Author Topic: Women and "self-defense" classes.  (Read 6745 times)

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Offline Telesphorus

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Women and "self-defense" classes.
« on: October 28, 2011, 12:43:52 PM »
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  • I've noticed a lot of women seem to think martial arts and self-defense classes are useful.  I would say that anything that causes someone to seriously over-estimate their abilities in a self-defense situation is harmful.

    I would never assume I had a good chance taking on someone considerably bigger and stronger than me, who in all likelihood has the advantage of surprise.  It would be very foolhardly to go to places where one was at relatively high risk of assault without serious reasons.

    But women with self-defense classes often imagine they could defend themselves against a man - often with a magical belief in taking vicious shots at the groin or the eyes.  I would say, that's a good recipe for enraging the person you're dealing with, and possibly causing the loss of your own life.

    It would be better to carry a gun (or mace or a tazer), but again, the odds of getting yourself killed go up when you carry a gun.  A dog is good too. (but I will remark I find it very unattractive to see a woman walking a big dog.)  

    So doesn't that apply to men too?  Yes, it does, but men are better able to carry, conceal and use firearms, and it is important to remember the value of carrying a gun in self-defense if primarily one of deterrence.  Anyone putting themselves in a situation where they are likely to have to use their gun in self-defense is taking a terrible risk.

    So my recommendation to women who want to protect themselves.  Have an escort who is armed, and avoid dangerous areas and situations.  Avoid walking alone in areas away from the public.

    Those are my two cents - save your money and don't get scammed with "martial arts" for self-defense.

    Offline Stephen Francis

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #1 on: October 29, 2011, 09:12:25 AM »
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  • There was a time when women would never go anywhere without an escort... it was considered scandalous for a lady to be seen in public alone.

    It would be better if men and women of the Faith simply modeled the familial and societal roles that God has established rather than to have them working so hard to protect themselves against people and environments that they should have nothing to do with anyway.

    I've said it over and over, both on the forum and in my personal conversations... the reason there are no saints today is NOT because the Faith has changed; it's because 'conservative' or 'strict' these days, for the average Catholic, means 'conservative like my secular neighbors' or 'strict like the Protestants'.

    Conservatism by its modern definition is barely sufficient as a philosophy, ethically or morally, for a Catholic to live by. We are simply not called to ONLY be conservative; we are called to PUSH BACK against the tide of immorality and sin in the world.

    Strict morality, too, such as many conservative Protestant groups are known for, is, again, insufficient. I have seen dozens if not hundreds of professing Catholics at the homeschool conventions I have attended; they are all seeking the advice of the unconverted as to how to train their children in morality and habits.

    What else but compromise and failure COULD be the result? When we seek the knowledge of God's will from people who are possessed only of natural effort and natural affection for an IDEA of God, and who are not supernaturally reborn BY God, we find only frustration, as our natural efforts, like theirs, will surely run out and fall far short of what God intends for His Church.

    We are called to BE CATHOLIC, not just be better citizens than the average person.

    Our theology is different, the goal of our spiritual effort is different, the God we serve is not their God, no matter what they claim. Why wrestle with the world's problems on the world's level? We have meat and drink, as Our Lord said, that they know nothing about.

    Don't just not watch 'bad' TV... turn the thing off and pray the Rosary.

    Don't just not attend bad movies... make a 40 Hours devotion.

    Don't just abstain on Fridays... make the First Friday devotion and intentionally offer your sacrifice in reparation for the offenses to Our Lord's Sacred Heart.

    St. Dominic, pray for us.

    Immaculate Heart of Mary, triumph soon.

    Sacred Heart of Jesus, have mercy on us.
    This evil of heresy spreads itself. The doctrines of godliness are overturned; the rules of the Church are in confusion; the ambition of the unprincipled seizes upon places of authority; and the chief seat [the Papacy] is now openly proposed as a rewar


    Offline PenitentWoman

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #2 on: July 20, 2012, 07:33:29 AM »
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  • No matter how much you learn in the classes, what are the chances you could actually think that quickly during an assault?

    I have my manager or the bouncer walk me to my car after work at night even though we park really close.  
    ~For we are saved by hope. But hope that is seen, is not hope. For what a man seeth, why doth he hope for? But if we hope for that which we see not, we wait for it with patience. ~ Romans 8:24-25

    Offline MrsZ

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #3 on: July 20, 2012, 02:00:20 PM »
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  • I ended up with some "street smarts" mostly because I was raised in an environment where I had multiple approaches and fear-inducing situations occur to me when I was a child and young woman.  This eventually taught me fear and a strong desire for avoiding the situation.  

