Author Topic: Are SSPX vocations up or down?  (Read 6062 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline hollingsworth

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2420
  • Reputation: +2625/-298
  • Gender: Male
Are SSPX vocations up or down?
« on: April 26, 2013, 10:48:55 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • A slick new informercial video, produced by the SSPX, makes a compelling case for the construction of a huge new seminary in Virginia.  On this video we see the Winona seminary operating to capacity, bursting at the seams, seminarians running around everywhere, crammed three to a dorm room, getting in one another's way.  The serious overcrowding,  we're told, affects the quality of the priestly preparation each candidate is receiving.  It prevents students from achieving the level of quiet and contemplation required in the pursuit of their vocations, etc.


    Yet, when Fr. Pfluger was here in Post Falls on April 10 he spoke of a serious crisis in vocations within the Society.  He told us that there were many students in the Society's schools alright, but "few vocations" coming out of them.  Then he wondered aloud whether it was our fault.  Are we providing the "faith and example" in order to win our children?  Children have to see the truth in their parents and teachers, he said, (Oddly, no mention of priestly example). In that way alone can we win these children to give their lives for the church.

    Bottom line: Are there many vocations in the Society or are there not?  Does Fr. Pfluger testify to the reality of a lack of vocations?  Or do Winona Seminary director Fr. LeRoux and other SSPX officials, featured in the video, give us the proper pictures of things as they really are?  Touching priestly vocations, does the SSPX hold a flush or merely a pair?    

    Offline brainglitch

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 410
    • Reputation: +1/-0
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #1 on: April 26, 2013, 11:01:26 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Don't have official figures, but I would say that both is the case.

    The SSPX, given the number of parishioners, should have more vocations. They are much higher than the Novus Ordo levels, but not at pre-V2 levels, much less the ideal levels of the ages of Faith (not surprising given that today's cultural milieu is so much worse now than then, there is a great lack of formation due to public school, etc.). The lack of vocations is more evident among the brothers and sisters of the Society. There is definitely a dearth of vocations there, although still better than Novus-ordo land. On the other hand the Benedictines of Silver City have a good number of vocations, last I heard.

    However, it is true that Winona is very overcrowded. I know several seminarians there and there are at least 3, sometimes 4 to a room (small room, mind you-the seminary rooms were originally monk cells). Most of those rooms would be adequate for a single person's basic needs, but would definitely be crowded for two people. Can't imagine what 4 would be like...cozy to say the least. I would say that most of the posters on CI would not enjoy it at all.


    Offline 1st Mansion Tenant

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1682
    • Reputation: +1392/-106
    • Gender: Female
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #2 on: April 26, 2013, 11:27:00 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I am not sure why, but when a grassroots  organization switches from homespun posters and bakesales to glossy media campaigns, my gut reaction tells me that something has changed.

    Offline Kazimierz

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 779
    • Reputation: +578/-18
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #3 on: April 26, 2013, 11:39:12 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • If the SSPX seminaries are going to produce priests formed along the new line of thinking (heigh ho to conciLIAR Rome we go!), then I doubt to see any good, regardless of the numbers.

    With respect to OLG monastery, with Father Raphael being given essentially the proverbial boot, the community has already been compromised. We do not need another Barroux, or Clear Creek OK styled monastic community.  The Resistance can only accept, and heartily we are praying for, the REAL DEAL, to use modern parlance.

    Trust to our Lord and His Blessed Mother to get us out of the mess created by sinful mortals.

    The Shire must be scoured! :gandalf:
    This is a serious journey,not a Hobbit walking party.

    Offline Charlotte NC Bill

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 421
    • Reputation: +495/-4
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #4 on: April 26, 2013, 12:41:34 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • They could have easily expanded Winona....the new Seminary is a waste of money.


    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4808
    • Reputation: +5596/-453
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #5 on: April 26, 2013, 01:19:15 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Seminarian retention is the SSPX's management problem.


