Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on  (Read 3568 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline hollingsworth

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2782
  • Reputation: +2883/-512
  • Gender: Male
Have others of you heard this?  If you listen to priests like Fr. Ceriani and Pere Morgon, you come away thinking that Bp. Williamson may have been supportive of +Fellay & Co. and their efforts to achieve a practical accord with Rome.  These priests assert, (as I understand it anyway), that Bp. W. was on board with the "accordistas" until 2010.  Only in 2010 and thereafter did H.E. go into a full "resistance" mode.  What say some of you?  


Offline Matthew

  • Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 31167
  • Reputation: +27088/-494
  • Gender: Male
Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2013, 02:27:39 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    Have others of you heard this?  If you listen to priests like Fr. Ceriani and Pere Morgon, you come away thinking that Bp. Williamson may have been supportive of +Fellay & Co. and their efforts to achieve a practical accord with Rome.  These priests assert, (as I understand it anyway), that Bp. W. was on board with the "accordistas" until 2010.  Only in 2010 and thereafter did H.E. go into a full "resistance" mode.  What say some of you?  


    +W has always been against a practical agreement. His writings show proof of that.

    Quote
    There is a very good written record that Bishop Williamson has always opposed any kind of arrangement until Rome rejects Vatican II, the Novus Ordo and all the Modernist heresies.  What especially always stood out to me about His Lordship's position was that he never focused on the likelihood of betrayal by the Vatican as being the reason for not making an agreement.  His Lordship always said that even if, somehow, it could be guaranteed that no betrayal would occur nor compromise would be required, it would still be gravely wrong to regularize because it would be like allowing Tradition to be made like another ring in a circus, alongside all the Modernistic rings, which would be an insult to God, a betrayal of the Truth, a damage to souls and would, all by itself, over time, destroy the beliefs of the SSPX clerics and their lay flocks.  
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    Paypal donations: matthew@chantcd.com


    Offline SeanJohnson

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15064
    • Reputation: +9980/-3161
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #2 on: March 05, 2013, 02:51:12 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    Have others of you heard this?  If you listen to priests like Fr. Ceriani and Pere Morgon, you come away thinking that Bp. Williamson may have been supportive of +Fellay & Co. and their efforts to achieve a practical accord with Rome.  These priests assert, (as I understand it anyway), that Bp. W. was on board with the "accordistas" until 2010.  Only in 2010 and thereafter did H.E. go into a full "resistance" mode.  What say some of you?  


    I say this is complete hogwash.

    I was in the seminary during the Campos capitulation, and he was vociferously against any sort of accord even at that time
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline B from A

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1106
    • Reputation: +687/-128
    • Gender: Female
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #3 on: March 05, 2013, 02:51:21 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote

    Sunday, December 30, 2007
    Archbishop's Wisdom

    Working through the monthly letters from Winona Seminary between the years of the episcopal
    consecrations (1988) and the year of Archbishop Lefebvre’s death (1991), I have been reading through a number of the direct quotes from those last years of his life. What clarity of vision!

    Here are a few samples from mid-June of 1988, in other words after he had taken the decision to
    consecrate, but before the consecrations actually took place:

    “It is not true that between ourselves and Rome it is just a question of details to negotiate. The basic problem is always there—Rome’s liberalism and modernism. They [the Roman churchmen] mean to bring us and all our works round to the Council while leaving us a little Tradition...”

    Cardinal Ratzinger [as he then was] “put before me a letter to the Pope that I should sign, apologizing for my errors! But it is we that should be questioning them on their faith! We should be demanding of them to pronounce the Anti-Modernist Oath... But whenever I bring up their liberalism and modernism, they never reply. They just persist in their errors.”

    “The more you think about it, the more you realize their intentions are not good... We cannot put
    ourselves into their hands... We made an honest attempt to continue Tradition under Rome’s protection, but it did not work out... They never intended to secure a place for Tradition within the Church. I entered these negotiations” (of May, 1988) because of “a faint hope that these churchmen had changed. They have not changed, except for the worse.” In conclusion: “I do not think one can say that Rome has not lost the faith.”

    And by 2007, 2008, have we seen anything coming out of Rome to persuade us to the contrary? If anyone thinks so, let him show us his evidence. Kyrie eleison.