    I've taught my daughter the same thing and she has been very protected.  More than I ever was.  And yet she, maybe because of my teachings, has become interested in carrying a gun (something I've never considered, myself). She has pepper spray .. and we talk often about avoiding certain places and people.  I've told her to avoid going out at night (at all, or at least alone).  And to keep her eyes open at all times.  

    Sometimes I worry that I've made her too untrusting and that that's taken something away from her.  But we live in a dangerous world and I would rather her very cautious and alive .. rather than too trusting and have something terrible happen.

    Offline Tiffany

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #4 on: July 20, 2012, 03:41:15 PM »
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  • Most women I know to do martial arts got involved because their children were. They view it as exercise, not  self defense.


    Offline Antony

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #5 on: July 20, 2012, 07:46:22 PM »
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  • I have taken martial arts courses on and off my whole life and have done self study of military hand to hand combat.  I have done this mainly because I love martial arts.  I stay away from places, though, that are into eastern religious stuff and/or places where overtly immoral people attend.  That is why I do a lot of self study.

    Now, to put it bluntly, most women could not fend off an assailant who was intent on doing them harm unless they reacted fast by screaming, running away, or landing a chin jab or something then running away or doing all of the above.  As one who has been in altercations, I cannot tell you how scary they are and many times training goes right out the door.  I recommend this not only for women, but for men as well (including myself)  avoid fighting at all costs no matter how much it hurts your pride.  Altercations can turn very bad very fast even for the most experienced martial artist.  Woman must also avoid, especially, all situations that can turn bad such as going out at night.  I would recommend for single women living alone to get a good guard dog and do the research.

    To sum it all up, what they would teach you in most classes would not work in real life and you would put yourself perhaps in more moral danger by the people you would be around taking these classes.

    Offline Traditional Guy 20

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #6 on: July 20, 2012, 11:42:35 PM »
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  • I wouldn't recommend women using their 'strength' against a man. If you must defend yourself please use a gun for your own safety because most of the time the man is much stronger than the woman.

    Hell I don't care for 'martial arts' for men either. A man should learn how to box to defend himself and his woman in my opinion.

    Offline Antony

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #7 on: July 21, 2012, 01:33:57 AM »
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  • One of the reasons I left jui jitsu is because women joined.  What a joke.  99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 percent of the women in the world could not use jiu jitsu for anything against a man no matter if they are a white belt or black.  


    Offline Telesphorus

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #8 on: July 21, 2012, 02:19:27 AM »
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  • Quote from: Antony
    One of the reasons I left jui jitsu is because women joined.  What a joke.  99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 percent of the women in the world could not use jiu jitsu for anything against a man no matter if they are a white belt or black.  


    Anyone remember that episode of Dick Van Dyke show where Mary Tyler Moore learns Judo and flips her husband to the ground.

    What a preposterous storyline!

    TV indoctrination has been going on a long time.


    Offline PenitentWoman

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #9 on: July 21, 2012, 02:25:04 AM »
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  • Where does one purchase pepper spray?
    ~For we are saved by hope. But hope that is seen, is not hope. For what a man seeth, why doth he hope for? But if we hope for that which we see not, we wait for it with patience. ~ Romans 8:24-25

    Offline Telesphorus

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #10 on: July 21, 2012, 02:26:11 AM »
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  • Quote from: PenitentWoman
    Where does one purchase pepper spray?


    A gun shop would be one place.


    Offline PenitentWoman

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #11 on: July 21, 2012, 02:29:06 AM »
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  • Quote from: Telesphorus
    Quote from: PenitentWoman
    Where does one purchase pepper spray?


    A gun shop would be one place.



    Thanks.
    ~For we are saved by hope. But hope that is seen, is not hope. For what a man seeth, why doth he hope for? But if we hope for that which we see not, we wait for it with patience. ~ Romans 8:24-25

    Offline Telesphorus

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #12 on: July 21, 2012, 02:35:32 AM »
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  • Quote
    Though sometimes used interchangeably, pepper spray and Mace are two different chemicals. Mace is a trademarked chemical spray which is made up of CS or CN, both chemicals which cause irritation to the eyes, nose and throat when inhaled. Mace is used by many police and prison officers because it vaporizes slightly and doesn't need to be sprayed right into someone's eyes or mouth to work. It also takes between 5 and 30 seconds to take effect, but the problem with Mace was that it had less of an effect on those under the influence of drugs or alcohol that made them less susceptible to pain. Pepper spray on the other hand is made from Oleoresin Capsicum, or OC, which comes from hot peppers. Pepper spray does need to be applied directly to face, specifically the eyes and mouth, but the effects are involuntary which means they work on everyone starting within 3 seconds of exposure. Pepper srays effects will also wear off in hours, as opposed to Mace which can linger for several days.


    http://voices.yahoo.com/what-mace-does-pepper-spray-work-9124967.html

    Good luck trying to use that on an assailant who has grabbed your arms.or who comes from behind you.

