Yes, Boru, denying the Immaculate Conception, perpetual virginity, and Assumption of Our Lady is an attack on her, the Church, the Faith, and God. Over 100k people watched that video of Kirk denying those Dogmas, how many of them went away from that video confirmed in their error? I don't give a shit how politely he couched his heresies, they were all the more subtle and dangerous given how he prefaced them by paying lip service to some of Our Lady's admirable traits. What person "close to conversion" would leave that video up on their YouTube channel? How "close to conversion" does someone need to be to realize the tremendous damage he has done by spreading his heretical and blasphemous views across the years to millions of people, and make a public apology and retraction of said errors? How "close to conversion" does someone need to be to reject a false blessing from a female minister? To know not to praise the Mormons and say we need a strong Mormon Church in the US?

Evidence continues to come out..real, actual evidence..that shows that Kirk was in no ways a Catholic, or "near Catholic", in the months, weeks, and days leading up to his death. Meanwhile, you are forced to rely on the same couple bits of HEARSAY to support your ridiculous claims of there being "every possibility" of Kirk being saved..and even a martyr. This hearsay being how you justify defending and minimizing Kirk's heretical and blasphemous words and actions. Like I said, there is something seriously wrong with you

And any "Catholics" you have witnessed receive blessings from non-Catholic ministers or whoever else were just as Catholic as Kirk, that should be a given to any honest, "trad" Catholic.

My "ilk" and I understand the necessity of belonging to the Mystical Body of Christ in order to be saved. You and your ilk deny a thrice defined Dogma of the Faith, you deny that Kirk was given sufficient grace and time to actually become a member of the Church prior to his death. You and your ilk achieve nothing other than being in part responsible for the damnation of souls

Worldsaway - Charlie Kirk was a Protestant. He had a protestant outlook. I am not denying or disputing that. What I have been disputing is your (and other posters') tendency to make his words sound worse than they are. You are not reporting honestly and I don't like that. You're fueling a witch hunt. That is what I'm disputing.

What I'm suggesting - note the distinction - is that given that there was a spiritual shift, from his previous thinking, towards Catholicism - a softening, an interest - it gives one hope that he was not damned. God judges the spirit - the sincerity of a soul - and this is backed by scripture: 1 Corinthians 1-13.

This clearly means a man may possess great faith and even spiritual gifts, but without charity, he is considered nothing. This emphasizes the importance of love as the greatest virtue in life. I concede that Charlie's love was misguided and ecuмenical. But it was there and according to the testimonies of his friends, he applied it minutely to his everyday day life. He even tweeted - May 9th "If the new Pope defends the faith, defends the West, defends biology and eternal truths, I will be his greatest fan." The backstory to this is Kirk had a real problem with Pope Francis and his 'Liberation Marxist theology' to use Charlie's words. This hindered his conversion.

You may be right, he may be hell. But he also could be in purgatory. I repeat, people - especially Protestants who are brought up to believe it is superstitious Popish devotion - who start saying the daily rosary will not be damned. I believe that with all my heart. Our Lady will intervene. Would he be saved as a Protestant? No. But I firmly believe Our Lady intervened (rewarded) and gained him the graces to become a Catholic in an instance. I cannot prove it and he had made no declaration for the Catholic faith. But markers indicate that a Catholic love was there; that he desired to embrace the truth and was open to being convinced. Our prayers, offered up now, can help win him that miraculously grace for God lives in the eternal present, as St. Padre Pio teaches. Why would you not want to at least try to help save his soul? Why are you so intent on having him damned. To my mind, that is extremely disturbing.

...............
1. Kirk showed a love for Mary. False. He blasphemed her in the video.

**Kirk was a Protestant. He did not realise he is blaspheming. I'm a Catholic and I did not realise it was consider a blasphemy by the Church.

2. Kirk had been praying a daily rosary. No evidence. And taken with #1 extremely unlikely.

** His friends testify he was saying the rosary daily. You do not know that their testimony is false. You are just deciding it is.

3. Kirk had his marriage convalidated days before the Utah appearance. No evidence. And not a conversion.

** I will return to this. Meanwhile, if its true, its a good marker; an indication.

4. Kirk showed appreciation for the Catholic Faith. False. He denigrated the Faith in the the Mary video.

** There were areas he struggled with. Again his friends say he was interested and became more interested in the weeks leading up to his death. The Mary video is a month old.

5. Kirk showed signs of conversion. False. He was participating in Protestant events up to his death.

** So do many Catholics. Given how ecuмenical the Catholic hierarchy is, would you expect anything different from a converting Protestant?

