Catholic Info
Traditional Catholic Faith => Health and Nutrition => Topic started by: Maria Elizabeth on October 21, 2012, 12:53:12 AM
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Looking for advice.
Several friends have been advocating for a certain length supply of food and emergency supplies lately.
I know that Mormons require that their members to store up one year's supply of food.
What are people on this site doing?
Is it prudent to have a minimum supply of canned and/or stored food? If so, what is the minimum length?
Also, where would you suggest we start looking? There are way too many sites on the internet to know where to begin. Perhaps just stocking up on canned goods?
Thank you for your guidance.
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I have thought about that too.
Beeswax candles....canned beans protein, water . artichokes woiuld be good for vitamin c.
I haven't done any canning but recently sliced up bell peppers and and froze them.
ERic from http://defeatmodernism.com usually has good tips..
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A reliable source of pure water, a source of heat, guns and ammunition should be the first priorities.
After that there are a myriad of long lasting food products. I'd stay away from companies that "specialize" in food storage.
In a truly cataclysmic emergency where people are starving, just having food is not very useful without a way to protect it.
A truly secure dwelling would require a fortified room or "bunker" that you couldn't be smoked or bombed out of very easily, and that would be hard for intruders to even realize was there.
Of course if you're worried about food shortages or rationing, or medical rationing, or something like that, you can always start out by storing plenty of rice, flour, hard tack, dried peas, lentils, beans, canned or bottled meats and fruit, various essential drugs and medical supplies that you can order overseas (poppies are legal to grow and in the case there was an interruption in the supply of necessary pain killers you could conceivably produce your own) you can keep meet frozen, condensed milk, etc.
Really there's no simple solution. Without community and local supply of necessary resources, we're all sitting ducks for a tyrannical government. All they have to do is to cut off fuel and interrrupt transportation and the populace will starve.
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First thing is to make sure you have a 3 days supply of water.
Second obtain a 14 day supply of water. 2L bottles are great, small water bottles are good, stay away from gallons as they leak.
Third obtain a 14 day supply of food that is ready to eat.
Tuna, canned fruit, trail mix, crackers, cereals, pb, thing your family will eat. Work this into your meals so you rotate them. Have days where you prepare all meals from the shelf, without electricity or running water.
After you have those done I would look into long term storage. You can buy #10 cans or 6 gallon buckets with the oxygen removed. Then start to use these foods in your families meals. I can recommend Walton Feed. Sometimes they have groups that buy in an area. Emergency Essentials has low shipping, but you need to order 200 pound minimum I think. LDS Canneries have cheap great prices. If you buy the large bags, you will have to pack it yourself though. You would need a mylar bag, o2 absorber and a six gallon bucket, so remember to add those in the cost.
You may want to invest in an electric wheat grinder to use your store wheat. It takes practice to learn how to bake with whole wheat flour. You can also put whole wheat berries in a crockpot and add a sweetener to them or just add them to meal like stir fry. Start making bean soup one night a week if you don't normally eat beans now.
I love gama seals if you are using 6 gallon buckets.
http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_MS%20L700_A_name_E_GAMMA%20SEAL%E2%84%A2%20Lid%20-%20White
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A reliable source of pure water, a source of heat, guns and ammunition should be the first priorities.
After that there are a myriad of long lasting food products. I'd stay away from companies that "specialize" in food storage.
In a truly cataclysmic emergency where people are starving, just having food is not very useful without a way to protect it.
A truly secure dwelling would require a fortified room or "bunker" that you couldn't be smoked or bombed out of very easily, and that would be hard for intruders to even realize was there.
Of course if you're worried about food shortages or rationing, or medical rationing, or something like that, you can always start out by storing plenty of rice, flour, hard tack, dried peas, lentils, beans, canned or bottled meats and fruit, various essential drugs and medical supplies that you can order overseas (poppies are legal to grow and in the case there was an interruption in the supply of necessary pain killers you could conceivably produce your own) you can keep meet frozen, condensed milk, etc.
Really there's no simple solution. Without community and local supply of necessary resources, we're all sitting ducks for a tyrannical government. All they have to do is to cut off fuel and interrrupt transportation and the populace will starve.
Why do you say stay away from companies that specialize in food storage? I've found the products to be high quality and a relief from my attempts and failures of obtaining certain supplies.
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Is it prudent to have a minimum supply of canned and/or stored food? If so, what is the minimum length?
You always want 72 hours of food (that is ready to eat) and water available. From my experience going though two natural disasters where the power and water were off, I say store enough for 2 weeks.
