Author Topic: Voting  (Read 721 times)

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Offline Conspiracy_Factist

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« on: March 13, 2014, 09:36:13 PM »
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  • I don't vote, I don't believe it's catholic of us to vote for non Catholics, I know I read it from some saint but can't remember..now the situation in Quebec Canada is that the pary which is in power is a minority , they are having another vote soon and besides the fact they want to separate from Canada, they are proposing a law that would restrict religious freedom, it would attack all religions which including Christians if working for the gov't for example  wouldn't be allowed to wear crosses over a certain size for starters......do I stay steadfast and continue to refuse to vote or is this grounds for actually voting ?

    Offline Frances

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    « Reply #1 on: March 14, 2014, 03:03:50 AM »
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  •  :dancing-banana:
    Perspective of a jaded New Yorker!  Go and vote AGAINST evil, but recognise your vote won't make any difference.  God is giving us the laws we deserve for our collective sins.  Pray for the strength to stand up, not by voting, but by doing what is right.  Be willing to get fired for the Faith.  But choose your battles.  Our Lord requires His Honour upheld for the good of souls.  For most Catholics, He doesn't require us to wear a huge Crucifix. You can do your job and be openly  Catholic while wearing a small Crucifix.  Should the govt. forbid you to wear ANY outward sign of the Faith while accommodating, say, a Sikh's headgear, then stand up, even if you lose your job.  
    Many years ago, I walked out of a public school where I'd been hired as a substitute for the day when the principal ordered me to hide or remove the small Cross I wore on a necklace because it "offended" the co-teacher who wore a crocheted yarmulke!  Supposedly, the Cross was "obviously religious" whereas the kippah was not!  Now, of course, neither of us would be allowed on the premises with either item showing.
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  


    Offline poche

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    « Reply #2 on: March 14, 2014, 04:30:04 AM »
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  • If all the Christians refuse to vote then that type of law could be promulgated.

    Offline Conspiracy_Factist

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    « Reply #3 on: March 27, 2014, 06:31:54 PM »
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  • Quote from: poche
    If all the Christians refuse to vote then that type of law could be promulgated.

    Why is voting obligatory?

    “It is the duty of citizens to contribute along with the civil authorities to the good of society….”(2) As the Second Vatican Council taught, “every citizen ought to be mindful of his duty to promote the common good by using his vote.”(3) We are not obliged to vote for the sake of voting but to vote in a way that we think will make our country better for all Canadians.

    I guess if vatican 2 says to vote I better do the opposite?






    What if I cannot find a suitable candidate?

    While it is always wrong to ‘do evil that good may come of it’ (Cf. Rom 3:8) – and therefore wrong to support a candidate who fails to uphold the right to life and the good of marriage and the family – it is not wrong to limit evil that good may come of it. That is, we cannot do something wrong just because it may lead to a good outcome, but we can work to limit something wrong being done in order to lead to a good outcome.

    Thus, if no candidate upholds the right to life and the rights of the family, we can still exercise our responsibility to vote. We can vote for the candidate who is the least hostile to the right to life and to the family – and limit the harm that worse candidates might do.

    In the words of one theologian, “At times, the voter can do no better than make a choice of the lesser of two or more evils…. He must choose the group or individual who, everything considered, is the most favourable to faith and morals or is the least hostile.”(13)

    To quote another theologian, “It is sinful to vote for the enemies of religion or liberty, except to exclude a worse candidate….”(14)

    When no truly good option is given to voters, we are then forced to use our vote to ensure the least objectionable outcome.

    Offline poche

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    « Reply #4 on: March 27, 2014, 10:47:04 PM »
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  • “It is the duty of citizens to contribute along with the civil authorities to the good of society….”(2) As the Second Vatican Council taught, “every citizen ought to be mindful of his duty to promote the common good by using his vote.”(3) We are not obliged to vote for the sake of voting but to vote in a way that we think will make our country better for all Canadians.

    In a democratic society part of the contribution to te good of society is to vote on the day of elections. I would reccommend that you pay close attention to what is being said and done so that you can choose the best of the candidates who are running for office.


    Offline poche

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    « Reply #5 on: March 27, 2014, 10:48:10 PM »
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  • What if I cannot find a suitable candidate?

    Sometimes we have to choose the lesser of two evils.

    Offline Conspiracy_Factist

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    « Reply #6 on: March 27, 2014, 11:01:18 PM »
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  • Quote from: poche
    What if I cannot find a suitable candidate?

    Sometimes we have to choose the lesser of two evils.

    sometimes? but are you sure? if I have to vote between satan and lucipher I'd rather pass, you are aware the whole political system is rigged? can you tell me who the last person you voted for was? most politicians have been corrupted , I believe there is more harm done to our souls by voting within this satanic system than to abstain.

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    « Reply #7 on: March 27, 2014, 11:18:16 PM »
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  • .

    The second Vatican council didn't teach anything, poche.  Get over it.  


