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Author Topic: Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:  (Read 21642 times)

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Offline SeanJohnson

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Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
« on: June 25, 2013, 08:19:51 PM »
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  • Fr Morgan has announced in the July/August edition of the SSPX British District Newsletter that Bishop Fellay has "renounced" his April 15, 2012 Doctrinal Declaration.

    He promises details in the forthcoming issue of Mater Dei.

    Critical, will be learning the reasons why Bishop Fellay now renounces the Declaration.

    Meanwhile, here is the link to Fr Morgan's letter:

    http://www.sspx.co.uk/attachments/article/444/JULYAUG13%2520Web.pdf
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #1 on: June 25, 2013, 08:23:35 PM »
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  • If that link doesn't work, just use this one:

    http://www.sspx.co.uk/

    Ps: And obviously, my post above should say April 15, 2012 doctrinal declaration, not 2013.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Mithrandylan

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #2 on: June 25, 2013, 08:23:42 PM »
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  • Link doesn't work for me Sean.

    ETA: Second link works
    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).

    Offline Charlotte NC Bill

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #3 on: June 25, 2013, 08:32:32 PM »
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  • Yeah..I can almost see Bp Fellay and Fr. Pflueger in Menzingen discussing this move: " Wow, the Resistance has really been scoring points off the AFD..the "re-branding"...Krah-gate and all the rest...we bettter say SOMETHING trad....and soon..." Or something like that..

    Offline Novus Weirdo

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #4 on: June 25, 2013, 08:48:23 PM »
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  • Quote from: Charlotte NC Bill
    Yeah..I can almost see Bp Fellay and Fr. Pflueger in Menzingen discussing this move: " Wow, the Resistance has really been scoring points off the AFD..the "re-branding"...Krah-gate and all the rest...we bettter say SOMETHING trad....and soon..." Or something like that..


    Ha ha ha!  My sentiments exactly.  It's not a very persuasive spin press release letter.


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #5 on: June 25, 2013, 08:58:26 PM »
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  • Quote from: Charlotte NC Bill
    Yeah..I can almost see Bp Fellay and Fr. Pflueger in Menzingen discussing this move: " Wow, the Resistance has really been scoring points off the AFD..the "re-branding"...Krah-gate and all the rest...we bettter say SOMETHING trad....and soon..." Or something like that..


    Bill-

    1) Everything depends on the reasons given for the renouncement;

    2) This will be interesting, as this news breaks while the American District has heavily invested in defending the doctrinal declaration, via Fr Themann's conference;

    3) I suspect the reasons forthcoming will be along the lines of "Though I possessed authority to take the actions I did, without compromising the principles (or "prudential preconditions," if you are persuaded by Fr Themann's position) of Archbishop Lefebvre, nevertheless this declaration may have gone too far..."

    4) Even if the reasons given follow that line, it will be progress, insofar as it will make it much more difficult to concede similar traditional positions again in the future;

    5) It would imply a certain degree of humility to make such a renouncement, which would be reassuring;

    6) And whether Bishop Fellay came to this realization of his own accord, or was pressured into the retraction by awareness of a growing resistance becomes an irrelevent issue, since his renouncement precludes return to these concessions.

    7) Certainly this does not solve all difficulties, but when a step is being made in the right direction, it is best to let that step be made, and direct energies to the other things that remain to be remedied.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Mithrandylan

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #6 on: June 25, 2013, 09:06:27 PM »
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  • I think it's very hard to see this as a step in the right direction considering that the AFD is simply a culmination of everything that led up to it, including Fellay's uncanny ability to simultaneously speak two completely different things out of each side of his mouth.  

    Bottom line: He's lost the trust of this traditional Catholic.  Not irreparably, but to the point where it's going to take a lot more than the repudiation of one docuмent (esp. considering it wouldn't be the first time he's literally just said what people wanted to hear, while going on to say and do the opposite) for me to think he's doing anything more than playing the role of the aspiring diplomat.
    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #7 on: June 25, 2013, 09:16:53 PM »
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  • Quote from: Mithrandylan
    I think it's very hard to see this as a step in the right direction considering that the AFD is simply a culmination of everything that led up to it, including Fellay's uncanny ability to simultaneously speak two completely different things out of each side of his mouth.  