    Offline PenitentWoman

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #13 on: July 21, 2012, 02:49:22 AM »
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  • Quote from: Telesphorus
    Quote
    Though sometimes used interchangeably, pepper spray and Mace are two different chemicals. Mace is a trademarked chemical spray which is made up of CS or CN, both chemicals which cause irritation to the eyes, nose and throat when inhaled. Mace is used by many police and prison officers because it vaporizes slightly and doesn't need to be sprayed right into someone's eyes or mouth to work. It also takes between 5 and 30 seconds to take effect, but the problem with Mace was that it had less of an effect on those under the influence of drugs or alcohol that made them less susceptible to pain. Pepper spray on the other hand is made from Oleoresin Capsicum, or OC, which comes from hot peppers. Pepper spray does need to be applied directly to face, specifically the eyes and mouth, but the effects are involuntary which means they work on everyone starting within 3 seconds of exposure. Pepper srays effects will also wear off in hours, as opposed to Mace which can linger for several days.


    http://voices.yahoo.com/what-mace-does-pepper-spray-work-9124967.html

    Good luck trying to use that on an assailant who has grabbed your arms.or who comes from behind you.


    How reassuring! I'll stick with my rosary, I guess. Haha
    ~For we are saved by hope. But hope that is seen, is not hope. For what a man seeth, why doth he hope for? But if we hope for that which we see not, we wait for it with patience. ~ Romans 8:24-25

    Offline Telesphorus

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    Women and "self-defense" classes.
    « Reply #14 on: July 21, 2012, 02:49:41 AM »
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  • There are many factors that contribute, but the main reason weapons are ineffective is, if the gun, or other device, is not in your hand at the moment of attack, you will never get the chance to use it! Even if you have a stun gun or pepper spray in your purse or pocket, if caught by surprise, you won't have a chance to get it out before you get decked! Mace does you no good if it is still in the purse that just got snatched out of your hand! Tests prove that 90% of the time, you will never get the chance to reach for your weapon before you are hurt too severely to use it.

    . . . .

    Criminals may be dumb, but they’re not stupid.

    Criminals are well aware of the Second Amendment and know that any victim they chose may potentially have a gun. That means they are already one step ahead of you. They already know what to do if you pull out (or even reach for) a weapon, and running away is not always part of their plan.
    FBI statistics and Police reports from all over the country show that in more than half of all instances where the victim was able to get to a "weapon" (usually sprays are mentioned), the attacker knocked it out of their hand before they could use it. Police files are filled with tens of thousands of incidents of weapons taken away from the victim and used against them! It is estimated that almost one third of all gunshot victims are shot with their own gun! The figures are even higher when it comes to stun-guns and sprays.

    This doesn't even include all of the incidences where the victims shoot themselves!


    . . . .


    You may be your own worst enemy

    Accidental discharge is the leading cause of gunshot wounds in both crime and non-crime reports. You may think that wouldn't happen to you, but the reports prove that it happens to even experienced gun owners.
    I know of a Police officer, even after extensive training, the first time he tried to use mace against an unruly suspect, ended up spraying himself.

    Unfortunately, most people have little or no training as to the safe and proper use of the weapons in their possession. What do you think will happen when they attempt to use that weapon under the stress of a real attack? Inadequate, or even improper training is the leading cause of accidental discharge involving guns, stun-guns and sprays.

    There are literally millions of incidents reported where the victim couldn't get the device to work at all, mainly because of inadequate training! Even the most basic principles of weapon usage are often overlooked by owners. The figures are stunning (I couldn't resist the pun) of the number of incidents of stun guns that didn't work when needed because of dead batteries!

    There are thousands upon thousands of reports of guns that wouldn't fire because the "safety" was on, and the user didn't know, forgot, or was too panicked to figure it out in time. In at least one incident I am aware of, the victim couldn't get his weapon to fire before the criminal took it away from him. Lucky for him, the criminal couldn't figure it out either.





    http://www.alljujitsu.com/weapons.html


     

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