    Bishop Richard Williamson


    Quote
    Sunday, November 11, 2007
    Agreementitis II

    Eleison Comments XIX
    The argument in favor of the SSPX “coming in from the cold” and “getting back into the Church” can also be expressed in this sort of double proposition: all great clashes in the Church have always finished in some sort of compromise – what other solution is possible for the long-standing discord between the SSPX and Conciliar Rome?

    As to the first part of the proposition, one might agree if the Faith were not at the root of this discord. To help out the Pope or to restore the good name or canonical status of the SSPX, some compromise might be conceivable, but not if the Faith is at stake, because the Catholic Faith is that body of objective supernatural truths without (an at least rudimentary) belief in which no soul can be saved (Heb. XI, 6).

    But is the very Faith involved in the so far 37-year struggle of the SSPX? Yes, says a distinguished German theologian, Professor Johannes Dörmann, who is quite independent of the SSPX.  After prolonged and professional study of the complete speeches and writings of John-Paul II, he recognized and declared that “lefebvrism” was not just about Latin or the liturgy, but about the very foundations of the Faith.  Indeed.  Being another form of subjectivism, neo-modernism turns any rock of truth into plastic.

    As to the second part of the proposition, there being no other solution possible than some kind of
    compromise, one may reply that there are problems which man can make and which God alone can solve.  An elephant can fall into an elephant-trap, but not by himself climb out again. In Noah’s time, mankind had so “corrupted its way” (Gen. VI, 12) that the Lord God was driven to wash it out and virtually start over.

    In the Sodom of today’s Church and world, have not merely human solutions been made similarly impossible? When in the troubles of the near future enough human beings get down on their knees to beg the Lord God to rescue them, then through his Mother he will do so. Meanwhile the bounden duty of all Catholics belonging to the “remnant chosen by grace” ( underline the “by grace” -- Rom. XI, 5), is not to let anything, love of Rome or family or life or whatever, take precedence over safeguarding the true Faith, which is an obedience to, and love of, the true God. Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy upon us!
    Kyrie Eleison.

    Bishop Richard Williamson
    La Reja, Argentina

    Offline B from A

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1106
    • Reputation: +687/-128
    • Gender: Female
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #4 on: March 05, 2013, 03:02:11 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote
    Saturday, September 29, 2007
    Agreementitis
    Eleison Comments XIII

    An argument often heard in favor of the Society of St. Pius X coming to some kind of agreement with the neo-modernists in Rome runs something like this: “You cannot expect Rome to come back to the true Faith overnight. Down all the history of the Church such returns have taken tens or hundreds of years.  Do you want us to wait out our lives before we can be received back into the Church? You seem to like proverbs -- how about ‘Half a loaf is better than no bread’? Souls without number are waiting for the Society to move.”

    There are in fact several arguments here. Let us take them one by one:-

    *What I expect Rome to do or not to do is of no importance. On the contrary the true Faith, complete, is as important as eternal salvation or damnation. The true Faith, because “Without the faith it is impossible to please God (St. Paul to the Hebrews). Complete, because whoever denies one single Article of the Faith has lost the Faith altogether (Catholic doctrine), and neo-modernism turns to mush every single Article of the Faith.

    *It may have taken a long time for past heresies to be washed out of the Church’s system, but if Catholics faced with the Arian heresy had agreed to Semi-Arianism or even Quarter-Arianism, how would the Church have survived? The Church survived thanks to Catholics like St. Athanasius who insisted on the entire Arian heresy being washed out – see the Athanasian Creed.

    *A wait of 30 or 50 years or even longer is of little importance compared with the purity of the Faith. As St. Athanasius famously said, “They have the buildings, we have the Faith”. It is for those who, by the grace of God, have the Faith to “receive back”, so to speak, those who have mushed it (nor does any SSPXer in his right mind presume that the SSPX has any kind of monopoly on that Faith).

    *Half a loaf is still bread, and nothing but bread. On the contrary half a truth is necessarily accompanied by poisonous untruth, otherwise it would be nothing but truth.

    *If the SSPX were ever to give souls a lead in mixing Catholic truth with error, it would be better if it had gone out of existence first. May it never come to that! Kyrie Eleison.

