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Author Topic: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?  (Read 9614 times)

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Offline trento

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Offline SeanJohnson

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Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2023, 08:23:51 AM »
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  • Two notable points from this article:

    1) The holy oils consecrated (?) by Huonder will be for use in Europe.

    I wonder if any European SSPX priests will prefer to receive certainly valid oils from +Faure instead?


    2) “If and when the SSPX decides to move ahead with consecrations, it may be that a retired bishop on a mission from the Pope follows in the footsteps of Lefebvre.

    Preparing the terrain for Huonder to “consecrate?”
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #2 on: April 29, 2023, 09:45:49 AM »
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  • I found this statement from Fr. Pagliarani to be striking:
    Quote
    This meeting made it possible to show that the SSPX has no other goal than to serve the Church in the midst of the current crisis. Fr. Pagliarani had the opportunity to make it clear to the Pope that everything the Society does has only this service in mind. Mutual good memories of Argentina were also exchanged… Let us not fail to pray for the ecclesiastical authorities and especially for Pope Francis. Through these prayers, may Catholic Tradition regain all its rights in the Church, so that as many souls as possible may benefit and work out their eternal salvation.

    So Tradition needs have "rights in the Church".  What?, right alongside the rights that Modernism has in the Church?  This is the old mindset of allowing Tradition to take its place within the Conciliar pantheon.  It's a total sellout, putting Tradition into the entire relativist Vatican II framework.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #3 on: April 29, 2023, 09:58:32 AM »
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  • I found this statement from Fr. Pagliarani to be striking:
    So Tradition needs have "rights in the Church".  What?, right alongside the rights that Modernism has in the Church?  This is the old mindset of allowing Tradition to take its place within the Conciliar pantheon.  It's a total sellout, putting Tradition into the entire relativist Vatican II framework.

    Recall +Fellay in Letter #63 about the Campos sellout:

    "...it is primarily because of the pluralist and ecuмenical vision of things now prevailing in the Catholic world. According to this vision, everybody is to mix together without anybody needing any longer to convert...From such a standpoint there will even be a little room for Catholic Tradition, but for our part we cannot accept this vision of variable truth any more than a mathematics teacher can accept a variable multiplication table...The ambiguity implicit here has become more or less normal in the new situation in which they find themselves...The great danger here is that in the end one gets used to the situation as it is, and no longer tries to remedy it"

    https://fsspx.asia/en/publications/letters/january-2003-superior-generals-letter-63-798
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #4 on: April 29, 2023, 10:01:08 AM »
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  • Recall +Fellay in Letter #63 about the Campos sellout:

    "...it is primarily because of the pluralist and ecuмenical vision of things now prevailing in the Catholic world. According to this vision, everybody is to mix together without anybody needing any longer to convert...From such a standpoint there will even be a little room for Catholic Tradition, but for our part we cannot accept this vision of variable truth any more than a mathematics teacher can accept a variable multiplication table...The ambiguity implicit here has become more or less normal in the new situation in which they find themselves...The great danger here is that in the end one gets used to the situation as it is, and no longer tries to remedy it"

    https://fsspx.asia/en/publications/letters/january-2003-superior-generals-letter-63-798

    Yes, something happened to +Fellay somewhere along the road ... which many have traced to the arrival of Krah on the scene.

    When someone speaks about the rights of Tradition WITHIN the Church (as if the Church were something broader than Tradition), not only has one gotten "used to it" and is no longer attempting to remedy it, but those statements actively LEGITIMIZE the V2 framework.

    Everyone has gotten used to the Conciliar mindset and have given up on remedying it short of God's direct intervention, but legitimizing it is quite another thing, which is what Father Pagliarani was doing with that statement.


    Online B from A

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #5 on: April 29, 2023, 10:35:46 AM »
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  • Recall +Fellay in Letter #63 about the Campos sellout:

    "...it is primarily because of the pluralist and ecuмenical vision of things now prevailing in the Catholic world. According to this vision, everybody is to mix together without anybody needing any longer to convert...From such a standpoint there will even be a little room for Catholic Tradition, but for our part we cannot accept this vision of variable truth any more than a mathematics teacher can accept a variable multiplication table...The ambiguity implicit here has become more or less normal in the new situation in which they find themselves...The great danger here is that in the end one gets used to the situation as it is, and no longer tries to remedy it"

    https://fsspx.asia/en/publications/letters/january-2003-superior-generals-letter-63-798

    And it's like his "zoo" comparison:


    Quote
    Their perspective is pluralism. Their thinking goes something like this: "Oh, look, if we have progressive people who do silly things as members of the Church, then we should also have a place for those who like tradition–a place in the middle of this circus, of this zoo, a place for dinosaurs and the prehistoric animals"–that's our place (!). "But just stay in your zoo cage," they will train us, ...


