Baptism of Desire and Feeneyism / Re: Can one be Justified and not be in a state of Sanctifying Grace?« Last post by Last Tradhican on Today at 07:33:00 AM »
The BODers ask the question, what happens to a person that is justified before they are baptized, then dies. The answer is that they can't be truly justified except through baptism.It is just common sense if one understands that our conversion and our faith is totally a gift from God. He gives us the knowledge and the impulse to do every milimeter of move in His direction. Why would God "justify" a person before baptism and then pull the rug out from him? It is a ridiculous question, and exactly what I've been saying for years.
The Ridiculous Question:
What happens to a person who is "justified" before he is baptized, then dies before baptism?
(The ludicrous response, the response of 99.99% of the false BODers just shows the insanity the question leads to: Jews, Mohamedans, Hindus, Buddhists etc. can be saved by their belief in a rewarder god.
and rightly St. Augustine called it the vortex of confusion:
St. Augustine on the Errors of Pelagius said:
If you wish to be a catholic, do not venture to believe, to say, or to teach that “they whom the Lord has predestinated for baptism can be snatched away from his predestination, or die before that has been accomplished in them which the Almighty has predestined.” There is in such a dogma more power than I can tell assigned to chances in opposition to the power of God, by the occurrence of which casualties that which He has predestinated is not permitted to come to pass. It is hardly necessary to spend time or earnest words in cautioning the man who takes up with this error against the absolute vortex of confusion into which it will absorb him, when I shall sufficiently meet the case if I briefly warn the prudent man who is ready to receive correction against the threatening mischief. Now these are your words: “We say that some such method as this must be had recourse to in the case of infants who, being predestinated for baptism, are yet, by the failing of this life, hurried away before they are born again in Christ.” Is it then really true that any who have been predestinated to baptism are forestalled before they come to it by the failing of this life? And could God predestinate anything which He either in His foreknowledge saw would not come to pass, or in ignorance knew not that it could not come to pass, either to the frustration of His purpose or the discredit of His foreknowledge? You see how many weighty remarks might be made on this subject; but I am restrained by the fact of having treated on it a little while ago, so that I content myself with this brief and passing admonition.