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Author Topic: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?  (Read 1836 times)

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Offline graceseeker

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Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
« on: December 19, 2017, 01:07:23 PM »
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    • Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?


    I wouldn't blame you one bit


    I sorta am


    I wonder sometimes if that is why a lot of veterans end their lives.. They go "over there" to fight for what they are told is a just cause (and often is that) only to come home and find


    corruption in government


    not a lot of appreciation for the sacrifice they made


    and other problems, not the least of which is PTSD, something I also have (there are all kinds of "wars")

    this country is like all others at least in this one way:

    rich and powerful get more rich and powerful

    the disadvantaged are shunned and looked down upon, thrown a few crumbs from the pig trough and told to go away "you aren't important" (unless you sell yourself to the Green God like all the rest of us have)

    "And that's the way it is"

    same old, same old

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    Offline Meg

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #1 on: December 19, 2017, 02:03:47 PM »
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    • There is bound to be corruption in government, for mainly two reasons that I can see (just my opinion here).

    The first has to do with fallen human nature. And the second has to do with the issue of our country not ever officially adopting the Catholic stance of the Social Reign of Christ the King. 

    The non-Catholic founding fathers of this country presumably wanted a place where men are free to make their own way - self determination, and I think that religion falls into that category as well. They seemed to think that if men are free to determine what is true or not, that they would make the right decisions, and do the right thing. They didn't take into account original sin. We need Truth to guide us so that we can make the right moral decisions. If truth is relative, which freedom of religion encourages, then really there is no such thing as absolute truth. 

    But we as Catholics do believe that there is such thing as absolute truth. The Apostles were told by Our Lord to go out and convert all nations. He said "nations." 

    We see now how the methodology of the non-Catholic founding fathers was wrong. 

    Also, unbridled capitalism (an form of Marxism, IMO) leads to the servile state, as Hilaire Belloc wrote, where corporations rule, and private ownership of business and property decreases). That has created a lot of problems, too. 
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    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #2 on: December 19, 2017, 03:25:49 PM »
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    • Quote from: graceseeker on December 19, 2017, 01:07:23 PM
    Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?


    I wouldn't blame you one bit


    I sorta am
    It's not a bad thing to get rid of your illusions, as long as it leads you to seek out Truth.
    Disillusionment can be a rich blessing. Make the best of it by finding better things to put your trust in. Stop blaming others for your problems and put your trust in God rather than possessions and position. Be thankful!
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    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    Offline Marcelino

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #3 on: December 20, 2017, 02:50:55 AM »
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    • Thomas Jefferson, Andrew Jackson and John F. Kennedy fought to keep America truly free.  I don't think they would want us to give up on that, just because a few of the same old thieves that they struggled with had gotten the upper hand for a little while.  



    1942 Fred Waring - This Is My Country (Glee Club, vocal)


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    Offline graceseeker

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #4 on: December 20, 2017, 04:46:36 PM »
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    • Quote from: Nadir on December 19, 2017, 03:25:49 PM
    It's not a bad thing to get rid of your illusions, as long as it leads you to seek out Truth.
    Disillusionment can be a rich blessing. Make the best of it by finding better things to put your trust in. Stop blaming others for your problems and put your trust in God rather than possessions and position. Be thankful!
    I don't appreciate being accused of blaming others
    If I blame others, u can rest assured it is THEIR fault
    I blame myself for what is MY "wrongdoing" or whatever. So.. don't appreciate the accusation. Are you an Accuser of the Brethren? 
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    Offline Marcelino

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #5 on: December 21, 2017, 08:53:06 PM »
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    • I think we owe a similar fidelity to our country as we do to our parents.  So, even if our parents did some bad things, we should still honor them.  


    Kate Smith God Bless American 1938 Best Copy Ever

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    Offline insidebaseball

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #6 on: December 21, 2017, 08:58:13 PM »
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    • I thought this might help. Blessed Christmas to you
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    Offline Marcelino

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #7 on: December 21, 2017, 09:09:32 PM »
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    • Gratitude is important and I think Prager explains it well, but it is impossible to miss the irony of him talking about playing the victim and a sense of entitlement  :laugh1:
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    Offline Marlelar

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #8 on: December 21, 2017, 11:15:48 PM »
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    • I love my country, but fear my government.  So no, I will never give up on America.
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    Offline Marcelino

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #9 on: December 22, 2017, 12:35:46 AM »
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    • Ac-Cent-Tchu-Ate The Positive - Bing Crosby with The Andrews Sisters
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    Offline klasG4e

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #10 on: December 23, 2017, 04:57:41 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marcelino on December 20, 2017, 02:50:55 AM
    Thomas Jefferson, Andrew Jackson and John F. Kennedy fought to keep America truly free.  I don't think they would want us to give up on that, just because a few of the same old thieves that they struggled with had gotten the upper hand for a little while.  