    Online Mark 79

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #6 on: April 29, 2023, 12:57:26 PM »
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  • I found this statement from Fr. Pagliarani to be striking:
    So Tradition needs have "rights in the Church".  What?, right alongside the rights that Modernism has in the Church?  This is the old mindset of allowing Tradition to take its place within the Conciliar pantheon.  It's a total sellout, putting Tradition into the entire relativist Vatican II framework.
    Nailed that.
    In the neo-SSPX Truth has subsidiarity to lies.

    Offline Kazimierz

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #7 on: April 29, 2023, 02:26:33 PM »
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  • Quote
    Their perspective is pluralism. Their thinking goes something like this: "Oh, look, if we have progressive people who do silly things as members of the Church, then we should also have a place for those who like tradition–a place in the middle of this circus, of this zoo, a place for dinosaurs and the prehistoric animals"–that's our place (!). "But just stay in your zoo cage," they will train us, ...
    There are those that would wish that we souls of Tradition be part of the Conciliar Roman menagerie

    Huonder is the Talosian who baits us with the illusion of a pretty woman (conciliar bait and switch) Then the trap is sprung.
    (Star Trek metaphors jumped into mind after reading the above quote) :smirk:

    What a pretty specimen we would make....





    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster


    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #8 on: April 29, 2023, 06:42:18 PM »
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  • "Beam me up, Scotty!  There's no orthodoxy left in the sspx!"

    p.s.  One wonders if Star Trek's "beam" technology is what prompted the popularization of the protestant "rapture" fantasy.  Do they think God will "beam them up" to heaven once things get bad?  :laugh2::laugh1::laugh2:

    Offline Plenus Venter

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #9 on: April 29, 2023, 07:50:44 PM »
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  • Fr Pagliarani's latest letter to F&B.
    Letter to friends and benefactors of the SSPX 92: The purity of the Heart - FSSPX.Actualités / FSSPX.News
    No mention of episcopal consecrations for the SSPX.
    Surely there will be no new bishops in June now.

    Offline Kazimierz

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #10 on: April 29, 2023, 07:54:27 PM »
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  • "Beam me up, Scotty!  There's no orthodoxy left in the sspx!"

    p.s.  One wonders if Star Trek's "beam" technology is what prompted the popularization of the protestant "rapture" fantasy.  Do they think God will "beam them up" to heaven once things get bad?  :laugh2::laugh1::laugh2:
    :cowboy::laugh1:
    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster


    Offline trento

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #11 on: April 30, 2023, 08:36:56 AM »
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  • Yes, something happened to +Fellay somewhere along the road ... which many have traced to the arrival of Krah on the scene.

    When someone speaks about the rights of Tradition WITHIN the Church (as if the Church were something broader than Tradition), not only has one gotten "used to it" and is no longer attempting to remedy it, but those statements actively LEGITIMIZE the V2 framework.

    Everyone has gotten used to the Conciliar mindset and have given up on remedying it short of God's direct intervention, but legitimizing it is quite another thing, which is what Father Pagliarani was doing with that statement.

    +Lefebvre: "let us perform the experiment of Tradition"

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #12 on: April 30, 2023, 08:47:05 AM »
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  • +Lefebvre: "let us perform the experiment of Tradition"
    …before he realized Rome was in bad faith (even during the time of BXVI, as +Gamswein’s revelationmakes clear).
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline trento

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #13 on: April 30, 2023, 09:17:54 AM »
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  • …before he realized Rome was in bad faith (even during the time of BXVI, as +Gamswein’s revelationmakes clear).

    If concessions are granted to the SSPX unilaterally, there is no need for the SSPX to concede anything.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: 1Peter5: Is the SSPX About to Consecrate New Bishops?
    « Reply #14 on: April 30, 2023, 10:33:24 AM »
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  • If concessions are granted to the SSPX unilaterally, there is no need for the SSPX to concede anything.

    Nothing unilateral about them (and a whole slough of SSPX concessions):

    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."