    Bishop Richard Williamson
    Italy


    Quote
    Saturday, July 12, 2008
    Bishops Agree
    Eleison Comments LIV

    Many friends of the Society of St. Pius X wonder what position towards an agreement with Rome is taken by Bishop Alfonso de Galarreta. He is one of the Society’s four bishops, but what he thinks and says is not so often quoted, at least in English, a language which he may understand, but which he prefers not to have to speak.

    At the Society’s mother-house in Ecône, Switzerland, it was he who this year conducted the annual ceremony of ordinations to the diaconate and priesthood. Sections of his sermon are available on the Internet at christus.imperat, for instance. Here are two paragraphs, the first concerning the Society’s episcopal consecrations of June 30, 1988, because this year was their 20th anniversary; the second concerning Cardinal Castrillón’s “ultimatum” of June 4 and 5, one month ago.

    From the truth no longer being preached, but merely looked for (as though one did not know it) followed, said the bishop, “the importance and need for those consecrations to ensure the survival of the Catholic priesthood. We are proud of the consecrations, not as being a revolt against the pope, but as being in reality the safeguard of the Catholic priesthood. We are also proud of the figure of Archbishop Lefebvre.

    We are not “lefebvrists”, but we adhere to his way of thinking because it is Catholic. We are ashamed neither of the Church of Our Lord Jesus Christ, nor of the unchanging Catholic Church, nor therefore of Archbishop Lefebvre.”

    Further on, as to the Cardinal’s “ultimatum”, the bishop said that calling it an ultimatum was going too far. He went on, “We saw it rather as being meant to scare us, to put pressure on us to come to a purely practical (not doctrinal) agreement (with Rome). This is the way they want to make us go, but it is a dead end, and we will not go that way. We cannot undertake to betray our professing of the Faith, nor can we get drawn into an exercise in demolition. Our reply to the Holy Father is therefore to follow the steps laid down (complete liberation of Tridentine Mass and nullification of the “excommunications” of 1988) as preliminaries to a doctrinal encounter. Rome will react either with a slowing down or complete stop of contacts, or with a fresh condemnation – one wonders exactly what form that might take – or with a lifting of the “excommunications”.”

    Firstly the Faith, then Rome – all four Society bishops follow substantially the Archbishop´s line of thinking, “because it is Catholic”. “Sooner die than betray,” he used to say.
    Kyrie Eleison.
    La Reja, Argentina



    (emphasis added)


    Offline Matthew

    • Mod
    • *****
    • Posts: 31167
    • Reputation: +27088/-494
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #5 on: March 05, 2013, 03:23:18 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I also was in the Seminary during the Campos sellout.

    +W wisely pointed out that even if one day Rome agreed to Tradition -- but for the wrong reasons -- we would still have problems.

    For example, if they approved of Tradition because of some Modernist belief that Tradition would help the current evolution of doctrine.

    In other words, he wasn't just interested in what was on the surface, but the UNDERLYING MOTIVATION of their actions. They had to not only be FOR the Tridentine Mass, but also for the right reasons.
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    Paypal donations: matthew@chantcd.com

    Offline hollingsworth

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2782
    • Reputation: +2883/-512
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #6 on: March 05, 2013, 06:19:16 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Thank you all for your helpful responses, particularly Matthew and Seraphim, who were in the Seminary during the Campos debacle.  I never thought we would hear accusations from "resisters" themselves.  But believe me, this kind of criticism is out there.  For those who read and speak Spanish, go to the Non Possumus site.  You'll see plenty of of it on that page.

    Offline SeanJohnson

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15064
    • Reputation: +9980/-3161
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #7 on: March 05, 2013, 06:23:01 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    Thank you all for your helpful responses, particularly Matthew and Seraphim, who were in the Seminary during the Campos debacle.  I never thought we would hear accusations from "resisters" themselves.  But believe me, this kind of criticism is out there.  For those who read and speak Spanish, go to the Non Possumus site.  You'll see plenty of of it on that page.


    Unbelievable.

    Perhaps someone on Cathinfo who speaks Spanish could translate our comments and post them on that site.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Cristera

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 174
    • Reputation: +380/-1
    • Gender: Female
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #8 on: March 05, 2013, 06:59:59 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Non Possumus defends Bishop Williamson against the calumnies of Father Ceriani. Father Ceriani, Meramo and others, accuse Bishop Williamson of being a traitor.

    Everything that is posted on Non Possumus is for the defense of the Bishop.