"They" say 1 gallon of water per person per day, but you need more than that if you want to flush a toliet.
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Why do you say stay away from companies that specialize in food storage? I've found the products to be high quality and a relief from my attempts and failures of obtaining certain supplies.
You seem to know a lot more about it than I do. I'm under the impression a lot of those companies charge a lot.
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If you live in ND and have know a farmer that that will sell you clean wheat for cheap, it's probably a savings to pack it yourself. I've found the food storage companies to be competitive and a good source for clean food and supplies. It depends what you are buying too, freeze dried food is much higher than say grains and legumes. One thing about buying the grains already packed is that it's done properly, there is no learning curve or expensive with a failed DIY. ;) I bought wheat from Walton Feed, but rice I packed myself. So it does not have to be one or the other.
As far as prices go, I would not buy a MRE kit for a year. I think it's important store foods your family will eat and use foods that you have stored. You can start small, buy 50 pounds of beans and 50 pounds of oats and start using them.
I agree with you in case of a real event, it's not going to matter. For natural disasters when you have to hurry up and wait for things to get set up again or just to have some food set aside due to inflation, preparing some can make a difference.
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I have thought about that too.
Beeswax candles....canned beans protein, water . artichokes woiuld be good for vitamin c.
I haven't done any canning but recently sliced up bell peppers and and froze them.
ERic from http://defeatmodernism.com usually has good tips..
Mandarin oranges are available canned and great for Vit C.
Spouts are good too. I have a Mini Sprout Master and love it.
http://www.amazon.com/Sprout-Master-Mini-Triple/dp/B000FK52B2
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Tiffany, have you tried a round tiered sprouter? If so what do you prefer about the one you linked?
I don't have one at the moment but have sprouted a few times from a 2 gallon glass jar. It's takes more effort to keep them from molding so I do want to get an actual sprouter. I've only seen and used the round tiered ones so I am curious if you know of any differences.
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I picked that one because it was small and it had good reviews. It's the only one I have used, so I can't compare! I can say if you have cats, you might want to stick with the jars! :laugh1:
It's sturdier than it looks, part of the plastic was chipped, I thought it would be falling apart within a couple months. I've lost the dividers but I've had it for a few years now.
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There's more on this in The Catholic Bunker section, but:
Start off buying a bit of extra food you already eat with each visit to the store, to not drop a pretty penny all at once. Buy stuff you already use, just a bit extra on each visit, but make sure it's the less perishable stuff (think cans, and peanut butter, then tuna, spam, canned beef, canned green beans, [canned spinach is awful IMO], different beans [beans are a nearly perfect food]). Store amounts based on calories per day/per person-- if you don't actually look at calories and do the multiplication, you'll prepare meals that won't satiate and you will go through your food storage faster than expected.
Buy a *cheap* multivitamin from Wal-mart, your diet will be repetitive and this is better than nothing.
Do not screw around with water. Spend the money. This means, if you don't have well or spring, buy a 50gallon PETE plastic drum (est. 2-3 gallons per family member per day). For water, buy them new (you're not supposed to be able to buy reconditioned drums for potable water, but people will lie what theyre using it for to save 20 bucks. They should be blue. If your municipal water is chlorinated you will not need to add a few tsp of (unscented) bleach (*not* the 'splashless') when you fill the drum, but it won't hurt except to make it taste chlorinated. Don't screw around with a a bunch of water bottles, milk juge, etc. They're not suitable for long term storage, breakdown easily, don't save much money or time versus doing it right, and aren't opaque (usually clear plastic!) so allow light to grow stuff inside the water, and allow things to leach through the plastic, and stack poorly if at all.
Here in everything-overpriced California, such a drum is 40-50 bucks, you will see them cheaper. You'll need a hand siphon pump/bung wrench. Just spend the 10 bucks instead of making things harder on yourself.
Store bleach. It cleans 'stuff', even dishes, of course floors/surfaces and even wounds (ouch), sterilizes things, and can make water potable. Stores well, and is dirt cheap. People don't think about sanitation. Store other cleaning items of course, but bleach is very versatile (and cheap).
Once you got cans of meat and greens (that you will eat) from your regular grocery store, buy canned wheat and other items from the mormons (Deseret store). The price is hard to beat, the quality is great, long shelf life, wheat is versatile.
Often forgotten: get some seasonings and spices, pick up some hot sauce (hot sauce has quite a shelf life!). It will help vary food flavor (did I mention your diet will be repetitive?). Get some Tang for Vit C and to vary your water flavor sometimes.
If you have a cool dry cellar or large pantry, preserve garden grown vegatables, stews, meats, even pasta dishes!: a thousand times more tasty than cans.
