Nishant and others who believe there is really nothing to worry ourselves about in Rome and that the stars look bright for Tradition need only recall the spectacle in Brazil a few weeks back.  That is the state of the Rome.  The Pope was stage director and had it played out his way.  Rome elected him.  Therefore, the state of Rome now and for the foreseeable future is what you see in Brazil.  The party in Brazil tells me Rome could care less what the Society says or does.  The Society is an inconvenient issue to them.  

Secondly, the absolute whitewashing of the SSPX is evident by the lack of sharp, clear communication from them.  All is nuanced so as to please everyone or at lease not get Rome too upset with the Society.  THIS is the problem.  Political ways of dealing with truth simply cannot be trusted, deal or no.  

.


Post

Quote from: ggreg

I'm confused, why would the SSPX want to convince you?

Their usual MO is to wash their hands of priests and laity who don't tow the line and forget about them.  That is what I witnessed over 30 years and I never saw a departure from that policy.

They didn't chase and try to convince the 9, Pope Michael, the people who left after the 88 consecrations or the people who left for the FSSP or The Transalpine Redemptorist Sons of the Most Holy Redeemer.  ( I do hope their Scottish island is big enough to fit their nameboard)

So what motivation would the SSPX have to convince the resistance?  What makes you think they want you back?

You miss the point.

That's an understatement!!  

My point is that "they would have us believe" that "no deal, no sellout" and a lot of people seem to be spouting that line. But it makes absolutely no sense, and the more you think about it the more ridiculous it becomes.

See my examples, below...

That's like saying "because I haven't collapsed, I'm not tired." or, "I am still alive, so I'm perfectly nourished."

To put it into women's language, which ggreg might be able
to understand (!), try this:  

When a husband comes home late, and answers his wife's questions
about where he's been with this:  "Oh, I was just having a drink
with an old college girlfriend -- nothing's going on between us,
just 'catching up' on lost time" -- is his wife going to be suspicious?
Does she have any reason to ask more questions?  And when she
does so, and his replies are:  "You really should be more obedient;
It isn't becoming of you to harbor suspicions consequent to an
unheard-of choice to pay imprudent heed to unfounded rumours;  
It would be best for all concerned for you to trust me because I
have the grace of state, and prudence;  Think of the good it would
do for the children if you would refrain from arousing bitter suspicions
under the appearance of good," what is her appropriate response?  
Should she pray, do dishes and obey?   Because that's what the
Menzingen-denizens are asking of the Faithful.  

In what other sphere does that occur? What other example can be given of a thing that ONLY EXISTS AT ALL when a physical, surface manifestation is made?

Is a house only infested with termites when walls start collapsing? Is a woman only pregnant when she starts to "show"? Did the French Revolution start the day the visible chaos started? Did modernism in the Church begin with Vatican II?

In fact, theologians would agree with me. There is a precept that "No one falls into mortal sin out of nowhere." (or something to that effect). In other words, you don't have a man who regularly follows the Commandments, orders his life to avoid sin and the occasions of sin, practices mortification and prayer, frequents the sacraments, then BOOM! one day he just decides to commit adultery. Usually there is some kind of weakening of his spiritual edifice first.

If you haven't already done so, take a look at the "SUMMER
NEWS" of the St. Thomas Aquinas Seminary (Winona), from
the rector, Fr. Yves le Roux.  It's dated "August 5, 2013."



Note: this isn't all about +Fellay, so maybe it won't be "boring!"  HAHAHA



In this newsletter, Fr. le Roux basically asks for yet more money.
He has some great excuses for this "appeal" namely, the very
great cost of replacing all the windows at Winona (the windonas?),
especially under the current duress of building the new seminary
in Virginia, where St. Thomas will be moved in short order, and,
obviously (he doesn't mention this, though) they will abandon
the buildings where the emergency new windonas are being put
in at such great cost.  Maybe ggreg will appreciate the "August
wisdom" of this business decision.    HAHAHAHAHA

But in regards to trying to "convince" those who are already lost,
the incorrigible Resistance members, keep in mind that they did
send me this newsletter.  

In it, he writes,

About twenty young men are knocking at the Seminary door...
we recommend them to your prayers, as ... the devil tries to
dissuade them during the summer.

[One might wonder, what does he think the devil is doing to
accomplish this, specifically?  Read on...]

The war still rages, as the devil ... manages to unsettle souls,
... under the appearance of good and to arouse bitter
suspicions with unfounded rumours.

[Note:  what these 'rumours' are is unmentionable, of course,
for that would be helping to spread them!!  See how that works?]

We need, more than ever, humble and well-trained priests ...
the devil knows this, which is why he attacks a seminary...

[Note: a "humble" priest is a yes-man for HEBF.]

Please... support us with your material sacrifices ... we thank
you for your aid, which does not fail, in spite of the lies told
about our dear Society...


[The Menzingen-denizens have been accused of no longer mentioning
the crisis in the Church or this age of apostasy, or the coming to pass
of the fulfillment of Our Lady's prophesies at Quito, Lourdes, La
Salette, Fatima and Akita.  Therefore, to put a lid on this "Internet
rumour" (without of course mentioning that it would be such), Fr.
le Roux has the following]:  

So we dare, once again, to ask for your generosity.  The work of
the Seminary is a capital work in our paganized world.  To form the
souls of future priests ... who will one day incarnate Him in the
midst of this insane world ... [yes, it's an incomplete sentence].