    Non Possumus posted an interview with His Excellency where he responds the accusations made against him by Ceriani and Co.

    Dear Hollinsworth, please post a single thing posted on Non Possumus where the Bishop is attacked. Are you sure your spanish is so good to understand what is posted there?

    Excuse my bad english.

    Offline hollingsworth

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2782
    • Reputation: +2883/-512
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #9 on: March 05, 2013, 08:08:54 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Cristera, my Spanish may not be that good, or my understanding of written Spanish either.  I don't mean to impugn Non Possumus unjustly or unfairly.  Perhaps you ought to take a look at the following links and decide for yourself what is said in them.  NP may just be posting the articles of Fr. Ceriani here, while not endorsing them- I don't know.  But that Fr. Ceriani is highly critical of Bp. Williamson seems to be undeniable.  I think the last link posted below contains language which is extremely damaging to the bishop.  I clumsily translate the short passage found below in Spanish, in order to give the reader a taste of Father's attitude towards His Lordship:

    [color=red]"I say that we must not forget that Msgr. Williamson has been a co-participant in many of the damaging events which have occurred over the last 12 to 13 years in order to prepare the Society for a (practical) accord (with Rome)."[/color]

    I'm not saying that Non Possumus agrees with this, but these sentiments are recorded on the Non Possumus site.

    http://radiocristiandad.wordpress.com/2013/02/23/p-ceriani-mons-williamson-comenzo-a-manifestar-su-oposicion-al-acuerdo-en-el-2010-y-no-antes/

     En diversas oportunidades he llamado la atención sobre las actitudes de Monseñor Williamson.
    Recientemente lo hice mediante un corto artículo que lleva por título Saque usted las conclusiones. Ver en:

    http://radiocristiandad.wordpress.com/2012/12/07/p-juan-carlos-ceriani-saque-usted-las-conclusiones/

    http://radiocristiandad.wordpress.com/2013/02/23/p-ceriani-mons-williamson-comenzo-a-manifestar-su-oposicion-al-acuerdo-en-el-2010-y-no-antes/

    Allí digo que no hay que olvidar que Monseñor Williamson ha sido copartícipe de muchos de los acontecimientos perjudiciales que han ocurrido durante los últimos 12-13 años para preparar a la Fraternidad para el acuerdo.

    Offline Cristera

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 174
    • Reputation: +380/-1
    • Gender: Female
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #10 on: March 05, 2013, 08:55:54 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • What is recorded on Non Possumus is the interview with Bishop Williamson. Father Ceriani uses everything the bishop says to attack him.
    He is obsessed. Radio Cristiandad attack everything posted on Non Possumus because this blog defends the Bishop. They analize every single word to find something to attack His Lordship.
    They attacked also the Father Raphael declaration. They attack everything, that's why non possumus is quoted on Radio Cristiandad very often.

    Father Ceriani thinks he is the only one priest of the word who defends the true Catholic Faith.


    Online Pius IX

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 156
    • Reputation: +204/-0
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #11 on: March 05, 2013, 09:41:28 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • St. Thomas Aquinas Seminary
    R. R. 1, Box 97 A-1
    Winona, Minnesota 55987
    ---------------------------
    (507) 454-8000


    February 1, 2001


    Dear Friends and Benefactors,

    As many of you know, official contacts have been renewed between Rome and the Society of St. Pius X in the last few months. In theory, we should all be re-assured by this proof that the Society is not after all a non-entity in Rome's eyes, as Rome has since 1988 been pretending. In practice, all kinds of rumors are flying around, and many Catholics who love their Faith are anxious. What is going on?

    Now on the one hand, nobody reasonable will expect somebody in my position to tell everything I know. On the other hand, the interests of the Society are the interests of every Catholic, so in this sense, every Catholic has a stake in the Society, and in this sense it is reasonable to tell every interested Catholic as much as may help him both to understand the issues involved, and to take part in the defense of Mother Church, wherever Our Lord has placed him on the battlefield. For it is less important to know exactly what is happening than to know why whatever happens does happen. Similarly, none of us at this point know exactly what will come of the recent contacts, but all of us need to know how to react if this or that does come from them.