    Bottom line: He's lost the trust of this traditional Catholic.  Not irreparably, but to the point where it's going to take a lot more than the repudiation of one docuмent (esp. considering it wouldn't be the first time he's literally just said what people wanted to hear, while going on to say and do the opposite) for me to think he's doing anything more than playing the role of the aspiring diplomat.


    Mythrandylan-

    As I said, it does not cure all that ails the SSPX, but there are really only two responses a resistance man can have to the crisis in the SSPX:

    Either he writes it off as dead (in which case Fr Morgan's letter comes with little importance).

    Or, he tries to rewind the deviations of the last several years one at a time (in which case, this is a step in the right direction, and should be acknowledged as such....even if there needs to be another 50 steps in that same direction).

    Just one man's opinion, fwiw...
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #8 on: June 25, 2013, 09:29:29 PM »
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  • Quote from: SeanJohnson
    Quote from: Mithrandylan
    I think it's very hard to see this as a step in the right direction considering that the AFD is simply a culmination of everything that led up to it, including Fellay's uncanny ability to simultaneously speak two completely different things out of each side of his mouth.  

    Bottom line: He's lost the trust of this traditional Catholic.  Not irreparably, but to the point where it's going to take a lot more than the repudiation of one docuмent (esp. considering it wouldn't be the first time he's literally just said what people wanted to hear, while going on to say and do the opposite) for me to think he's doing anything more than playing the role of the aspiring diplomat.


    Mythrandylan-

    As I said, it does not cure all that ails the SSPX, but there are really only two responses a resistance man can have to the crisis in the SSPX:

    Either he writes it off as dead (in which case Fr Morgan's letter comes with little importance).

    Or, he tries to rewind the deviations of the last several years one at a time (in which case, this is a step in the right direction, and should be acknowledged as such....even if there needs to be another 50 steps in that same direction).

    Just one man's opinion, fwiw...


    Ps:

    There is still plenty to resist!

    Remember that the Doctrinal Declaration was delivered to Rome in April.

    The 2012 General Chapter Declaration (and concommitant 6 conditions) wasn't written until July, and still survives as surrender terms broadcast to Rome.

    So while the AFD may be off the table (Deo Gratias!), the persisting cause of instability remains the General Chapter Declaration (and 6 conditions).

    In other words, focus should now return to them, because even if the AFD is renounced "and cannot serve as the basis of an agreement with Rome," there COULD be an agreement based on the General Chapter Declaration/6 conditions which, while not violating Catholic doctrine like the AFD seemed to, would nevertheless be every bit as deadly to the survival of the SSPX, were a merely practical accord struck with them as the foundation.

    All things in proportion and balance.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Defender

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #9 on: June 25, 2013, 09:49:10 PM »
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  • Quote from: SeanJohnson
    7) Certainly this does not solve all difficulties, but when a step is being made in the right direction, it is best to let that step be made, and direct energies to the other things that remain to be remedied.


    The only step acceptable is a step down !!!

    Offline magdalena

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #10 on: June 25, 2013, 10:20:26 PM »
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  • Quote from: SeanJohnson
    7) Certainly this does not solve all difficulties, but when a step is being made in the right direction, it is best to let that step be made, and direct energies to the other things that remain to be remedied.


    Like re-admittance of those whom they have expelled or "transferred"?