...you keep ignoring what the Church has always taught about the danger of scandal in suggesting that public, notorious heretics can be saved. The Church denies a Catholic funeral and the publicizing of any prayers for them. You ignore the Church dogma and laws. You tell anyone and everyone who will listen that you are praying for him.

**Context. Please name me the doctrine that says I, as an individual, cannot pray for a Protestant's soul?

... Can you not understand that it is false charity if it contradicts the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church teaching? .............

** How do I contradict it?

Instead ask yourself, why have those influencers (like Owens) been pushing this false narrative? Why was the Kirk Mary video released with the blasphemies removed? Why have certain Novus Ordo "authorities" claimed Kirk did this and that with no objective proof? In short, why are these people bent on manipulating Catholics specifically?

** Who says that Candace's narrative is false? Who claims that any of the narratives in Kirk's favor are false? You have no proof they are false. So yes, you are on a witch hunt.

Quote ...............
1. Kirk showed a love for Mary. False. He blasphemed her in the video.

**Kirk was a Protestant. He did not realise he is blaspheming. I'm a Catholic and I did not realise it was consider a blasphemy by the Church.

2. Kirk had been praying a daily rosary. No evidence. And taken with #1 extremely unlikely.

** His friends testify he was saying the rosary daily. You do not know that their testimony is false. You are just deciding it is.

3. Kirk had his marriage convalidated days before the Utah appearance. No evidence. And not a conversion.

** I will return to this. Meanwhile, if its true, its a good marker; an indication.

4. Kirk showed appreciation for the Catholic Faith. False. He denigrated the Faith in the the Mary video.

** There were areas he struggled with. Again his friends say he was interested and became more interested in the weeks leading up to his death. The Mary video is a month old.

5. Kirk showed signs of conversion. False. He was participating in Protestant events up to his death.

** So do many Catholics. Given how ecuмenical the Catholic hierarchy is, would you expect anything differentfrom a converting Protestant?

...you keep ignoring what the Church has always taught about the danger of scandal in suggesting that public, notorious heretics can be saved. The Church denies a Catholic funeral and the publicizing of any prayers for them. You ignore the Church dogma and laws. You tell anyone and everyone who will listen that you are praying for him.

**Context. Please name me the doctrine that says I, as an individual, cannot pray for a Protestant's soul?

... Can you not understand that it is false charity if it contradicts the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church teaching? .............

** How do I contradict it?

Instead ask yourself, why have those influencers (like Owens) been pushing this false narrative? Why was the Kirk Mary video released with the blasphemies removed? Why have certain Novus Ordo "authorities" claimed Kirk did this and that with no objective proof? In short, why are these people bent on manipulating Catholics specifically?

** Who says that Candace's narrative is false? Who claims that any of the narratives in Kirk's favor are false? You have no proof they are false. So yes, you are on a witch hunt.

2160. The Persons for Whom Prayer Is Offered.—There is an obligation of charity to pray for ourselves and also for others, for we should ask for the things that we are obliged to desire (see 2161). This duty is taught in Holy Scripture (e.g., Our Lord prayed for Peter; St. Paul asks for the prayers of his Churches; St. James, in v. 16, admonishes us to pray for one another that we may be saved); also in the creed and liturgy of the Church, for we profess belief in the communion of saints, and offer Masses and suffrages for the living and the dead. One should pray for enemies in common prayers that are offered for all, and in special prayers for them in particular, when there is a special reason, such as their grave necessity or the scandal that would be given if one refused to join in a special prayer for one’s enemy (Matt., v. 44); but one may not pray for the success of the evil projects of an enemy, and one is not obliged to make special prayers for him apart from necessity (see 1151). For the excommunicated one should pray in private prayers and also in public prayers, when this is permitted by the law, as in the services of Good Friday and under certain conditions in Masses (Canon 2262). For sinners prayers should be said, unless they are already lost. The souls in Purgatory are also to be prayed for, although the obligation does not seem grave, since it is not certain as to any particular soul that it is in need of our prayers. As to the blessed, one may pray for their canonization or accidental glory, not for their essential glory, which they already possess.

...

This tells me that while the Church is obliged to refrain from offering public prayers for a soul who dies a non-Catholic,  we the individual can pray for them and have private Masses said for them.

Canon 2262 (1983 CIC 1331, 1335)

§ 1. One excommunicated is not able to participate in the indulgences, suffrages, and public prayers of the Church.

§ 2. Nevertheless, it is not prohibited:

1.° For the faithful to pray privately for him;
2.° For priests privately and avoiding scandal to apply Mass for him; but, if he is banned, only for his conversion.

Below is the section from 1917 Canon Law that states the same thing.


And notice that the language says it is "not prohibited." This implies that it is "not encouraged." But it is lawful to do it.