    Firstly, let us be VERY CLEAR that the initiative for these latest contacts came from Rome. It was Rome that opened up these latest contacts last summer with the Society, and not the Society that opened them up with Rome. Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos opened the fire with a letter to each of the Society's four bishops, beginning "My dear Brother", and declaring that the Pope's arms were wide open to embrace us. (I almost wept with emotion on reading this -- but not quite!)

    Secondly, it was inevitable that Rome WOULD re-open contacts with the Society, not because the Society is the Society or has nice blue eyes or whatever, but because by the grace of God and by a measure of human cooperaton with His grace, the Society happens to have guarded the Deposit of the Faith around which Our Lord's Church officials, if they themselves lose it, must hover like moths around a flame. Therefore, if the Society loses the Deposit -- humanly, more than possible -- and if Rome continued to reject that Deposit, then tomorrow Rome will be hovering around whatever other flame God will have subsequently lit to take the entrapped Society's place.

    Thirdly, so long as any organization like the Society has the Truth while Rome has not, then the Society is in the driving-seat FOR ALL CATHOLIC PURPOSES, and any behavior, shape, size or form of negotiations which would allow this Rome to get back into the driving-seat would be tantamount to a betrayal of the Truth. Of course, from the moment when Rome returned to the Truth, Rome would be back in the driving-seat, because that is how Our Lord built His Church: "Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church"(Mt XVI, 16). However, when Peter has for a prolonged period of time, as now, demonstrated in word but above all in action that he has to a significant extent -- albeit not entirely -- lost the Truth, then however much the organization in the Society's position may even supernaturally long to scuttle back under the skirts of Rome, the burden of proof lies with those who say the moment for negotiations has come, and not with those who say it has not come. To enter into negotiations at the end of such a period without that proof would, again, amount to virtual betrayal of the Truth.

    This is because, fourthly, Roman Church officials are MASTERS of negotiating, of dealing, of manoeuvring, of out-manoeuvring their opponents. They have top-class brains, state-of-the-art networks of informants and information, and 2,000 years of experience in out-witting whoever happens to be facing them. When all these assets are used truly in the service of Our Lord, the results are magnificent. But when they are used, as today, in the service of Vatican II, then automatically the Society is in peril if it tries to cut a deal with these Romans. Our Lord said to his disciples, "I send you out as sheep amongst wolves", but that is no excuse for putting oneself in the wolf's throat, outside of extreme necessity. True, the Romans may always convert, but, again, given a track-record such as the Vatican's over the last 40 years, then the burden of proof lies with those who claim they have converted, and not with those who assume, by the Romans' fruits, that they are still wolves and foxes and sharks!

    However, fifthly, Rome still being, by Our Lord's design, the command-center of the Catholic Church, it follows that if an organization like the Society can, by negotiating, wring important concessions from the "sharks", then those concessions may benefit the Universal Church, and this is the best-case scenario which must tempt an organization in the Society's position. But if the "sharks" remain sharks, in the service, for instance, of Vatican II, how can they possibly put into honest practice the concessions? And if in exchange they have succeeded in putting a leash and/or muzzle upon the Society which was until then free to serve God as best it understood, what will such a Society have gained in exchange for the freedom to serve God which it will have lost?

    Moreover, sixthly, even if negotiations, for all kinds of reasons such as above, come to nothing, then the simple fact of having entered into negotiations will have played for Rome and against the organization in the Society's position. This is because any Catholic organization resisting Rome in crisis suffers from the unavoidable internal tension between staying close to Mother Rome and keeping away from her neo-modernist leprosy. So members of the Society will stretch all the way from those for, to those against, any negotiation. Let Rome but make an offer calculated to please the ones as much as it displeases the others, and the Society will be strecthed to breaking point. Rome will at least have divided, if not conquered.

    In 1921, the Irish rebels had fought the British Empire to a standstill. Cleverly, the British stopped fighting and offered a Peace Treaty which split the Irish down the middle. The immediate result was that in 1922, instead of fighting the British, the Irish began fighting one another! Now the British were cunning rulers of a great Empire at the time, but compared with these Church officials of Rome, the Brits were mere beginners!

    All of which means, seventhly, that any organization in the Society's position stands a good chance of falling into a Roman trap. At best, it obtains unsure concessions in exchange for a sure loss of freedom; at worst, it obtains nothing at all and is divided into the bargain. Wise after the event, we might say that the Society's best course in the circuмstances would be not to talk with Rome at all, but that is for Catholics easier said than done.

