bishop Fellay's desired sellout was not the famous secret doctrinal preamble (as many are calling it); the docuмent Bishop Fellay signed was a doctrinal declaration; two different docuмents.

    12) His Excellency also mentioned that there had been very little reaction to the publication of this docuмent amongst SSPX priests.

    13) His Excellency explained there were 3 reasons he believed this to be the case, but I cannot remember them (sorry; didn't get much sleep).

    PS: One of the attendees confirmed that Bishop Fellay's response/explanation/defense of the leaked doctrinal declaration has since been published and distributed in the March issue of Cor Unum.  Would love to see if someone could get their hands on that!
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline John Grace

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #12 on: April 04, 2013, 08:45:46 AM »
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  • Quote
    know your enemy!


    And who is the enemy?

    Offline John Grace

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #13 on: April 04, 2013, 08:54:32 AM »
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  • The reason I ask is who is the enemy is do we include the SSPX attendee, who spoke at the rosary vigil in Dublin flanked by NewChurch clergy? the SSPX youth who steward at pro-life vigils organised by youth who will go to World Youth Day in Brazil? The SSPX folk, who aligned themselves to Libertas which had allied with the Simon Wiesenthal centre. How many Irish SSPX folk voted or canvassed for Declan Ganley and his Libertas?

    Are they enemies?





    Offline John Grace

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    Bishop Williamson Visit: Part 1
    « Reply #14 on: April 04, 2013, 09:07:14 AM »
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  • Inadvertently some SSPX folk have propped up the enemy for certain.