Get Spigarelli's book (Crisis Preparedness Handbook) once you've done some basics.
Weapons. Ammo. Lots of light (candles, lamps, survival candles and wicklamps), dynamo/crank LED lights, some NOAA weather and other band radio that cranks, etc. First aid items are a post in themselves. A way to cook besides fuel fires (there are entire sites with solar oven plans you can read for free and you can cook with cardboard and foil or mirrors if you have sun). If you have ample fuel sources fine, but solar ovens are small/light and portable and cleaner (and make no attention-getting smoke!) and easily improvised thus you can make one if you find yourself in unfamiliar or urban surroundings. It's knowledge worth having.
On this last note: I always says the *most* important thing is not 'stuff' but skills, yet people stock up first and defer learning indefinitely. Do not do this. *Learn*
Learn first aid. Learn first aid, but beyond that: military training manuals teach essentially field surgeries. How to deal with infections, set bones, severe burns (you'll need to make field IVs!), growing food, hunting, defense, orienteering/navigation/hiking, sewing and on and on.
Skills are much more important than stuff: Weapons without a marine are useless, a marine without a rifle is still lethal.
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Along the lines of what I posted and another perspective (with overlap), I believe Matthew has posted this link in the past:
http://www.thesurvivalistblog.net/survival-food-storage-walmart/
In a couple months you can buy candles for ridiculously cheap after Christmas, so a good time for getting lots of non-electric lighting cheap is coming.
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Bleach does not store well! It is very important, but it does not store well. It needs to be kept between 50 -70. If you live in the south, homes may get hotter than this.
For bleach kept for emergencies, I would replace it every 6 months. Write the date on the bottle when your purchase it. After the six month mark, donate it to an animal shelter telling them it needs to be used first.
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You may want to invest in an electric wheat grinder to use your store wheat. It takes practice to learn how to bake with whole wheat flour. You can also put whole wheat berries in a crockpot and add a sweetener to them or just add them to meal like stir fry. Start making bean soup one night a week if you don't normally eat beans now.
If the power is out, an electric wheat grinder will do no good at all.
I bought a Country Living Grain Mill about three years ago that is sturdy and hand cranked. It takes a little work, but it turns out a really good flour and you can adjust the fineness of the grind from really fine to coarse meals. It also has the ability to grind larger grains such as corn and coffee beans as well as the small grains.
If you are really good at mechanical things, you can hook it up to a bicycle to turn the flywheel and grind the grain. The web site shows how to do this.
Best of all, it's made in the USA (Washington) by a small company devoted to this one product.
Country Living Grain Mill (http://countrylivinggrainmills.com/)
Oh, they also sell other preparedness products.
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That's a nice looking hand cranked grinder. I have a hand cranked coffee grinder - it does a real good job but it takes a good 5 minutes to grind a drawer full and empty the hopper. Greener beans seem to be grabbed by the blades better though. The lighter and dryer the bean being ground the slower it goes - perhaps they're bouncing off?
Similar to this one, but mine has a wooden bottom and a slightly different top:
http://www.kaboodle.com/reviews/la-pavoni-black-metal-hand-cranked-coffee-grinder
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Bleach does not store well! It is very important, but it does not store well. It needs to be kept between 50 -70. If you live in the south, homes may get hotter than this.
For bleach kept for emergencies, I would replace it every 6 months. Write the date on the bottle when your purchase it. After the six month mark, donate it to an animal shelter telling them it needs to be used first.
Bleach doesn't expire within 6mos, and *all* one's food storage must be kept cool (and dry), so this is a pretty pointless caveat. If where you're storing things is too warm for bleach you have bigger problems like your food.
Also, if it *did* expire in 6most you rotate old out and do laundry with it like you do with your food, eat it before it expires and rotate. *None* of this stuff should sit on a shelf until it expires (the reason the main thrust of my strategy is buying mostly food items you already eat!).
Finally, if it expires, bleach is absurdly cheap.
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You may want to invest in an electric wheat grinder to use your store wheat. It takes practice to learn how to bake with whole wheat flour. You can also put whole wheat berries in a crockpot and add a sweetener to them or just add them to meal like stir fry. Start making bean soup one night a week if you don't normally eat beans now.
If the power is out, an electric wheat grinder will do no good at all.
I bought a Country Living Grain Mill about three years ago that is sturdy and hand cranked. It takes a little work, but it turns out a really good flour and you can adjust the fineness of the grind from really fine to coarse meals. It also has the ability to grind larger grains such as corn and coffee beans as well as the small grains.