    However, eighthly and finally, "The Truth is mighty and will prevail." What is unique about the Catholic Church amongst all organizations of men on earth is that it rises with the Truth and falls with untruth. Neo-modernist Rome has fallen with the untruths of Vatican II. The Society of St. Pius X has, at least until 2001,risen by being faithful to the Truth of Catholic Tradition. As soon as Rome comes back to the Truth -- as it will -- Rome will rise again, to the joy of us all. Equally, if the Society turns unfaithful to Tradition, it will inevitably and deservedly fall. But "fear not, little flock," as Our Lord told us, "your Father knoweth that you have need of all these things" (Lk XII, 3; Mt VI, 32). Souls seeking God will never be left without the means of finding Him. That is because God created the whole world only for souls to come to Him. And that is why, as Our Lord on Palm Sunday told the Pharisees who were angry at his disciples crying out Hosanna to the Son of David, if all human beings were to stop crying out the Truth, the very stones of the street would rise up to proclaim it. (Lk XIX, 40)

    This Rome may then -- worst-case scenario -- succeed in reducing the Society of St. Pius X to paralysis and silence, but if it did, that would only be a just judgment of God, and the Truth would be upheld elsewhere. What does the Society presently deserve? Time will tell.

    Personally, I think that in the United States, in France, in fact all over the world, most Society priests are quietly working at ground level to sanctify and to save souls, that such real and humble work is blessed by God, and so I think most Society priests – and the laity who are with them -- will be protected by God from falling in with Roman corruption. However, even if I am right this time around, there will certainly be a next attack on the Society from the Devil or from his Rome, and since these days are such that if they were not shortened, even the elect would not be saved, then I do not know if the Society will survive in its present form all the way until that shortening of these evil days.

    BUT IT DOES NOT MATTER WHETHER IT WILL OR NOT, WHETHER I KNOW OR NOT. I do not have to worry today about the problems of tomorrow --"Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof" (Mt VI, 34). Let me be the best Catholic that I can, day by day, and the rest I can leave in God's hands. The rest is HIS problem!

    Dear readers, spring is not far off when one can look around and say with the poet:

    "The world is so full of such wonderful things,
    Why can't we all be just as happy as kings?"

    Nobody will be able to do away with God, however hard they try. So let us by all means pray for the Society of St. Pius X, because things will be that much easier if it does hold up. But at the same time, let us be prepared, if it goes the way of all flesh, not to be stricken with panic. "God alone suffices" -- St. Terese of Avila.

    May He love you and bless you.

    In Christ,

    + Richard Williamson

    Online Francisco

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1150
    • Reputation: +843/-18
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #12 on: March 05, 2013, 09:48:11 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Pius IX
    St. Thomas Aquinas Seminary
    R. R. 1, Box 97 A-1
    Winona, Minnesota 55987
    ---------------------------
    (507) 454-8000


    February 1, 2001


    Dear Friends and Benefactors,

    As many of you know, official contacts have been renewed between Rome and the Society of St. Pius X in the last few months. In theory, we should all be re-assured by this proof that the Society is not after all a non-entity in Rome's eyes, as Rome has since 1988 been pretending. In practice, all kinds of rumors are flying around, and many Catholics who love their Faith are anxious. What is going on?

    Now on the one hand, nobody reasonable will expect somebody in my position to tell everything I know. On the other hand, the interests of the Society are the interests of every Catholic, so in this sense, every Catholic has a stake in the Society, and in this sense it is reasonable to tell every interested Catholic as much as may help him both to understand the issues involved, and to take part in the defense of Mother Church, wherever Our Lord has placed him on the battlefield. For it is less important to know exactly what is happening than to know why whatever happens does happen. Similarly, none of us at this point know exactly what will come of the recent contacts, but all of us need to know how to react if this or that does come from them.

    Firstly, let us be VERY CLEAR that the initiative for these latest contacts came from Rome. It was Rome that opened up these latest contacts last summer with the Society, and not the Society that opened them up with Rome. Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos opened the fire with a letter to each of the Society's four bishops, beginning "My dear Brother", and declaring that the Pope's arms were wide open to embrace us. (I almost wept with emotion on reading this -- but not quite!)