    But one thing is necessary. Mary hath chosen the best part, which shall not be taken away from her.
    Luke 10:42


    Offline Frances

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #11 on: June 25, 2013, 10:25:51 PM »
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  • It only further confuses.  Does it mean all is forgiven and Bp. Williamson and the expelled priests are welcomed back?  I thought it was never "official." Why then any need for a retraction?  If there was nothing to resist, how does one apologize for the non-existent?  Let's say Bp. Fellay admits he erred.  How we can just believe him since his pronouncements the last while are contradictory?  Accepting the contradictory--that's Modernism.  It takes a long time to repair a damaged reputation.  In some cases, the lives of priests and faithful have been gravely harmed.  Time will tell if he is sincere and committed to do the right thing by stepping down.  Pray for Bp. Fellay and be ready to extend forgiveness.
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  

    Offline Telesphorus

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #12 on: June 25, 2013, 10:36:58 PM »
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  • Quote from: Mithrandylan
    I think it's very hard to see this as a step in the right direction considering that the AFD is simply a culmination of everything that led up to it, including Fellay's uncanny ability to simultaneously speak two completely different things out of each side of his mouth.  

    Bottom line: He's lost the trust of this traditional Catholic.  Not irreparably, but to the point where it's going to take a lot more than the repudiation of one docuмent (esp. considering it wouldn't be the first time he's literally just said what people wanted to hear, while going on to say and do the opposite) for me to think he's doing anything more than playing the role of the aspiring diplomat.


    As Bishop Williamson has said: he says what people want to hear.

    What good does renunciation of the doctrinal preamble do if it's motivated by the same kind of thinking that brought about its acceptance in the first place?

    Offline Militia Jesu

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #13 on: June 25, 2013, 10:43:55 PM »
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  • Quote from: SeanJohnson
    Quote from: Charlotte NC Bill
    Yeah..I can almost see Bp Fellay and Fr. Pflueger in Menzingen discussing this move: " Wow, the Resistance has really been scoring points off the AFD..the "re-branding"...Krah-gate and all the rest...we bettter say SOMETHING trad....and soon..." Or something like that..


    Bill-

    1) Everything depends on the reasons given for the renouncement;

    2) This will be interesting, as this news breaks while the American District has heavily invested in defending the doctrinal declaration, via Fr Themann's conference;

    3) I suspect the reasons forthcoming will be along the lines of "Though I possessed authority to take the actions I did, without compromising the principles (or "prudential preconditions," if you are persuaded by Fr Themann's position) of Archbishop Lefebvre, nevertheless this declaration may have gone too far..."

    4) Even if the reasons given follow that line, it will be progress, insofar as it will make it much more difficult to concede similar traditional positions again in the future;

    5) It would imply a certain degree of humility to make such a renouncement, which would be reassuring;

    6) And whether Bishop Fellay came to this realization of his own accord, or was pressured into the retraction by awareness of a growing resistance becomes an irrelevent issue, since his renouncement precludes return to these concessions.

    7) Certainly this does not solve all difficulties, but when a step is being made in the right direction, it is best to let that step be made, and direct energies to the other things that remain to be remedied.


    Progress? Humility?

    This kind of naiveness is impressive and sad at the same time.

    Liberals, especially the pathological liars, are well known to give one step back just so they can take a better impulse for a bigger jump on the next try.

    How can a serious catholic even consider taking Bishop Fellay's words seriously? Only his ACTIONS (such as renouncing as SG, removing the muppets D.S, kicking GREC out of orbit, re-admitting those expelled, etc.) could give us anything to rejoice about it. All the rest is vain hope.


    Offline Defender

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    Bishop Fellay Renounces Doctrinal Declaration:
    « Reply #14 on: June 25, 2013, 10:45:29 PM »
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  • Quote from: magdalena
    Quote from: SeanJohnson
    7) Certainly this does not solve all difficulties, but when a step is being made in the right direction, it is best to let that step be made, and direct energies to the other things that remain to be remedied.


    Like re-admittance of those whom they have expelled or "transferred"?



    More than that!

    1 – The reinstatement of Bishop Williamson and the resistance priests.

    2 – The voluntary resignation or the dismissal of the Superior General and all his assistants, and the appointment of a priest as Superior of the SSPX.

    3 – A return to the teaching and example of Archbishop Lefebvre.

    4 – Officially recognize the irreparable damage of blind obedience.
     
    5 – Go back to fighting against liberalism in our churches, chapels, schools and everyday life (immodest fashions, gender equality in attire as well as the mind, television, bad music etc.), so as to work for the reign of Christ the King and prepare for the triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary.