Author Topic: Vatican Gives Approval for Chinese Commie Bishops Ordination (Read 839 times)

nadieimportante · « **on:** December 01, 2011, 06:46:44 AM »

from: http://www.thechurchreport.com/index.cfm?objectID=144243]

Vatican Gives Approval for Chinese Bishop's Ordination

The Vatican gave its approval on Monday for the ordination of a Chinese bishop in a conciliatory gesture to China's official church but called on "illegitimate" bishops not to attend the rite.

Pietro Luo Xuegang, 47, who built his career within the Chinese Patriotic Catholic Association (CPCA) -- China's official church, will be ordained as bishop in Yibin in Southeast China on Wednesday.

Vatican spokesman Federico Lombardi said Luo Xuegang was "approved by the Holy See" and hopes "no illegitimate bishop will participate at the ceremony".

"In that case, the event would be an encouragement for the Catholic community," he said.

But according to the Catholic news agency Asianews, the bishop of Leshan, Paolo Lei Shiyin -- who was excommunicated by the Vatican in June -- is likely to attend the ceremony.

The Vatican and the CPCA have been locked in a bitter struggle in recent months over control of China's Catholics, caught between allegiance to the official church, or to the pope as part of an "underground" Church.

While official statistics put the number of Catholics in China at 5.7 million, independent sources say it is closer to 12 million.

The CPCA's ordination of a bishop last November without the Vatican's permission riled Rome, and the forced participation of a number of bishops at assemblies organised by the official church strained tensions further.

Though difficulties persist -- in May Benedict XVI accused the country's communist authorities of pressuring Chinese bishops into separating from the Holy See -- relations between the two institutions could now be thawing.

In 2007, the pope called for "reconciliation" between the two churches.

Up until late 2010, Rome had backed the ordination of bishops nominated by the official church as long as they recognise the pope's authority -- just as it has done for the upcoming ordination this week. (AFP)

nadieimportante · « **Reply #1 on:** December 01, 2011, 06:53:46 AM »

What does this say about how special the attempt is for Rome wanting to bring the SSPX into it's fold? They accept Communist China false church bishops?
Then they tell the REAL Catholic underground Church, it's martyrs, and faithful that have been keeping the faith all these years, they tell them it's OK to join the communist church?

Quote

In 2007, the pope called for "reconciliation" between the two churches.

This takes the cake!

nadieimportante · « **Reply #2 on:** December 01, 2011, 07:01:42 AM »

Here's a better link, the other that I posted does not work:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jwRW0ZrclV6b1cTxmKS4wQiKRS_w?docId=CNG.b3f711e12539c6d91997e2a387ffbd8c.271

pax · « **Reply #3 on:** December 01, 2011, 07:18:15 AM »

Of course, if you look for the worse possible thing you will always find it whether it is there or not.

Not only does the Pope wish to extend salvation to those poor misguided souls in the official church, but he would even extend it to you, as well.

nadieimportante · « **Reply #4 on:** December 01, 2011, 07:23:53 AM »

Quote from: pax

Of course, if you look for the worse possible thing you will always find it whether it is there or not.

Not only does the Pope wish to extend salvation to those poor misguided souls in the official church, but he would even extend it to you, as well.

The Chinese Communist church is schismatic, it was set up by the commies as a fake church to draw Catholics, it's a farse, and was excommunicated by Pius XII.

This is analogous to the pope approving the ordination of Lutheran or Anglican bishops, and telling Catholics in England and Germany that it's OK to become a Lutheran.

pax · « **Reply #5 on:** December 01, 2011, 08:32:13 AM »

Quote from: nadieimportante

Quote from: pax
Of course, if you look for the worse possible thing you will always find it whether it is there or not.

Not only does the Pope wish to extend salvation to those poor misguided souls in the official church, but he would even extend it to you, as well.

The Chinese Communist church is schismatic, it was set up by the commies as a fake church to draw Catholics, it's a farse, and was excommunicated by Pius XII.

This is analogous to the pope approving the ordination of Lutheran or Anglican bishops, and telling Catholics in England and Germany that it's OK to become a Lutheran.

The Pope did not say it was ok to be a bishop of the state-run church. He is trying to bring all those in the state-run church into the Catholic Church. Something like how we fought so hard to bring the Donatists back into the Fold.

Besides, your analogy doesn't work. Those in the state-run church are drawn to the Catholic Faith, but have many obstacles put in their way by the state. Those in the Lutheran and Anglican communions are not drawn to the Catholic Faith, nor does the state put any obstacles in their way.

The closer analogy would be a Lutheran or Anglican minister converting to the one true Faith and then asking to be ordained into the true and perfect priesthood.

nadieimportante · « **Reply #6 on:** December 01, 2011, 12:30:19 PM »

Quote

The Pope did not say it was ok to be a bishop of the state-run church.

The pope gave his OK to a priest of the Chinese communist church to be made a bishop in the communist church. What bigger OK is there than that?

Quote

He is trying to bring all those in the state-run church into the Catholic Church. Something like how we fought so hard to bring the Donatists back into the Fold.

It's the other way around. The real Catholic underground Church is illegal in China. What he is trying to do is bring the real Cathiolic underground Church into the false excommunicated by Pius XII, schismatic Communist church.

pax · « **Reply #7 on:** December 01, 2011, 12:46:00 PM »

Quote from: nadieimportante

Quote
The Pope did not say it was ok to be a bishop of the state-run church.

