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Author Topic: 2022 SSPX US transfers  (Read 8839 times)

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Offline Comrade

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Re: 2022 SSPX US transfers
« Reply #105 on: June 23, 2022, 10:34:20 AM »
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  • It's a scandal that we have to rely on hearsay to know whether someone has been conditionally ordained.  This should all be published publicly on the SSPX website.  There's been a long history in the SSPX, predating the neo-SSPX of performing conditional ordinations in a "hush hush" manner.

    There was a time in the mid-1990s where a mysterious "priest" (Father/Mr. Belland) showed up at STAS and was offering Mass at the main altar.  Both my brother Steve and I went digging to find out who he was ordained by.  He was in fact a Novus Ordo "priest".  But after digging we found that there was a secretive conditional ordination ceremony done.  We only found out by word of mouth from the sacristan who set up the bishop's chapel for the conditional.

    But that was not always the case, as in some instances the NO presider refused conditional ordination ... at which point he should have been shown the door.  In fact the case of one "Father" Stark was a huge reason for the split of The Nine.  Tragically, Archbishop Lefebvre sided with Stark and allowed him to continue simulating Mass at SSPX chapels and instead showed the Traditional priests the door for refusing to accept that.  No, the split of The Nine was NOT about sedevacantism, as is popularly (and incorrectly) believed.

    That's all due to politics with the Novus Ordo.  We can't say that the NO Rite of Ordination is doubtful or possibly invalid because that would be to impugn the Conciliar "hierarchy".

    Of course, if there's no positive doubt, it's a sacrilege to perform even a conditional ordination.  But if a conditional ordination is permitted, then there's positive doubt, and it's REQUIRED to perform one before subjecting the faithful to such dubious priests.  So the faithful have a right to know.

    This nonsense has plagued the SSPX since its early days I'm afraid.

    One incident that does amuse me, however, is the conditional ordination of Father Carlos Casavantes.  It's amusing because he was "ordained" to the priesthood directly by JP2 in Rome.  :laugh1:

    It appears the Archbishop Lefebvre became a hardliner on the conditional ordination issue by 1988.

    https://dominicansavrille.us/questionable-priestly-ordinations-in-the-conciliar-church/

    Ecône, 28 oct. 1988

    Very dear Mr. Wilson,
    thank you very much for your kind letter. I agree with your desire to reordain conditionnaly these priests, and I have done this reordination many times.
    All sacraments from the modernists bishops or priests are doubtfull now.  The changes are increasing and their intentions are no more catholics.
    We are in the time of great apostasy.
    We need more and more bishops and priests very catholics.  It is necessary everywhere in the world.
    Thank you for the newspaper article from the Father Alvaro Antonio Perez Jesuit!
    We must pray and work hardly to extend the kingdom of Jesus-Christ.
    I pray for you and your lovely family.
    Devotly in Jesus and Mary.

    Marcel Lefebvre








    Offline Giovanni Berto

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    Re: 2022 SSPX US transfers
    « Reply #106 on: June 23, 2022, 03:01:38 PM »
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  • It appears the Archbishop Lefebvre became a hardliner on the conditional ordination issue by 1988.

    https://dominicansavrille.us/questionable-priestly-ordinations-in-the-conciliar-church/

    Ecône, 28 oct. 1988

    Very dear Mr. Wilson,
    thank you very much for your kind letter. I agree with your desire to reordain conditionnaly these priests, and I have done this reordination many times.
    All sacraments from the modernists bishops or priests are doubtfull now.  The changes are increasing and their intentions are no more catholics.
    We are in the time of great apostasy.
    We need more and more bishops and priests very catholics.  It is necessary everywhere in the world.
    Thank you for the newspaper article from the Father Alvaro Antonio Perez Jesuit!
    We must pray and work hardly to extend the kingdom of Jesus-Christ.
    I pray for you and your lovely family.
    Devotly in Jesus and Mary.

    Marcel Lefebvre
    It is a shame that he didn't fix what he didn't do before this date.


    Offline cath4ever

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    Re: 2022 SSPX US transfers
    « Reply #107 on: June 23, 2022, 04:21:12 PM »
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  • Any word on Fr. Deister of Our Lady Immaculate Church in Oak Park, IL?
    I think he is staying put, to the best of my knowledge.

    Offline cath4ever

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    Re: 2022 SSPX US transfers
    « Reply #108 on: June 23, 2022, 04:25:32 PM »
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  • It is a shame that he didn't fix what he didn't do before this date.
    I too am very concerned about Novus Ordo Priests functioning in the SSPX without being conditionally ordained.

    One other option some might have is that, if you're questioning whether a particular former Novus Ordo priest has been conditionally ordained, is to find some way to contact Bishop Williamson and ask him. Back when he was active in the SSPX I was told he "saw to" the conditional ordination of many of the Novus Ordo priests working with the society. He's obviously been out of the mainstream SSPX for a while now but if the former Novus Ordo Priest in question (such as Fr. Pieroni) has been in the SSPX for a while Bishop Williamson might have information on whether a conditional ordination was done; at least if he was the one to do it.

    Offline epiphany

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    Re: 2022 SSPX US transfers
    « Reply #109 on: June 23, 2022, 04:36:08 PM »
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  • I too am very concerned about Novus Ordo Priests functioning in the SSPX without being conditionally ordained.

    One other option some might have is that, if you're questioning whether a particular former Novus Ordo priest has been conditionally ordained, is to find some way to contact Bishop Williamson and ask him. Back when he was active in the SSPX I was told he "saw to" the conditional ordination of many of the Novus Ordo priests working with the society. He's obviously been out of the mainstream SSPX for a while now but if the former Novus Ordo Priest in question (such as Fr. Pieroni) has been in the SSPX for a while Bishop Williamson might have information on whether a conditional ordination was done; at least if he was the one to do it.
    Any priest who refuses to tell you his lineage is a priest to stay away from.


    Offline Comrade

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    Re: 2022 SSPX US transfers
    « Reply #110 on: June 23, 2022, 04:50:01 PM »
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  • I too am very concerned about Novus Ordo Priests functioning in the SSPX without being conditionally ordained.

    One other option some might have is that, if you're questioning whether a particular former Novus Ordo priest has been conditionally ordained, is to find some way to contact Bishop Williamson and ask him. Back when he was active in the SSPX I was told he "saw to" the conditional ordination of many of the Novus Ordo priests working with the society. He's obviously been out of the mainstream SSPX for a while now but if the former Novus Ordo Priest in question (such as Fr. Pieroni) has been in the SSPX for a while Bishop Williamson might have information on whether a conditional ordination was done; at least if he was the one to do it.
    Why don't you just email Fr. Pieroni? If you one S>S>P>X priest email, you can easily guess what it is.

    Offline HeavyHanded

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    Re: 2022 SSPX US transfers
    « Reply #111 on: June 23, 2022, 07:19:02 PM »
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  • Why don't you just email Fr. Pieroni? If you one S>S>P>X priest email, you can easily guess what it is.
    Or just call him at the priory (203) 431-0201. I believe his extension is #29.