    Secondly, it was inevitable that Rome WOULD re-open contacts with the Society, not because the Society is the Society or has nice blue eyes or whatever, but because by the grace of God and by a measure of human cooperaton with His grace, the Society happens to have guarded the Deposit of the Faith around which Our Lord's Church officials, if they themselves lose it, must hover like moths around a flame. Therefore, if the Society loses the Deposit -- humanly, more than possible -- and if Rome continued to reject that Deposit, then tomorrow Rome will be hovering around whatever other flame God will have subsequently lit to take the entrapped Society's place.

    Thirdly, so long as any organization like the Society has the Truth while Rome has not, then the Society is in the driving-seat FOR ALL CATHOLIC PURPOSES, and any behavior, shape, size or form of negotiations which would allow this Rome to get back into the driving-seat would be tantamount to a betrayal of the Truth. Of course, from the moment when Rome returned to the Truth, Rome would be back in the driving-seat, because that is how Our Lord built His Church: "Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church"(Mt XVI, 16). However, when Peter has for a prolonged period of time, as now, demonstrated in word but above all in action that he has to a significant extent -- albeit not entirely -- lost the Truth, then however much the organization in the Society's position may even supernaturally long to scuttle back under the skirts of Rome, the burden of proof lies with those who say the moment for negotiations has come, and not with those who say it has not come. To enter into negotiations at the end of such a period without that proof would, again, amount to virtual betrayal of the Truth.

    This is because, fourthly, Roman Church officials are MASTERS of negotiating, of dealing, of manoeuvring, of out-manoeuvring their opponents. They have top-class brains, state-of-the-art networks of informants and information, and 2,000 years of experience in out-witting whoever happens to be facing them. When all these assets are used truly in the service of Our Lord, the results are magnificent. But when they are used, as today, in the service of Vatican II, then automatically the Society is in peril if it tries to cut a deal with these Romans. Our Lord said to his disciples, "I send you out as sheep amongst wolves", but that is no excuse for putting oneself in the wolf's throat, outside of extreme necessity. True, the Romans may always convert, but, again, given a track-record such as the Vatican's over the last 40 years, then the burden of proof lies with those who claim they have converted, and not with those who assume, by the Romans' fruits, that they are still wolves and foxes and sharks!

    However, fifthly, Rome still being, by Our Lord's design, the command-center of the Catholic Church, it follows that if an organization like the Society can, by negotiating, wring important concessions from the "sharks", then those concessions may benefit the Universal Church, and this is the best-case scenario which must tempt an organization in the Society's position. But if the "sharks" remain sharks, in the service, for instance, of Vatican II, how can they possibly put into honest practice the concessions? And if in exchange they have succeeded in putting a leash and/or muzzle upon the Society which was until then free to serve God as best it understood, what will such a Society have gained in exchange for the freedom to serve God which it will have lost?

    Moreover, sixthly, even if negotiations, for all kinds of reasons such as above, come to nothing, then the simple fact of having entered into negotiations will have played for Rome and against the organization in the Society's position. This is because any Catholic organization resisting Rome in crisis suffers from the unavoidable internal tension between staying close to Mother Rome and keeping away from her neo-modernist leprosy. So members of the Society will stretch all the way from those for, to those against, any negotiation. Let Rome but make an offer calculated to please the ones as much as it displeases the others, and the Society will be strecthed to breaking point. Rome will at least have divided, if not conquered.

    In 1921, the Irish rebels had fought the British Empire to a standstill. Cleverly, the British stopped fighting and offered a Peace Treaty which split the Irish down the middle. The immediate result was that in 1922, instead of fighting the British, the Irish began fighting one another! Now the British were cunning rulers of a great Empire at the time, but compared with these Church officials of Rome, the Brits were mere beginners!

    All of which means, seventhly, that any organization in the Society's position stands a good chance of falling into a Roman trap. At best, it obtains unsure concessions in exchange for a sure loss of freedom; at worst, it obtains nothing at all and is divided into the bargain. Wise after the event, we might say that the Society's best course in the circuмstances would be not to talk with Rome at all, but that is for Catholics easier said than done.