    1942 Fred Waring - This Is My Country (Glee Club, vocal)
    Tom Jefferson?!  Poor old Tom -- he was an avid anti-Catholic Deist who made up his own version of the Gospels from which he omitted the virgin birth of Jesus, miracles attributed to Jesus, Christ's divinity, the resurrection of Jesus and on and on.
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    Offline Marcelino

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #11 on: December 23, 2017, 06:11:25 PM »
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    • Quote from: klasG4e on December 23, 2017, 04:57:41 PM
    Tom Jefferson?!  Poor old Tom -- he was an avid anti-Catholic Deist who made up his own version of the Gospels from which he omitted the virgin birth of Jesus, miracles attributed to Jesus, Christ's divinity, the resurrection of Jesus and on and on.
    Yeah well sorry, but it was a Protestant country.  However, Thomas Jefferson tried to keep the banks from taking over America, like they had taken over England and JFK was trying to do the same thing and probably was killed for it!  
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    Offline graceseeker

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #12 on: December 27, 2017, 04:50:08 PM »
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    • Quote from: Meg on December 19, 2017, 02:03:47 PM
    There is bound to be corruption in government, for mainly two reasons that I can see (just my opinion here).

    The first has to do with fallen human nature. And the second has to do with the issue of our country not ever officially adopting the Catholic stance of the Social Reign of Christ the King.

    The non-Catholic founding fathers of this country presumably wanted a place where men are free to make their own way - self determination, and I think that religion falls into that category as well. They seemed to think that if men are free to determine what is true or not, that they would make the right decisions, and do the right thing. They didn't take into account original sin. We need Truth to guide us so that we can make the right moral decisions. If truth is relative, which freedom of religion encourages, then really there is no such thing as absolute truth.

    But we as Catholics do believe that there is such thing as absolute truth. The Apostles were told by Our Lord to go out and convert all nations. He said "nations."

    We see now how the methodology of the non-Catholic founding fathers was wrong.

    Also, unbridled capitalism (an form of Marxism, IMO) leads to the servile state, as Hilaire Belloc wrote, where corporations rule, and private ownership of business and property decreases). That has created a lot of problems, too.
    well, I agree for the most part. I am a capitalist but not one for unfettered capitalism.
    I don't know what the answer is to the problem of the HUGE disparity between rich and poor. I am not a socialist or anything close to it.
    oh, another thing.. I don't think all or maybe even most of the Founders were neglecting to take into account our sinful nature. I think it was Hamilton who said that if we were angels we wouldn't need government and if we are not Christian or something like that.. the laws they make will be to no effect. Yeh, i know, I just butchered it but you get the gist.
    anyway... hmmm... Do u think we have unbridled capitalism to the point of.. servile state?
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    Offline graceseeker

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #13 on: December 27, 2017, 04:51:06 PM »
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    • Quote from: Nadir on December 19, 2017, 03:25:49 PM
    It's not a bad thing to get rid of your illusions, as long as it leads you to seek out Truth.
    Disillusionment can be a rich blessing. Make the best of it by finding better things to put your trust in. Stop blaming others for your problems and put your trust in God rather than possessions and position. Be thankful!
    I don't recall where I blamed others...
    just in attack mode?
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    Offline graceseeker

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    Re: Are you just totally disillusioned w/ America?
    « Reply #14 on: December 27, 2017, 04:53:01 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marcelino on December 23, 2017, 06:11:25 PM
    Yeah well sorry, but it was a Protestant country.  However, Thomas Jefferson tried to keep the banks from taking over America, like they had taken over England and JFK was trying to do the same thing and probably was killed for it!  
    at this time I don't buy the one gunman thing.. that Oswald acted entirely alone. I guess it's possible. but I have better things to do than go into details that the devil is in.
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