The pope gave his OK to a priest of the Chinese communist church to be made a bishop in the communist church. What bigger OK is there than that?

Quote
He is trying to bring all those in the state-run church into the Catholic Church. Something like how we fought so hard to bring the Donatists back into the Fold.

It's the other way around. The real Catholic underground Church is illegal in China. What he is trying to do is bring the real Cathiolic underground Church into the false excommunicated by Pius XII, schismatic Communist church.

Quote

Up until late 2010, Rome had backed the ordination of bishops nominated by the official church as long as they recognise the pope's authority -- just as it has done for the upcoming ordination this week. (AFP)

Does it not occur to you that perhaps we are on the verge of a breakthrough here? Is it not possible that the Chinese government is now starting to promote candidates for bishop who do indeed recognize the authority of the Pope? Does that not sound like maybe it could be a good thing?

nadieimportante · « **Reply #8 on:** December 01, 2011, 01:56:46 PM »

Quote from: pax

Quote from: nadieimportante
Quote
The Pope did not say it was ok to be a bishop of the state-run church.

The pope gave his OK to a priest of the Chinese communist church to be made a bishop in the communist church. What bigger OK is there than that?

Quote
He is trying to bring all those in the state-run church into the Catholic Church. Something like how we fought so hard to bring the Donatists back into the Fold.

It's the other way around. The real Catholic underground Church is illegal in China. What he is trying to do is bring the real Cathiolic underground Church into the false excommunicated by Pius XII, schismatic Communist church.

Quote
Up until late 2010, Rome had backed the ordination of bishops nominated by the official church as long as they recognise the pope's authority -- just as it has done for the upcoming ordination this week. (AFP)

Does it not occur to you that perhaps we are on the verge of a breakthrough here? Is it not possible that the Chinese government is now starting to promote candidates for bishop who do indeed recognize the authority of the Pope? Does that not sound like maybe it could be a good thing?

re: Is it not possible that the Chinese government is now starting to promote candidates for bishop who do indeed recognize the authority of the Pope?

No it isn't, and the Chinese underground Church is keeping away. They're no fools. This is just a ploy by the governent to eliminate the underground Church. What's it take for a person to say they recognize the pope? It costs the Chicoms nothing.

I lost my country to the commies, I know their tactics. The underground Church knows more than me. The pope is either a naive fool, or he's in on the fix.

pax · « **Reply #9 on:** December 01, 2011, 02:12:37 PM »

Quote from: nadieimportante

Quote from: pax
Quote from: nadieimportante
Quote
The Pope did not say it was ok to be a bishop of the state-run church.

The pope gave his OK to a priest of the Chinese communist church to be made a bishop in the communist church. What bigger OK is there than that?

Quote
He is trying to bring all those in the state-run church into the Catholic Church. Something like how we fought so hard to bring the Donatists back into the Fold.

It's the other way around. The real Catholic underground Church is illegal in China. What he is trying to do is bring the real Cathiolic underground Church into the false excommunicated by Pius XII, schismatic Communist church.

Quote
Up until late 2010, Rome had backed the ordination of bishops nominated by the official church as long as they recognise the pope's authority -- just as it has done for the upcoming ordination this week. (AFP)

Does it not occur to you that perhaps we are on the verge of a breakthrough here? Is it not possible that the Chinese government is now starting to promote candidates for bishop who do indeed recognize the authority of the Pope? Does that not sound like maybe it could be a good thing?

re: Is it not possible that the Chinese government is now starting to promote candidates for bishop who do indeed recognize the authority of the Pope?

No it isn't, and the Chinese underground Church is keeping away. They're no fools. This is just a ploy by the governent to eliminate the underground Church. What's it take for a person to say they recognize the pope? It costs the Chicoms nothing.

I lost my country to the commies, I know their tactics. The underground Church knows more than me. The pope is either a naive fool, or he's in on the fix.

Then Christian charity demands you consider him a naive fool.

Nut there is also the possibility that he knows more than you do about the situation.

nadieimportante · « **Reply #10 on:** December 01, 2011, 05:17:07 PM »

Quote

Then Christian charity demands you consider him a naive fool.

Good advise. You learn something every day!

Reminds me of what Father Gommar A. De Pauw, the leader of the Catholic Traditionalist Movement, once said to his bishop , after the bishop told him to do something ridiculous. Fr. De Pauw said, in his strong Belgian accent:

You'll pardon me your emminence, but you've either lost your fait (faith), or you've lost your marbles."

Vladimir · « **Reply #11 on:** December 01, 2011, 06:31:14 PM »

Quote from: pax

Then Christian charity demands ...

That we don't trust Communists dogs like the Chinese.

The Chinese have always been conniving and deceitful.

Even the Chinese don't believe a word that comes out of Bei-jing.

Roman Catholic · « **Reply #12 on:** December 01, 2011, 07:55:31 PM »

Athiestic Communism is still ... Athiestic Communism.

Athiestic Communists are still ... Athiestic Communists.

They are Godless barbarians.

Sometimes they dress in suits.

Sometimes they smile and act charming.

Sometimes they say things that seem appealing.

They are still Godless barbarians, with a long-term goal of domination, terror, and Godlessness.