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    Offline poche

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    « Reply #8 on: March 28, 2014, 05:07:04 AM »
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  • Quote from: Neil Obstat
    .

    The second Vatican council didn't teach anything, poche.  Get over it.  


    .

    It wasn't an issue that Vatican 2 said it. I think it is a matter of natural law and prudence.  

    Offline TKGS

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    « Reply #9 on: March 28, 2014, 07:11:35 AM »
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  • I do believe that Catholics may vote in American elections as long as they vote for the least objectionable candidates.

    The problem is often that there are no least objectionable candidates.  Here in Indiana, the people gave the Republican Party a super-majority in the both houses of the State Legislature in the last election with the understanding that they would accomplish all the things they promised to do since the opposition party could not actually stop any legislative proceeding.  The legislative session ended without any of their signature issues being passed and at least on signature issue of the Democrat Party passing with "bi-partisan" support.

    The same seems (to me, at least) to be true for the consolidated legislature (i.e., the U.S. Congress) as well.  I really don't see much of a point in worrying about voting since the two parties that have essentially locked out any competition aren't really opposition parties but merely factions of the same party who have the same goals, just different ideas about how to achieve them.

    The only reason that I can think of to vote in the future is to vote against retaining local judges and against ballot referenda that frequently appear on the ballots to raise my taxes.

    Offline glaston

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    « Reply #10 on: March 28, 2014, 07:58:22 AM »
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  • Quote from: gooch
    Quote from: poche
    If all the Christians refuse to vote then that type of law could be promulgated.

    Why is voting obligatory?

    “It is the duty of citizens to contribute along with the civil authorities to the good of society….”(2) As the Second Vatican Council taught, “every citizen ought to be mindful of his duty to promote the common good by using his vote.”


    Doing things "FOR THE COMMON GOOD"
    - is a 'flag' expression for the N.W.O. commissars!

    Just saying like - be careful.


    Offline BTNYC

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    « Reply #11 on: March 28, 2014, 03:09:14 PM »
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  • Cast your vote, Catholics! Will it be for the pro-baby murder, pro-sodomy, crypto-communist candidate in the pocket of the Internationalists, or for the pro-usury, pro-sham war, crypto-zionist candidate in the pocket of the Internationalists?

    Which of those is the vote "against the greater evil," exactly?

    From where I'm standing, not voting at all is the only "lesser evil" for a Catholic voter.

    Offline Conspiracy_Factist

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    « Reply #12 on: March 28, 2014, 11:07:03 PM »
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  • Quote from: BTNYC
    Cast your vote, Catholics! Will it be for the pro-baby murder, pro-sodomy, crypto-communist candidate in the pocket of the Internationalists, or for the pro-usury, pro-sham war, crypto-zionist candidate in the pocket of the Internationalists?

    Which of those is the vote "against the greater evil," exactly?

    From where I'm standing, not voting at all is the only "lesser evil" for a Catholic voter.

    here here , how can anyone argue against the truth you speak here !

    Offline Ambrose

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    « Reply #13 on: March 29, 2014, 12:07:27 AM »
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  • Quote from: BTNYC
    Cast your vote, Catholics! Will it be for the pro-baby murder, pro-sodomy, crypto-communist candidate in the pocket of the Internationalists, or for the pro-usury, pro-sham war, crypto-zionist candidate in the pocket of the Internationalists?

    Which of those is the vote "against the greater evil," exactly?

    From where I'm standing, not voting at all is the only "lesser evil" for a Catholic voter.


    Judgments for who to vote for must be on a case by case basis.  If a Catholic determines that there is no worthy candidate, he may based on the evidence available to him vote for the candidate who will cause less evil.

    I agree with you that this is getting more difficult to do in many elections, but I think that some elections in the US have candidates of greater evil and some who are less evil in their programs.  

    A Catholic should carefully follow state and national politics to determine if there are any worthy candidates, and if not, to make a determination if he should still vote to block a greater evil.
    The Council of Trent, The Catechism of the Council of Trent, Papal Teaching, The Teaching of the Holy Office, The Teaching of the Church Fathers, The Code of Canon Law, Countless approved catechisms, The Doctors of the Church, The teaching of the Dogmatic

    Offline poche

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    « Reply #14 on: March 29, 2014, 12:41:18 AM »
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  • Quote from: glaston
    Quote from: gooch
    Quote from: poche
    If all the Christians refuse to vote then that type of law could be promulgated.

    Why is voting obligatory?

    “It is the duty of citizens to contribute along with the civil authorities to the good of society….”(2) As the Second Vatican Council taught, “every citizen ought to be mindful of his duty to promote the common good by using his vote.”


    Doing things "FOR THE COMMON GOOD"
    - is a 'flag' expression for the N.W.O. commissars!

    Just saying like - be careful.

    For the "common good" is a flag expression that comes from Rerum Novarum, written by Pope Leo XIII.

     

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