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Author Topic: Vaccines - Devil's Advocate  (Read 12018 times)

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Re: Vaccines - Devil's Advocate
« Reply #45 on: December 15, 2020, 02:08:45 PM »
This is correct. If only half of Trad Catholics were to realize this, then we would be able to start resisting these evil plots now and see some results. But if we do nothing then it will not take too long before we are sitting in our prison cell, or hiding in the forest wishing we stood up against these criminals when we had a chance.
Yes.  It seems like some are waiting for Big Brother to say, "Deny Jesus Christ, or we'll kill you!", but comply with everything up to that point. The devil learned long ago to be a little more subtle than that.  

Quote
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn:

“And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have
been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make
an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to
say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as
for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire
city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror
at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase,
but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up
in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes,
hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?... The Organs would very
quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and,
notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have
ground to a halt! If...if...We didn't love freedom enough. And even more
– we had no awareness of the real situation.... We purely and simply
deserved everything that happened afterward.”

Re: Vaccines - Devil's Advocate
« Reply #46 on: December 15, 2020, 02:20:56 PM »
Yes.  It seems like some are waiting for Big Brother to say, "Deny Jesus Christ, or we'll kill you!", but comply with everything up to that point. The devil learned long ago to be a little more subtle than that.  
It’s like the ‘pinch’ of incense. 
Sounds like a lot of the arguments here are whether it’s a pinch, a cup or bucket of incense being offered. Why have so many forgotten it only took a ‘pinch’? Why is so much thought given to how much? Or what brand? Or the exact ingredients of? Or who gives it? And so on..


Re: Vaccines - Devil's Advocate
« Reply #47 on: December 15, 2020, 02:42:08 PM »
It’s like the ‘pinch’ of incense.
Sounds like a lot of the arguments here are whether it’s a pinch, a cup or bucket of incense being offered. Why have so many forgotten it only took a ‘pinch’? Why is so much thought given to how much? Or what brand? Or the exact ingredients of? Or who gives it? And so on..
I suspect it is because it is easier to find a loop-hole to compromise with what everyone agrees is wrong and live a "new-normal" life, rather than take some sort of physical action that will be hard, uncomfortable, costly in time and money or (depending on the action) dangerous.

For starters, I recommend everyone print this and give to your sheriff: Microsoft Word - Sheriffs Handbook (nationallibertyalliance.org) For those that are brave, it is better to meet the sheriff in person with a small group of supporters.

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Re: Vaccines - Devil's Advocate
« Reply #48 on: December 15, 2020, 03:24:56 PM »

Quote
Sounds like a lot of the arguments here are whether it’s a pinch, a cup or bucket of incense being offered. Why have so many forgotten it only took a ‘pinch’? Why is so much thought given to how much? Or what brand? Or the exact ingredients of? Or who gives it?

These are complex questions.  A pinch of incense is a sin against Faith; a vaccine is a sin against the natural law.  Not apples-oranges.
.
I reiterate my "3rd Problem".  If a vaccine is a moral cooperation with the abortion industry and not allowed then...why is buying slave labor goods from communist china not a cooperation with atheism and catholic persecution?  The 4 bishops allow cooperation with communism, but say cooperation with abortion is a GREATER sin?  Makes no sense.

Re: Vaccines - Devil's Advocate
« Reply #49 on: December 15, 2020, 03:46:49 PM »
Are Fr’s Copenhagen and Wolf saying that the remote material cooperation argument is erroneous and inadmissible, because, since one who would take the vaccine implicitly wills to benefit from that ongoing theft/sin, and therefore this cooperation is actually direct and formal (not remote or material)?

I don’t recall either using the term “formal,” but that seems to be the implication of their argument.

This is a very strong argument, and I think the burden now shifts to those who are defending the permissibility of receiving abortive vaccines in reliance upon remote material cooperation in evil to explain how/why the ongoing theft of cells is not direct and formal cooperation.
Why don't they just come out and say it then?  So far not one traditional priest comes out and says it...WHY?