    Simple fix:


     1. Replace Fr.LeRoux with Msgr. Williamson.

     2. Throw out all the liberal texts and teach the orthodox Faith.

     3. Tighten up the incoming seminarian specifications.

          Screen for resolute, God fearing young men, who seek to reject the world, the devil and the flesh.
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline TKGS

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4514
    • Reputation: +3876/-348
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #6 on: April 26, 2013, 01:59:02 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: 1st Mansion Tenant
    I am not sure why, but when a grassroots  organization switches from homespun posters and bakesales to glossy media campaigns, my gut reaction tells me that something has changed.


    For years, we used to give to a diocesan charitable cause.  Each time we sent a donation in, we received a short hand written thank you note.  Furthermore, we never received solicitations for money.  The group assisted the poor in an area of the city and, we thought, did a good work.  One day, we started receiving very professional appearing brochures soliciting donations.  When we did donate, we received a computer generated thank you form letter that also provided our "stewardship" information.  Bottom line was that, instead of being staffed primarily with volunteers and operating on a shoe-string and actually doing a good work, the organization turned into a money making venture (though, of course, it was legally a not-for-profit) with a professional staff (i.e., well-paid college graduates) that had to cut services while increasing their property holdings.

    After all, you have to pay well to get the best people....right???   :furtive:

    While I don't really know the answer, I suspect that this diocesan charity no longer uses (or uses very few) volunteers, and few (if any) employees are Catholic.  Based on its own advertising, I now see this as a purely secular "social services" organization with a Catholic sounding name.

    I know absolutely nothing about what is going on with the SSPX seminary, but I do have the same sort of gut reaction that 1st Mansion Tenant describes.

    Offline Telesphorus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 12714
    • Reputation: +7/-12
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #7 on: April 26, 2013, 02:28:00 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: 1st Mansion Tenant
    I am not sure why, but when a grassroots  organization switches from homespun posters and bakesales to glossy media campaigns, my gut reaction tells me that something has changed.


    It is ruthless exploitation of well-meaning Catholics to fund the subverters and persecutors of Catholic Tradition.

    "Give us half your Christmas money"

    The SSPX needs a delousing.


    Offline Matthew

    • Mod
    • *****
    • Posts: 23014
    • Reputation: +20161/-243
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #8 on: April 26, 2013, 02:55:17 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: TKGS
    Quote from: 1st Mansion Tenant
    I am not sure why, but when a grassroots  organization switches from homespun posters and bakesales to glossy media campaigns, my gut reaction tells me that something has changed.


    For years, we used to give to a diocesan charitable cause.  Each time we sent a donation in, we received a short hand written thank you note.  Furthermore, we never received solicitations for money.  The group assisted the poor in an area of the city and, we thought, did a good work.  One day, we started receiving very professional appearing brochures soliciting donations.  When we did donate, we received a computer generated thank you form letter that also provided our "stewardship" information.  Bottom line was that, instead of being staffed primarily with volunteers and operating on a shoe-string and actually doing a good work, the organization turned into a money making venture (though, of course, it was legally a not-for-profit) with a professional staff (i.e., well-paid college graduates) that had to cut services while increasing their property holdings.

    After all, you have to pay well to get the best people....right???   :furtive:

    While I don't really know the answer, I suspect that this diocesan charity no longer uses (or uses very few) volunteers, and few (if any) employees are Catholic.  Based on its own advertising, I now see this as a purely secular "social services" organization with a Catholic sounding name.

    I know absolutely nothing about what is going on with the SSPX seminary, but I do have the same sort of gut reaction that 1st Mansion Tenant describes.


    I agree with you both. You're certainly on to something.

    There's been a change -- a loss of respect/reverence for the sacrifices families have to make these days just to raise a family, let alone support the Church. It is a fact that for the past 250 years, it has never been harder to raise a Catholic family than here in 2013. The value of the dollar is at an all time low, and the economy is awful. It has never been as hard as today for young men to get established enough to start a family.