--So there!  Don't you dare say they don't talk about our paganized
and/or insane world, or anything like it, such as the crisis in the SSPX.

In other words, "GET OVER IT!" Everything's under (damage) control.

EGBOK.  Everything's Gonna Be OKay.  

They don't need any deal to transform the Society.  All they
need is a running trend of aggiornamento with lemmings willing to
comply with their program of lies.  Oh -- while they accuse the
so-called Resistance of SAME.  

BTW: that's a typically Jєωιѕн tactic.  Maybe HEBF learned it from Maxie.

We need now a serious resistance and an alternative to the SSPX.

I've been a bit of an observer, detached from all this, as I cannot help but wonder that the very success of the SSPX in terms of numbers and Churches and a port in the storm, is the very thing that attracted the infiltration. It had to be destroyed. Like Rome.

The Resistance will cost a fortune to reconstitute anything like what the SSPX was, and once it approaches that, I would expect it too will become a victim of its own success.

Wash. Rinse. Repeat.

But each time a smaller sliver is left to rebuild. Until...

I saw church splits all the time as a protestant. Some group didnt like a pastor, or the pastor divorced and remarried or whatever, a chunk of people would head off and form their own more righteous congregation. And again, and so on. Until you have "The Western Branch of American Reform Presbylutheranism"

I'm not trying to insult your intelligence, but I think you've missed my point entirely.

I'm not saying a resistance forming from the ashes of the SSPX is protestant in and of itself, but that the SSPX was infiltrated as a result of its 'success' and that *if* the resistance is similarly successful, there'll be similar, at least *attempts*, at infiltrating that body too.

Perhaps I should have expanded upon my post when I thought about it, but I second guessed myself and didnt want to keep typing :)

But I think with this phenomenon in mind, there is an oppportunity to 'design' the resistance in such a way so as to prevent future usurpations or infiltrations.

I don't know exactly what those measures would be, but I think now is the time while the Resistance is nascent. It's harder to bend an oak than a sapling.

You cannot escape one major debt. No Lefebve no St. Pius no latin mass. Even the Fraternity of St. Peters existed because of the st. pius society and look at how they compromised by agreeing to the novus order?

I can't blame you for saying this because I used to think the same.

I'm not sure where all the fuss came about but at the end of the day, St. Pius X priests are solid, hard-working Catholics that serve the laity. They don't need further fragmentation in a world that is busting at the seams.

Okay, so what are they doing about it?  You're making the
false presumption that these hard-working priests (which is
true, in the main) have no ability to stand up and call FOUL
when they're being iron-fisted from up the river.  How do you
come off with that?  Are they men of principles or are they
primarily comfort-zone addicts?  Hmmmm??

How much poorer the world would be without the st. pius society -- we would be left with some vague memories of the latin mass and all of the catholic churhs [sic] splendor and books of old.

My two cents on the subject.

Your friendy canadian :farmer:

True, the world would seem to have been poorer without the
Society.  Who knows what the course of history would have
been without it.  But how many independent chapels are there
about the world now?  Is their existence threatened by the
prospect of the demise of the Society?  Or, will their number
grow as the Society declines?  

You know, our ancestors were not so cushy-habituated.  
Imagine this:  they didn't have upholstery on their pews!    :geezer:

As a matter off FACT, they didn't have PEWS.  :surprised:

It took them two or three hours to get to Mass, and
sometimes, it took them a DAY OR MORE.          :scared2:

Not only that, they didn't have a CAR or PAVED ROADS,
or even AIR CONDITIONING!!   :shocked:

If they were RICH they could ride a HORSE to Mass, but
otherwise, they WALKED, over ROCKS and MOUNTAINS.   :faint:


We're not all that removed from that manner of living, really.

I picked up a passenger in my car the other day, when I saw
him look like he was in a hurry on a hot day, wearing a suit.  
He told me where he had planned to go, and it was 6 miles
down a paved road, where he would be walking on a trail next
to the road.  I could only think that by the time he would get
to his destination, he would have been DRENCHED in
perspiration.  I told him this and he gladly agreed.  Then I
asked him where he was from and he told me, "Colombia."  
And in regards to the length of TIME it would have taken him
to walk all that way, his reply was cautious.  He hesitated as
he said, "In Colombia..." I interrupted him:  "Everything takes
a long time."  He said, "YES!!!" and laughed.  I suggested to
him that my ride was going to save him 2 hours in the
blistering heat.  (It was 104 F. that day.)  He laughed again.
He started to say, "In Colombia..." -and I butt in again, "It's
always hot!"  He said, "YES!!!" and laughed.  Then he got
a lot more serious with this:  "Or raining."  I tried to imagine
his starched dress shirt, buttoned to the chin, and pressed
coat and slacks after 6 miles in the pouring rain.  Suddenly,
I knew what this song was all about:  









We're not all that removed from this kind of life, really. ...........