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Offline Mercyandjustice

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Venerating "heretical" saints
« on: March 11, 2018, 06:35:43 PM »
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  • Why does/did the Roman Church allow Uniate churches (previously Orthodox Churches who came into communion with Rome) to keep their saints? Even 'problematic' ones like St. Photius, St. Mark of Ephesus, St. Gregory Palamas, etc.

    Also, if an Orthodox Church, like, say, the Russian Orthodox Church were to come into communion with Rome today, would they have to drop their saints who lived and died after the schism?

    Christians who preach their doctrine with bitterness and sarcasm don't preach out of love for God or souls, but only to assert dominance over others; out of pride.

    Offline Mercyandjustice

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    Re: Venerating "heretical" saints
    « Reply #1 on: March 13, 2018, 03:33:54 AM »
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  • I just realized that venerating "heretical" saints or heterodox saints probably isn't a big deal. Some Church fathers that we venerate seemed to hold heterodox views, like apocatastasis, millenarianism, etc.
    Christians who preach their doctrine with bitterness and sarcasm don't preach out of love for God or souls, but only to assert dominance over others; out of pride.


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Venerating "heretical" saints
    « Reply #2 on: March 13, 2018, 08:42:51 AM »
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  • It's possible for even a saint to embrace error ... without any compromise to their sanctity.  Several Church Fathers held errors that were LATER condemned by the Church.  Some of the "Fathers" who held grave errors or even became schismatic are NOT venerated as saints (Origen and Tertullian come to mind).

    Those, however, who were formally outside the Church can never be acknowledged by the Church as saints.  Infallibility regarding canonizations does not apply to those who are venerated locally or by particular churches, but only those who have been put forward for universal veneration formally by the Church.

    Offline Student of Qi

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    Re: Venerating "heretical" saints
    « Reply #3 on: March 13, 2018, 11:52:14 AM »
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  • Why does/did the Roman Church allow Uniate churches (previously Orthodox Churches who came into communion with Rome) to keep their saints? Even 'problematic' ones like St. Photius, St. Mark of Ephesus, St. Gregory Palamas, etc.

    Also, if an Orthodox Church, like, say, the Russian Orthodox Church were to come into communion with Rome today, would they have to drop their saints who lived and died after the schism?
    I think the answer to this question is that yes, the Eastern Rites keep their Saints and devotions to them. The Roman Church probably doesn't have enough cause against certain Eastern saints anyways because some of them are incorrupt. The Russians up to the 1700s believed to be called "Saint" you HAD to be incorrupt. Even up to the 1900s there were and are incorrupt Eastern Saints. If I had to name at least one from the 1900s, I think his name was "Kalymnos the New". When he was exhumed from his grave on an island in Greece, they opened hus coffin to find him incorrupt and it is said the whole island smelled of roses. He was exhumed because he kept appearing to a nun and to the local bishop telling them to do so.

    A couple of years ago, Pope Francis Canonized a fellow from the Romanian Church. But, that story needs some explaination, because not all of tgem were monophysite, and our churches have continually had on and off communion/relations.

    http://www.catholicworldreport.com/2015/02/26/st-gregory-of-narek-was-the-new-doctor-of-the-church-a-catholic/
    Many people say "For the Honor and Glory of God!" but, what they should say is "For the Love, Glory and Honor of God". - Fr. Paul of Moll

    Offline MiserereMeiDeus

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    Re: Venerating "heretical" saints
    « Reply #4 on: March 13, 2018, 06:11:10 PM »
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  • I don't consider Newchurch "canonizations" as necessarily valid; in fact, I tend to be pretty suspicious of them. More and more they seem to be agenda-driven. there are some like Padre Pio and Edmund Campion that I have no problem with, but that's despite their Conciliar seal of approval.
    "Jesus was the fruit of Mary, as Elizabeth expressed it: 'Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb.' Whoever wishes for the fruit, must go to the tree; whoever wishes for Jesus must go to Mary; and he who finds Mary, also certain


     

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