If you are really good at mechanical things, you can hook it up to a bicycle to turn the flywheel and grind the grain. The web site shows how to do this.
Best of all, it's made in the USA (Washington) by a small company devoted to this one product.
Country Living Grain Mill (http://countrylivinggrainmills.com/)
Oh, they also sell other preparedness products.
I agree, a manual grinder is good to invest it. I was writing to someone just getting started in food storage there. An electric mill is significantly cheaper and faster, a more practical investment IMO for someone needing to start using wheat they are storing in their diet.
If they had no power, they would also need a non-electric heat source. Needing a manual mill would be for a long term crisis where there is no power, not 3 weeks waiting for power while the national guard is handing out MREs and water.
That is awesome it is made in the USA!
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That's a nice looking hand cranked grinder. I have a hand cranked coffee grinder - it does a real good job but it takes a good 5 minutes to grind a drawer full and empty the hopper. Greener beans seem to be grabbed by the blades better though. The lighter and dryer the bean being ground the slower it goes - perhaps they're bouncing off?
Similar to this one, but mine has a wooden bottom and a slightly different top:
http://www.kaboodle.com/reviews/la-pavoni-black-metal-hand-cranked-coffee-grinder
The Long Winter mentions them grinding wheat in their coffee grinder. They had such a low view of brown bread.
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Bleach has a shelf life of 9 -12 months and for something critical like infection control for the public it is 6 months. I did not say it was not cheap or that we should not rotate it. I said to donate it to an animal shelter after 6 months.
My point was that it does not store well.
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That's a nice looking hand cranked grinder. I have a hand cranked coffee grinder - it does a real good job but it takes a good 5 minutes to grind a drawer full and empty the hopper. Greener beans seem to be grabbed by the blades better though. The lighter and dryer the bean being ground the slower it goes - perhaps they're bouncing off?
Similar to this one, but mine has a wooden bottom and a slightly different top:
http://www.kaboodle.com/reviews/la-pavoni-black-metal-hand-cranked-coffee-grinder
The Long Winter mentions them grinding wheat in their coffee grinder. They had such a low view of brown bread.
Hah, I read all those as a kid. Don't know if they were a good influence or not.
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I think my mother still has the cookbook. At Gibb's Farm, in the Twin Cities, my sister insisted on a green pumpkin. I believe that was in 1982. Then there were popcorn balls made with molasses.
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We have just started doing a few things without costing too much or drawing attention to ourselves.
First we gave our basement a good cleaning and bought some shelves. Whenever I go shopping I pick up a few extra canned goods and some people give us things. I take them to the basement where it is about 65 degrees. I have cans of beans and corn, several large cans of peanut butter, several boxes of pasta. Those really big cans of crisco can be used for candles. Put a string or wick in one and it will burn for 30 to 40 days.
We are currently trying to work out a water supply and some way of getting rid of bodily waste in case we need to stay in our basement for a time.
We have also started collecting anti-biotics. Even expired anti-biotics can be used if necessary.
Also, we have started collecting and printing out manuals for building and repairing things.
Also, every time I take my children to the dentist, I ask for an extra toothbrush and toothpaste sample.
If you have children, you might want to collect extra packages of diapers whether disposable or cloth.
You can also buy large metal cans to store sugar and flour for long periods of time.
Also whiskey, wine, and beer might be useful to keep for consuming and sterilizing.
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We have also started collecting anti-biotics. Even expired anti-biotics can be used if necessary.
You can also buy large metal cans to store sugar and flour for long periods of time.
I need to clean out my medicine cabinet soon. I do it every year but I have been procrastinating because I want to keep some of the meds but don't know how long they keep. Until now I threw out anything expired but I know that isn't necessary with all the meds. I just don't know which keep or for how long. I thought of calling a pharmaceutical company but doubt they would give an honest answer.
Also we got many big glass jars for free for food storage. If you go to a restaurant or bar and ask for their pickle/olive/condiment jars, they may keep them for you once they are empty. We got a dozen of them this way several years ago and I keep corn kernels, legumes, pasta, soup bean mixes in them. It's all stuff we use and rotate. Glass is preferred for food storage because it keeps longer, cleans better and won't leach anything into your food. This was a cheap and easy way to get a hold of some nice jars.
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Haha I just thought of something. Maybe call poison control and say "I just took a 10 year old oxacillin by accident, is it okay?" See what they say.
Not that I'm advocating misusing Poison Control ... ahem.