    The SSPX Rule speaks about the Spirit of Poverty -- how we should take care of things, try to do without, etc. keeping in mind the sacrifices that every $10 bill represents. We should respect those sacrifices by trying to get by with as little as possible.

    Now, that's all changed, at least in reality (the Rule might say the same thing, but now it's only lip service). Now they're downright cynical about us laymen -- comparing us to suburban, middle-class Americans who spend $500 on Christmas. As if that were accurate for most Trads!
    Start your Amazon.com session by clicking this link, and my family and I get a commission on your purchase!

    Offline hollingsworth

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2420
    • Reputation: +2625/-298
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #9 on: April 26, 2013, 02:56:58 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • What I strongly suspect is that the new seminary will eventually be presented to Newchurch, and that some sort of conglomerate, hybrid priestly training will occur there in the future.

    Offline Telesphorus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 12714
    • Reputation: +7/-12
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #10 on: April 26, 2013, 03:01:07 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    What I strongly suspect is that the new seminary will eventually be presented to Newchurch, and that some sort of conglomerate, hybrid priestly training will occur there in the future.


    It will be a center close to Washington DC for pro-Zionist, "traditional Catholic" Republicans.



    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4808
    • Reputation: +5596/-453
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #11 on: April 26, 2013, 03:34:30 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0

  • Unless they have good cash flow, this monstrosity could easily become a financial drain to the SSPX.




    Without sufficient benefactors, a forced sale to newChurch or some other organization would be likely.




    The LA Crystal cathedral is a recent example of such a "white elephant".

    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline songbird

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3484
    • Reputation: +1282/-97
    • Gender: Female
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #12 on: April 26, 2013, 06:47:46 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Glossy pamphlets! Hm?  Grass root organizations? Hm?  My mind says, ah, ha!  When you look at New Order, they operate on the peoples money and then that money goes to Federal gov't through United Way and charities and such.  For every $1. the New Order would see $3 and Grant monies for programs.  Grants are very difficult to come by,to read, for they are kept hidden well! If you get clout from the governor, you could see the movements of the New Order. Dioceses newspapers can have articles written of grant monies to support certain programs.  An idea to research and find out maybe more, is to be an interested person and phone or contact the charities and ask them if one was to financially support seminaries what program might that be?  You want to know "the" program, not an answer like United Way, which is an umbrella of many orgs under it.  It get the feeling that the money flow is from very, very high sources, and maybe out of our reach.

    Offline TKGS

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4514
    • Reputation: +3876/-348
    • Gender: Male
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #13 on: April 26, 2013, 07:07:06 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: songbird
    Glossy pamphlets! Hm?  Grass root organizations? Hm?  My mind says, ah, ha!  When you look at New Order, they operate on the peoples money and then that money goes to Federal gov't through United Way and charities and such.  For every $1. the New Order would see $3 and Grant monies for programs.  Grants are very difficult to come by,to read, for they are kept hidden well! If you get clout from the governor, you could see the movements of the New Order. Dioceses newspapers can have articles written of grant monies to support certain programs.  An idea to research and find out maybe more, is to be an interested person and phone or contact the charities and ask them if one was to financially support seminaries what program might that be?  You want to know "the" program, not an answer like United Way, which is an umbrella of many orgs under it.  It get the feeling that the money flow is from very, very high sources, and maybe out of our reach.


    And once you take tax money (in the United States) you must cease being a Catholic organization.

    Offline CathMomof7

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1045
    • Reputation: +1270/-10
    • Gender: Female
    Are SSPX vocations up or down?
    « Reply #14 on: April 26, 2013, 07:32:15 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    What I strongly suspect is that the new seminary will eventually be presented to Newchurch, and that some sort of conglomerate, hybrid priestly training will occur there in the future.


    The New Church and the Society have what each other needs---the Society has priests and people; the New Church has money and churches.

    Once the "regularization" happens, and it will happen, there will be a spiffy new Seminary in Virginia, where the weather is warm.


     

    Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16