    However, eighthly and finally, "The Truth is mighty and will prevail." What is unique about the Catholic Church amongst all organizations of men on earth is that it rises with the Truth and falls with untruth. Neo-modernist Rome has fallen with the untruths of Vatican II. The Society of St. Pius X has, at least until 2001,risen by being faithful to the Truth of Catholic Tradition. As soon as Rome comes back to the Truth -- as it will -- Rome will rise again, to the joy of us all. Equally, if the Society turns unfaithful to Tradition, it will inevitably and deservedly fall. But "fear not, little flock," as Our Lord told us, "your Father knoweth that you have need of all these things" (Lk XII, 3; Mt VI, 32). Souls seeking God will never be left without the means of finding Him. That is because God created the whole world only for souls to come to Him. And that is why, as Our Lord on Palm Sunday told the Pharisees who were angry at his disciples crying out Hosanna to the Son of David, if all human beings were to stop crying out the Truth, the very stones of the street would rise up to proclaim it. (Lk XIX, 40)

    This Rome may then -- worst-case scenario -- succeed in reducing the Society of St. Pius X to paralysis and silence, but if it did, that would only be a just judgment of God, and the Truth would be upheld elsewhere. What does the Society presently deserve? Time will tell.

    Personally, I think that in the United States, in France, in fact all over the world, most Society priests are quietly working at ground level to sanctify and to save souls, that such real and humble work is blessed by God, and so I think most Society priests – and the laity who are with them -- will be protected by God from falling in with Roman corruption. However, even if I am right this time around, there will certainly be a next attack on the Society from the Devil or from his Rome, and since these days are such that if they were not shortened, even the elect would not be saved, then I do not know if the Society will survive in its present form all the way until that shortening of these evil days.

    BUT IT DOES NOT MATTER WHETHER IT WILL OR NOT, WHETHER I KNOW OR NOT. I do not have to worry today about the problems of tomorrow --"Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof" (Mt VI, 34). Let me be the best Catholic that I can, day by day, and the rest I can leave in God's hands. The rest is HIS problem!

    Dear readers, spring is not far off when one can look around and say with the poet:

    "The world is so full of such wonderful things,
    Why can't we all be just as happy as kings?"

    Nobody will be able to do away with God, however hard they try. So let us by all means pray for the Society of St. Pius X, because things will be that much easier if it does hold up. But at the same time, let us be prepared, if it goes the way of all flesh, not to be stricken with panic. "God alone suffices" -- St. Terese of Avila.

    May He love you and bless you.

    In Christ,

    + Richard Williamson


    Thanks very much for producing this letter, Pius IX!!!. I remember in one one those Triumph Communications tapes Bp W made many years ago he said that were there to be a restoration, all the present holders of office in the Conciliar Church - at that time Wojtyla, Ratzinger & the whole pack of them - WOULD BE GIVEN THE BOOT!

    Online Francisco

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1150
    • Reputation: +843/-18
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #13 on: March 05, 2013, 10:02:10 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Cristera
    What is recorded on Non Possumus is the interview with Bishop Williamson. Father Ceriani uses everything the bishop says to attack him.
    He is obsessed. Radio Cristiandad attack everything posted on Non Possumus because this blog defends the Bishop. They analize every single word to find something to attack His Lordship.
    They attacked also the Father Raphael declaration. They attack everything, that's why non possumus is quoted on Radio Cristiandad very often.

    Father Ceriani thinks he is the only one priest of the word who defends the true Catholic Faith.


    If this is true then Mathew should put Radio Cristiandad in the same category as Traditio. Whatever Bp Williamson's secular views may be he is solid on matters of the Faith. Because he wouldn't budge he was kicked out by Fellay.

    Offline trento

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 772
    • Reputation: +206/-136
    • Gender: Male
    Allegation: Bp. W against practical accord with Rome only from 2010 on
    « Reply #14 on: March 05, 2013, 11:30:35 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Cristera
    What is recorded on Non Possumus is the interview with Bishop Williamson. Father Ceriani uses everything the bishop says to attack him.
    He is obsessed. Radio Cristiandad attack everything posted on Non Possumus because this blog defends the Bishop. They analize every single word to find something to attack His Lordship.
    They attacked also the Father Raphael declaration. They attack everything, that's why non possumus is quoted on Radio Cristiandad very often.

    Father Ceriani thinks he is the only one priest of the word who defends the true Catholic Faith.


    I would group Fr. Ceriani together with Fr. Soliman. They left the Society because they do not agree with +Fellay on accepting the lifting of the excommunications (even though it was not exactly as what +Fellay asked for, i.e. nullifying the excommunications).