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Bleach has a shelf life of 9 -12 months and for something critical like infection control for the public it is 6 months. I did not say it was not cheap or that we should not rotate it. I said to donate it to an animal shelter after 6 months.
My point was that it does not store well.
I just wanted to make it clear we're not really saying different things. 6 months is 6 months. You say 'only' 6 months, I think that's a pretty robust and cheap disinfectant.
I just didn't want anyone who is thinking of prepping thinking we are saying different things and thus and if they think that preparing is full of differing opinions on very basic things, that storing bleach is controversial, they are more likely to do *nothing*. Be careful when you pick nits like that. I'd rather have folks do something imperfect than nothing, and you're not going to find something as versatile as bleach that I can think of that will keep longer. Ammonia isn't potable, etc. Iodine isn't as cheap per ounce and doesn't do laundry etc.
Thumbs up.
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Haha I just thought of something. Maybe call poison control and say "I just took a 10 year old oxacillin by accident, is it okay?" See what they say.
Not that I'm advocating misusing Poison Control ... ahem.
Drugs last a very long time.
Here's an article for you. These drugs were 40 or 50 years old and were still effective. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/09/expired-medications-drugs-potency-effective_n_1949481.html)
I have NEVER thrown away expired meds. It didn't make sense to me that these pills would just loose their effectiveness. They are not like milk or cheese.
Save everything. Don't throw it away. Even if it is only half as effective, it's still better than nothing.
Big Pharma is making a killing.
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Bleach has a shelf life of 9 -12 months and for something critical like infection control for the public it is 6 months. I did not say it was not cheap or that we should not rotate it. I said to donate it to an animal shelter after 6 months.
My point was that it does not store well.
I just wanted to make it clear we're not really saying different things. 6 months is 6 months. You say 'only' 6 months, I think that's a pretty robust and cheap disinfectant.
I just didn't want anyone who is thinking of prepping thinking we are saying different things and thus and if they think that preparing is full of differing opinions on very basic things, that storing bleach is controversial, they are more likely to do *nothing*. Be careful when you pick nits like that. I'd rather have folks do something imperfect than nothing, and you're not going to find something as versatile as bleach that I can think of that will keep longer. Ammonia isn't potable, etc. Iodine isn't as cheap per ounce and doesn't do laundry etc.
Thumbs up.
If a person is unsure of bleach, white distilled vinegar is a powerful disinfectant and does everything from laundry to countertops to toilets.
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Haha I just thought of something. Maybe call poison control and say "I just took a 10 year old oxacillin by accident, is it okay?" See what they say.
Not that I'm advocating misusing Poison Control ... ahem.
Drugs last a very long time.
Here's an article for you. These drugs were 40 or 50 years old and were still effective. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/09/expired-medications-drugs-potency-effective_n_1949481.html)
I have NEVER thrown away expired meds. It didn't make sense to me that these pills would just loose their effectiveness. They are not like milk or cheese.
Save everything. Don't throw it away. Even if it is only half as effective, it's still better than nothing.
Big Pharma is making a killing.
Thank you for the article! I was hoping you (or someone) would have a resource.
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It's not that simple, there are meds that aren't as stable and not only become ineffective, but some even degrade into very dangerous toxic substances.
If you don't know which ones, then don't keep old meds around.
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We have just started doing a few things without costing too much or drawing attention to ourselves.
First we gave our basement a good cleaning and bought some shelves. Whenever I go shopping I pick up a few extra canned goods and some people give us things. I take them to the basement where it is about 65 degrees. I have cans of beans and corn, several large cans of peanut butter, several boxes of pasta. Those really big cans of crisco can be used for candles. Put a string or wick in one and it will burn for 30 to 40 days.
We are currently trying to work out a water supply and some way of getting rid of bodily waste in case we need to stay in our basement for a time.
We have also started collecting anti-biotics. Even expired anti-biotics can be used if necessary.
Also, we have started collecting and printing out manuals for building and repairing things.
Also, every time I take my children to the dentist, I ask for an extra toothbrush and toothpaste sample.
If you have children, you might want to collect extra packages of diapers whether disposable or cloth.
You can also buy large metal cans to store sugar and flour for long periods of time.
Also whiskey, wine, and beer might be useful to keep for consuming and sterilizing.
We have a camping toilet for waste containment that we bought in the local Wal-Mart type of store. (We are "luxury" campers. I have to have a potty. :smile:)
I've also seen non-electric composting toilets advertised, but don't know much about them, other than they look interesting.
As for beer, wine, etc., someone suggested it might be good to have items like these (cigarettes too) on hand, for trading purposes. (We don't use these items, so I'm not sure of their storage requirements.)